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02-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by purplelucrezia@Dec 2 2004, 03:18 PM
They're only conforming to a less publicized label.
Maybe. But I am not convinced that they are worried about judgement the way that the other conformists we are talking about are.

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02-12-2004
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I think all people try to express themselves in a certin way, through the way they dress, the music they listen to, etc. To a certin exptent there is 'buying into' a idea no matter what. But if the idea is some thing that you personally like, I don't think that makes you a conformist.


In the case of A&F I think they represent an idea of popularity and 'good life', and I think these are veyr populare ideas that people whant to buy into. But when something is so so common I think people buy into it becuase they whant to be common becuase there is a fear of being outcasted.

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Quote:
Originally posted by Spacemiu@Dec 2 2004, 02:40 PM
I think all people try to express themselves in a certin way, through the way they dress, the music they listen to, etc. To a certin exptent there is 'buying into' a idea no matter what. But if the idea is some thing that you personally like, I don't think that makes you a conformist.
[snapback]447796[/snapback]
Well said, liking it yourself is the most important thing.

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02-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by seraphelle@Dec 2 2004, 01:16 PM
So even among the nonconformists, there is conformity...? I like to think that if there were two identical skirts, except one missing the label, I would bid the exact same, but maybe it would be hard to keep that mindset...? As much as anybody believes in nonconformity...?
[snapback]447754[/snapback]
Both skirts were Alaia and the label served to satisfy the buyer alone -- I don't think that's a true example of conformity.

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02-12-2004
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If I made clothes like that, I'd have catalogs full of naked people, too.

You can quote me as Alex Niedt, 19, Kansas City.

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02-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fade to Black@Dec 2 2004, 01:27 PM
I'm not a fan of those suburban mall brands at all...my school is basically one big Abercrombie & Fitch catalog and to be honest I find it quite repulsive. I'm not a fashion expert by any means, as I'm still learning a lot of things about clothes and defining my own style...but I had to make an observation: I don't mean to generalize, but is it pure coincidence when I talk to some of these people who swear by the cookie cutter college style that their personalities seem completely vapid and empty and that everything about them screams conformist? To be very honest with you I'll admit I do have a snob mentality towards these people, but this mentality is in response to their own smug ignorance and being content to fit in without any sense of individuality...and anything else outside that mold they fit in is just alien to them, namely good taste. Or maybe I'm just delusional. I've kind of tried as hard as possible to stay away from fitting under that category because I see those people and I see something that I genuinely despise, not just the clothes but the whole lifestyle in general. Which is why I actually prefer to be alone, doing my own thing rather than fit in with a crowd that I don't feel comfortable with anyway.
[snapback]447655[/snapback]
This seriously is an EXACT description of me and my feelings toward Abercrombie and everything being discussed in this thread. I wonder if we were separated at birth...

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02-12-2004
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Who knows if it'll help, but I started to wear a&f when I was in jr. high to "fit in". And sure enough, it helped a lot, we didn't have an a&f around so if you wanted it you had to shop 3hrs away or order online. I still wear it in college, right along with the "Tiffany silver trinkets" because I want to fit in.
However, I rushing to join an exclusive sorority, wear they actually wear more women oriented, adult type clothes, so I will soon wear things like Banana Republic. Funny how you give up one thing just to go on to another......

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02-12-2004
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Abercrombie is a trendy store, not a fashion store. I think their clothes are actually repulsive and boring. When has rip jeans in the *** area become fashionable? Plus the only thing I ever see in their stores are jeans, T-Shirts, boring messenger bags, and flip flops. They're just playing the field safe to rank in their customers and I think its sad. Not only that but they're catalog is quite repulsive too. Naked people in orgy? Not to say I have a problem with nudity. One of my favorite fashion magazine W has some form of nudity in its editorial yes I still love it for it is art and classy yet still including the product it is pushing. In my mind, naked people in sexual positions selling their body instead of clothes is just low-trash.

Loc (make up a last name if you please Lol) 15. Florida

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02-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by seraphelle@Dec 2 2004, 02:16 PM
I notice something funny about that on ebay. There were two Alaia skirts that were so similar, and one with the label missing and one with the label still in it. As far as I could see the one with the label missing was probably more expensive in the first place because it had a higher silk content and the other one had a higher wool content. But of course the one with the label in it sold for much more even though they were both obviously Alaia. For me the striking thing is that Alaia is not for the mainstream; maybe it is more so than Undercover but the masses don't really know the difference between Alaia and Abercrombie, or at least they don't notice it enough to be worth hundred of dollars of difference to impress others. So having the label inside truly is something that only the buyer only will know, but the buyer still cares.

