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21-09-2005
  46
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Tushka_BeLLa's Avatar
 
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Fashion will never cease to excite me. However, I feel stuck in the boring slump of New York and London fashion week. Bring on Milan and Paris!!! Of course South African Fashion Week remains as gorgeous and eclectic as ever....and will never cease to amaze me with new ideas and concepts .... the French are just French..The Italians are just Italian ... but there is something about an African and Indian and South African street culture .... this cultural mix spurned into fashion - that makes it so exciting. It is especially interesting to watch fashion develop in a developing country.

Just my two cents. I'm such a proud citizen.....hehe.

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21-09-2005
  47
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Wait a sec...people are talking about different things here. Zazie and others are discussing clothes as a form of expression, others are discussing the fashion *industry*.

I agree with you, Zazie, totally. I just think the fashion **industry** is, like Faust says, in a sort of tiresome bubble. For better or for worse, it will eventually burst, hopefully leaving the best to survive, and then we will move forward.

For inspiration, I no longer look at magazines or even most boutiques except the really interesting ones, and focus on things that really move me: music, art, literature, nature. Fashion comes from within---not the market.

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21-09-2005
  48
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it's not boring, there's just a lot of ridiculously bad crap out there that's clouding your judgement.



i'm serious though.

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21-09-2005
  49
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Right on, Olivia, Bella, Melisande..I think fashion is revolting (and I don't mean the latest Basso and Brooks...) - the cries for an end to the same old pandering to the highest common denominator are loud and clear and when the NYTimes reports it, it's officially a TREND itself.

I fear websites and blogs are threatening the centralised dissemination of fashion, and the very heart of the fashion elites themselves, as opinion leaders can now be openly challenged, and it can be pointed out that this emperor has no clothes.

As individuals, we can always find our own internal space for all that thrills us in life, including the fashion in which we all express ourselves, no matter how awful the system has become.

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21-09-2005
  50
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non non non non...............people here are not discussing
they are competing who is the most well-said.....haha

post a professional-like comment and come back later to check whether others were impressed.

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21-09-2005
  51
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^That's too funny

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21-09-2005
  52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost
non non non non...............people here are not discussing
they are competing who is the most well-said.....haha

post a professional-like comment and come back later to check whether others were impressed.
Gee, I wonder if you are too smart or too stupid to make such a statement. Why don't you start us off with "a professional-like" comment, so we can find out, Suzy?

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21-09-2005
  53
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I think fashion has reached it's commercial stage and that makes everything taste a bit bland because the money rules and the creativity becomes secondary. It's the same thing that went on in the music business. Conglomerates taking an interest in a profitable industry and buying up ever hot brand in sight. It scares me when I'm reading that LVMH as listed 2007 as the breakeven point for Alexander McQueen and Stella McCartney. I understand that as a business you have to recoup your investment, but just imagine the pressure on the designer (do I make clothes that will ensure that I meet the requirement or do I stick to what I want to design and perhaps lose my financial backing?)

I agree with whomever said that designers are playing it safe. Many designers seem to be going for the lowest common denominator in order to appeal to the most amount of people. Those designers aren't trying to set any trends or define any moment, they are just trying to make the numbers. It's becoming pop music. But just like in the music industry the real creative people will decide that they don't need the huge companies in order to be successful and refuse to be reduced to bottom lines and will decide to go back to the way it all started...independently with their art being most important.

It's funny how this all comes of the heels of NY Fashion Week which is basically a joke at this point. NYFW has become this huge NY event instead of a showing of collections for the next season. It's too much about sponsors, the partners, celebrities, all kinds of everything being shoved in your face and not enough about the clothes.

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21-09-2005
  54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost
non non non non...............people here are not discussing
they are competing who is the most well-said.....haha

post a professional-like comment and come back later to check whether others were impressed.
Well spotted! This thread has lost its, ahem, thread. We're all talking about different things. It seems clear to me that the original idea was about the fashion industry, fashion brands etc, so there's no point in going on about fashion never being boring then saying that fashion is revolting. It makes no sense, sicne there are two different things being discussed both being given the same label.

Anyway what do you think ghost, smarty-pants?

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21-09-2005
  55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost
non non non non...............people here are not discussing
they are competing who is the most well-said.....haha

post a professional-like comment and come back later to check whether others were impressed.
Ok, Congratulations, you win! You're the most well-said.

