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04-07-2010
  31
fashion insider
 
Zazie's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softgrey View Post
yeah-
i have to say that i wouldn't mind seeing some of those dynasties crumble...


make room for some other people, would ya?!...
i mean....
there have to be more than 20 talented photographers in the world...right?!?...
the law of averages says that there MUST be...

yet, you wouldn't think so looking at fashion mags for the last 10-15 years..
...

** i have to add though, that i have worked with a LOT of photogs ...
and it isn't as easy to find really gifted ones as you might think...

You're right that there are very few good photogs in fashion, but there are some really great ones in non-fashion related fields, eg. journalism. I personally would love to persuade a photojournalist to do a fashion shoot - they really have different eyes, but they want that like they would a root canal.:p

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04-07-2010
  32
flaunt the imperfection
 
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well--
what i want are good FASHION photogs......
not the same as photojournalists...
and i don't want some pseudo-artsy pics either...
i want fashion- with a capital F...

so...
yeah...
sigh me up for a root canal too...

...

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Last edited by softgrey; 04-07-2010 at 01:33 PM.
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04-07-2010
  33
The future is stupid
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softgrey View Post
there have to be more than 20 talented photographers in the world...right?!?...
the law of averages says that there MUST be...

yet, you wouldn't think so looking at fashion mags for the last 10-15 years..
...

** i have to add though, that i have worked with a LOT of photogs ...
and it isn't as easy to find really gifted ones as you might think...

That's because it's easy to take a picture, but it's much more difficult to have a personal vision.

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05-07-2010
  34
clever ain't wise
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softgrey View Post
well--
what i want are good FASHION photogs......
not the same as photojournalists...
and i don't want some pseudo-artsy pics either...
i want fashion- with a capital F...

so...
yeah...
sigh me up for a root canal too...

...
So you are saying that they're not interested in fashion and that makes them unwilling to focus on the aspects of importance to the person interested in fashion? What are the qualities of a great fashion photographer - from the stylist's or fashion editor's perspective?

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06-07-2010
  35
flaunt the imperfection
 
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Quote:
What are the qualities of a great fashion photographer - from the stylist's or fashion editor's perspective?
i think you have just come up with an idea for a new thread ILJ!...

...

i'd like to know what everyone thinks about that---
not just stylists...
but we probably shouldn't take this thread so off topic...
do you want to start a new one???...or should i do it?

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06-07-2010
  36
no tom ford, no thanks.
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zazie View Post
You're right that there are very few good photogs in fashion, but there are some really great ones in non-fashion related fields, eg. journalism. I personally would love to persuade a photojournalist to do a fashion shoot - they really have different eyes, but they want that like they would a root canal.:p
bottega has used non-fashion photographers for years. also, with garance dore doing the moschino shoot, it's indicative that the old guard of fashion photographers would just get replaced with a new guard like garance dore, tommy ton, et al.

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12-07-2010
  37
windowshopping
 
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Fashion is such a tangible thing, something about going into a store and looking at the clothing and feeling the material that makes it feel relevant and real. I think that hardcopy magazines are very similar in that manner as well - I just don't think that the September issue of Vogue would be the same if I had to read it online. While I do appreciate the concept of the iPad style magazines, unless you're on that hardware it wouldn't read or deliver the same on a traditional desktop or laptop.

The fact that the fashion industry is embracing some digital platforms is great. But I think what makes it great is that it delivers new and supplementary content on top of what it delivers in traditional media. It also provides an opportunity to add material to the brand (video, news releases, first impressions, dialogues with readers, etc.) that otherwise would have to wait until the following issue and would then could be verging on passť.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a complete technology nerd and love to see the innovation and complete experience that designers and magazines can create online (music, video, imagery, interaction) but there's something still so satisfying about sitting down with a magazine and reading the articles and looking at the photos (as someone mentioned - that weight of the paper in your hands). The photographer and editor dynasties are frustrating though, I understand that - if anything perhaps new talent in the hard copy magazines might breathe life into the medium. Easier said than done though. Maybe online is the way to find and test out the potential of that talent though?