So even among the nonconformists, there is conformity...? I like to think that if there were two identical skirts, except one missing the label, I would bid the exact same, but maybe it would be hard to keep that mindset...? As much as anybody believes in nonconformity...?
[snapback]447754[/snapback]

fyi...just a bit of info here...even though silk is considered a fine fabric..it is actually one of the cheapest fabrics to produce...so the silk skirt does not have more intrinsic value than the wool one...

and anything with a label has more value on the open market...just like a signed painting is more valuable than one that is unsigned... so the skirt with the label is a better investment and worth more because of its re-sale value... just a matter of practicality and common sense...nothing to do with conformity...

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02-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by softgrey@Dec 1 2004, 03:28 PM
i couldn't agree more...and i wear my most agressive clothes on days that i feel strong...so i can take all the looks and stares, and possible comments...

but i also find that if i am in a situation that poses some threat to me emotionally, my clothing can act as a suit of armour ...shielding me from possible confrontations with people who don't share my values or point of view...

i think this is a lot of what the 'goth' movement in teenagers is all about, right?...keeping people away who might potentially hurt you...
[snapback]446467[/snapback]
Good point Soft, especially your last point. On a similar note, it is also interesting to observe that, in the opposite direction, youth also dress, in order to keep people away that can potentially hurt them, by conforming to the masses. So, with labels such as A&F, however ridiculous to us it may look, it does serve a purpose to them in that they know, whether consciously or subconsciously, that it will guard them to some degree from being singled out or ridiculed. In order to stand apart you need confidence; conforming prevents people from confronting you. Often blending into the crowd can make you feel safe as it does not require one to justify them self. Those are just my (incomplete and vague!) thoughts…………

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05-12-2004
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from wwd...

Friday December 3, 2004

A&F Plans Canadian Growth

By Brian Dunn

MONTREAL — Abercrombie & Fitch Co. is planning to open its first stores in Canada next year.
The company is currently scouting potential locations and performing due diligence in the Canadian market, according to an A&F spokesman. He said the trendy retailer has been looking at Canada for some time and feels there are strong markets in Canada’s three largest cities of Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver.
The spokesman said Abercrombie’s Internet business has been strong, with international sales up 145 percent in the latest quarter. While online sales figures for Canada are not broken down separately, he said the country represents a solid market.
“We track our sales from the Internet and our Canadian sales have grown quite rapidly over the last few years, which confirms our belief there is a demand for us up there,” the spokesman said Thursday.
Currently, all A&F stores are in the U.S., but Canada was a natural first step to expand internationally, he said. Although it is still too early to say how big the Canadian outlets would be, the spokesman suggested they would be at least the size of the company’s U.S. stores, which
average 8,500 square feet.
Although most U.S. stores are located in malls, the spokesman wouldn’t rule out opening
freestanding stores in Canada if the right locations were found.
A&F would join international chains including Sephora, Zara and H&M that have recently expanded into Canada. Retail consultant John Williams, president of J.C. Williams Group in Toronto, said A&F is coming into a crowded marketplace.
“They have their own niche, but they also overlap with traditional department stores, as well as retailers like Le Chateau, Club Monaco, The Gap and American Eagle,” Williams said. “There’s also European retailers like Zara and H&M, so market share will have to come out of someone’s hide. But having said that, Abercrombie has a very focused approach to the marketplace, so I think they’ll do well here.”
The A&F spokesman didn’t agree with Williams’ assessment of overlapping with other retailers.
“We’re in a different business than department stores because we’re vertically integrated and control every aspect of our operations,” he said. “We also feel we do things differently from the other retailers because we offer a lifestyle based on the power of our brand and feel we’re a notch above the competition.”