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21-09-2005
  56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny
Well spotted! This thread has lost its, ahem, thread. We're all talking about different things. It seems clear to me that the original idea was about the fashion industry, fashion brands etc, so there's no point in going on about fashion never being boring then saying that fashion is revolting. It makes no sense, sicne there are two different things being discussed both being given the same label.

Anyway what do you think ghost, smarty-pants?
Well, when the designer loses his individuality to the fashion industry, to the reviews by editors, to the huge marketing machine, that's what's wrong with the system, it's no longer about the creativity of one talented dude. And if we all buy because of the fashion industry, the reviews, the advertising, etc. ad nauseum, there's no point in any designer exercising individual creativity is there?

If the NYTimes is writing about it (the article I posted about Wintour and the one about webblogs), it's obviously not a fringe phenomenon, but possibly a revolt stirring against this.

Both ends have to be addressed, the talented designer emboldened to make or break it, editors be damned and the fashion watchers setting up alternative information structures to judge them on their merits instead of slavishly following the fashion elites.

I presume many posters here work in the fashion industry, and are buyers with substantial knowledge, who knows what they might decide from here and how that might change things?

I don't see how you can separate the fashion industry as a sort of untouchable ivory tower, while ignoring the potential of serious changes in the market (i.e. us and the way we access information and make judgement) which the industry feeds on.


Last edited by Zazie; 21-09-2005 at 12:01 PM.
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21-09-2005
  57
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I think fashion is boring for people who allow what they call "fashion" to be served to them via Vogue or the latest display at the mall. There are alot of exciting designers out there doing fantastic things. With a little but of intiative you can enjoy them as well.

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21-09-2005
  58
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I'm off to bed. And no, not interested in coming back and checking your response. I was being f*cking sincere, in reminding everyone that they just need to look at themselves, to remember *what they first love about fashion*, to be aware of what they are doing here on tfs in expressing opinions, to know that this isn't some juggernaut that those of us who are disgusted with it are powerless to change.

Exit stage left.

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21-09-2005
  59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zazie
Well, when the designer loses his individuality to the fashion industry, to the reviews by editors, to the huge marketing machine, that's what's wrong with the system, it's no longer about the creativity of one talented dude. And if we all buy because of the fashion industry, the reviews, the advertising, etc. ad nauseum, there's no point in any designer exercising individual creativity is there?

If the NYTimes is writing about it (the article I posted about Wintour and the one about webblogs), it's obviously not a fringe phenomenon, but possibly a revolt stirring against this.

Both ends have to be addressed, the talented designer emboldened to make or break it, editors be damned and the fashion watchers setting up alternative information structures to judge them on their merits instead of slavishly following the fashion elites.

I presume many posters here work in the fashion industry, and are buyers with substantial knowledge, who knows what they might decide from here and how that might change things?

I don't see how you can separate the fashion industry as a sort of untouchable ivory tower, while ignoring the potential of serious changes in the market (i.e. us and the way we access information and make judgement) which the industry feeds on.
I haven't a clue what you're on about in most of that post, maybe I'm missing something. In fact, I think you certainly cannot separate the fashion industry form the designers; I think quite the opposite. What I'm saying and what I think is that fashion as a whole is less interesting than it used to be, at least for me, because of oversaturation and overavailability. There are obviously elements of it that I like - in other words, the two or three designers that interest me - but that doesn't mean that, on the whole, the industry is not dull. It is. When we talk about fashion we must be talking about the whole industry not just the bits of it we like, otherwise you can't have a discussion, since everything can be reduced to the subjective. And on the whole, I don't like it as much as I used. I don't still have the same bug as I did when in fact I couldn't really afford it. Democratisation of fashion is over-rated. It results in countless fat wee girls on the high street wearing Joss Stone-a-like outfits with peasant skirts and thick brown belts with jeweled buckles.

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21-09-2005
  60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zazie
I'm off to bed. And no, not interested in coming back and checking your response. I was being f*cking sincere, in reminding everyone that they just need to look at themselves, to remember *what they first love about fashion*, to be aware of what they are doing here on tfs in expressing opinions, to know that this isn't some juggernaut that those of us who are disgusted with it are powerless to change.

Exit stage left.
Chill out zazie. No need for the am-drams! Nighty-night.

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