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12-07-2010
  38
V.I.P.
 
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definitely non fashion oriented, but that was a good read

from NYT :
Quote:
The Medium Is the Medium
By DAVID BROOKS
Recently, book publishers got some good news. Researchers gave 852 disadvantaged students 12 books (of their own choosing) to take home at the end of the school year. They did this for three successive years.

Then the researchers, led by Richard Allington of the University of Tennessee, looked at those students’ test scores. They found that the students who brought the books home had significantly higher reading scores than other students. These students were less affected by the “summer slide” — the decline that especially afflicts lower-income students during the vacation months. In fact, just having those 12 books seemed to have as much positive effect as attending summer school.

This study, along with many others, illustrates the tremendous power of books. We already knew, from research in 27 countries, that kids who grow up in a home with 500 books stay in school longer and do better. This new study suggests that introducing books into homes that may not have them also produces significant educational gains.

Recently, Internet mavens got some bad news. Jacob Vigdor and Helen Ladd of Duke’s Sanford School of Public Policy examined computer use among a half-million 5th through 8th graders in North Carolina. They found that the spread of home computers and high-speed Internet access was associated with significant declines in math and reading scores.

This study, following up on others, finds that broadband access is not necessarily good for kids and may be harmful to their academic performance. And this study used data from 2000 to 2005 before Twitter and Facebook took off.

These two studies feed into the debate that is now surrounding Nicholas Carr’s book, “The Shallows.” Carr argues that the Internet is leading to a short-attention-span culture. He cites a pile of research showing that the multidistraction, hyperlink world degrades people’s abilities to engage in deep thought or serious contemplation.

Carr’s argument has been challenged. His critics point to evidence that suggests that playing computer games and performing Internet searches actually improves a person’s ability to process information and focus attention. The Internet, they say, is a boon to schooling, not a threat.

But there was one interesting observation made by a philanthropist who gives books to disadvantaged kids. It’s not the physical presence of the books that produces the biggest impact, she suggested. It’s the change in the way the students see themselves as they build a home library. They see themselves as readers, as members of a different group.

The Internet-versus-books debate is conducted on the supposition that the medium is the message. But sometimes the medium is just the medium. What matters is the way people think about themselves while engaged in the two activities. A person who becomes a citizen of the literary world enters a hierarchical universe. There are classic works of literature at the top and beach reading at the bottom.

A person enters this world as a novice, and slowly studies the works of great writers and scholars. Readers immerse themselves in deep, alternative worlds and hope to gain some lasting wisdom. Respect is paid to the writers who transmit that wisdom.

A citizen of the Internet has a very different experience. The Internet smashes hierarchy and is not marked by deference. Maybe it would be different if it had been invented in Victorian England, but Internet culture is set in contemporary America. Internet culture is egalitarian. The young are more accomplished than the old. The new media is supposedly savvier than the old media. The dominant activity is free-wheeling, disrespectful, antiauthority disputation.

These different cultures foster different types of learning. The great essayist Joseph Epstein once distinguished between being well informed, being hip and being cultivated. The Internet helps you become well informed — knowledgeable about current events, the latest controversies and important trends. The Internet also helps you become hip — to learn about what’s going on, as Epstein writes, “in those lively waters outside the boring mainstream.”

But the literary world is still better at helping you become cultivated, mastering significant things of lasting import. To learn these sorts of things, you have to defer to greater minds than your own. You have to take the time to immerse yourself in a great writer’s world. You have to respect the authority of the teacher.

Right now, the literary world is better at encouraging this kind of identity. The Internet culture may produce better conversationalists, but the literary culture still produces better students.

It’s better at distinguishing the important from the unimportant, and making the important more prestigious.

Perhaps that will change. Already, more “old-fashioned” outposts are opening up across the Web. It could be that the real debate will not be books versus the Internet but how to build an Internet counterculture that will better attract people to serious learning.

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14-07-2010
  39
no tom ford, no thanks.
 