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09-12-2004
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"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”

I think some of you need to stop projecting onto others. It seems to me there is a common theme in this thread of placing "individual style" on top of a pedestal, which there should be since this is The Fashion Spot. Though I also feel that some of you may need to step back and realize that others don’t see the world same as you blah blah blah and crap. I am like most of you I guess and really into fashion, art, and other cultural and intellectual interests, but I differ from you because I realize that most people aren’t and I find that completely acceptable. These teens for the most part are not interested in defining their personal style, they just want to get laid, be at the next party, have the latest gossip, get into the right college, get their parents off their ***, and a bunch of other shtuff. They basically don’t care. The boys will wear the baggy ripped jeans because if they’re too slim or stylish they will look like a “faggot”. The girls will wear those tattered rags as a top because the boys think it sexy. They (boys and girls) don’t care or understand the sophistication about a proper silhouette. It comes down to that these higher ideals have nothing to do with their lives, and they definitely don’t match their values. I don’t find this to be conformist. These clothes do represent who they are, they are the ones interested in others things then fashion. The only conformists are the ones uninvited to their party who don the outfit hoping to find an acceptance letter in the mail. Realize and remember we are all conformists to someone else. Take me for example I have a lot of personal style in my dress but I drive a Honda. So I don’t fit into the horde on the clothing level, but do on a different one. I could rationalize my ride by saying it is a good quality car (172,000 miles and yet to have a major problem with it though I beat the piss out of it), somewhat cheap to repair, good on gas, and has a menial bit of flavor since it is a two-seater, targa top. I am sure there are many of car snobs out there that would just shake their head in disgust. They could go into an eloquent discourse on the pleasure of driving an Aston Martin, or the like, and basically give the same arguments a lot of you did leaving me lumped in the conformist pile. Now the simple retort is that these cars are not in my price range and are not locally available to me. But that is a thin excuse. If I had the energy and desire I am sure I could find through the internet and other sources an affordable car that these snobs would consider at least a good start in the right direction. Then there are also the hi-fi snobs that feel distaste for how we listen to our music; the timepiece snobs with their jewels; and ditto for the food and wine snobs. The list is endless so we are infinitely all the more conformist along side the A&F crowd. All because we just don’t get true quality in such-a-such area. I am fascinated though at the same time also weary in hearing what some of your “Utopias” would be. Would you rather these kids be searching through Yoox for a Margiela t-shirt, or a Pucci print dress? I think a million young fashionistas running around is not a better alternative just as a thousand Bentleys and Porsches crowding the roads is better all because it is pleasing to the discerning few eyes. As good ol’ Mr. Christ said "Why do you notice the splinter in your brother's eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye?… You hypocrite, remove the wooden beam from your eye first; then you will see clearly to remove the splinter from your brother's eye." Yay for conformity. . .

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09-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sarcastitch@Dec 9 2004, 02:37 AM

These teens for the most part are not interested in defining their personal style, they just want to get laid, be at the next party, have the latest gossip, get into the right college, get their parents off their ***, and a bunch of other shtuff. They basically don’t care. The boys will wear the baggy ripped jeans because if they’re too slim or stylish they will look like a “faggot”. The girls will wear those tattered rags as a top because the boys think it sexy. They (boys and girls) don’t care or understand the sophistication about a proper silhouette.
this is a good observation of teen culture...that's exactly how I see it. It's not that I don't accept them, I just can't appreciate their values and aesthetic...Aw f**k it, I'll just admit it: I'm a snob and I look down on these poor slobs.

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09-12-2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by softgrey@Dec 2 2004, 11:35 PM
fyi...just a bit of info here...even though silk is considered a fine fabric..it is actually one of the cheapest fabrics to produce...so the silk skirt does not have more intrinsic value than the wool one...

and anything with a label has more value on the open market...just like a signed painting is more valuable than one that is unsigned... so the skirt with the label is a better investment and worth more because of its re-sale value... just a matter of practicality and common sense...nothing to do with conformity...
[snapback]448133[/snapback]
Deoends on the type of silk, but in this instance, I'm agreed.

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I don't think the intent was ever to argue that people should be more interested in fashion, and definitely not that they should be more sophisticated. The problem a lot of us have is that no A&F posterchild would accept that she is only imitating, insofar as she thinks conformity is only natural. It isn't that she doesn't know she is a follower, but she is unaware that she could be so much more. A lot of the time, I feel like people are sort of brainwashed. They don't try to look outside/inside themselves because they don't know how good it can really feel, and they are too afraid to try it. I don't think you can argue that society doesn't impose restrictions on people in this respect. Maybe you think that people would have just the same apathy either way, but that's where I disagree.

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