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while i do understand the power of the tangible and relate to the actual experience of fashion -- call me a sap, but i'm one of those people who experiences natural high when walking down the street holding oversized shopping bags from prada or ysl or wherever -- fashion encompasses so much more than the point-of-purchase experience and so much more than the butterflies one feels when showing off one's designer purchase in front of the mirror or out and about. for many generations of reader, there's almost a ritual when reading fashion magazines or shopping in a boutique or experiencing any of the other marginal luxury experiences that we think of when involved in fashion -- from art openings to exclusive restaurants to live music et al.

however, for the younger generations, i'm not sure they experience the correlation as strongly. just as decades past saw intellectuals and cultural elites decrying new formats of the arts like novels, broadcast radio, film, television, the cassette tape, the compact disc, etc. as we have seen, none of these new media completely eliminated the other. while i may listen to most of my music on an ipod, i will dole out hundreds of dollars to hear live music i love and the best djs in the world know the power of vinyl. i believe that the internet will -- indeed, has -- taken a prominent place in our media consumption, but just like the others, it will make us value the authentic experience even more. also, it will refer people to those old formats that may never have seen it in times past. i'm not really the type of person to buy magazines like pop or v, but i'll go on their website any day of the week. and i would never have picked up a sookie stackhouse novel -- judge me now, i needed a beach read -- if i hadn't started watching "true blood" on television. sure, attention spans may get shorter and shorter as technology progresses, but it will create a hunger for the substantial that we do not yet know.

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15-07-2010
  40
fashion icon
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softgrey View Post
it is a big topic...
one thing i do really love about the internet is not having to fight for a seat at fashion shows!...
now i can just watch from my couch...
Does watching shows on TV/online really compare to seeing them 'live'? I've never been to a high end fashion show so wouldn't know - but I'm guessing it would be similar to seeing a band on television compared to seeing them in person

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15-07-2010
  41
no tom ford, no thanks.
 
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^yes and no. does the average fashion consumer really feel compelled to see most fashion shows live? doubtful. however, does that live experience drive sales? absolutely. i've attended fashion shows -- not anyone famous and not in new york -- and the experience alone does make you want to buy something. the designer is creating a moment and if it resonates, it can be very powerful. and enduring. much more than seeing the same thing on television or online.

it's like watching a broadway show. the soundtrack is great and a movie can evoke emotion. but when there's an a-list broadway star standing thirty feet from you actually singing their heart out, it can affect your very soul.

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17-07-2010
  42
flaunt the imperfection
 
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i totally agree with mike...
but i do think it depends on the show...
some of them are really nothing special...
ie- most of the shows in nyc...


now, paris....
that is another story altogether...
but since i don't have the budget (or the time) to fly overseas twice a year just for the shows, the internet will do just fine, thank you...!
:p

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Last edited by softgrey; 17-07-2010 at 10:37 AM.
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17-07-2010
  43
windowshopping
 
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I just registered here, so I'm going to "go back" to the theme of this post
I honestly think that the Internet won't ever replace fashion magazines, for the simple and good reason that the Internet can't and doesn't provide the quality of fashion magazines: it can be about the photographs, the articles or the presentation.

I love to buy magazines, to turn their pages, to stare at a picture, to take the time to read - which is a thing that we don't really do when we're on the Internet: taking our time -, etc...

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23-07-2010
  44
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I really hope they don't get rid of magazines and go into having an online mag because it would just be a shame. Yes, you can see things online that you can see with paying something like £4.80 but then why do we still buy it do you think? Well I know how to see the editorials and articles online but the reason why I still buy my monthly issues of Vogue is because I like the feel of the glossy cover, I like to be able to have fashion in my two hands on paper. Ever since I was about 6 I can remember cutting up my mothers fashion magazines to make look books or decide whats pretty and make collages so I have grown up with magazines and I just feel it would be a shame to lose them. Everything is going online and having an app or something and it would be a massive shame to lose the history of a magazine all to keep up with the 21st century.

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21-09-2010
  45
flaunt the imperfection
 
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does the younger generation still have that feeling though...?
do they care about the hard copy of a magazine>?
or are they so used to a digital world that they prefer it?

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