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27-05-2005
  31
Unveil Yourself....
 
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Let's hope that it's gonna be great and frankly, I have full trust in that

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27-05-2005
  32
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I have a feeling he'll be perfect for the position.

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27-05-2005
  33
Stitch:the Hand
 
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I'm not really denying the fact that he could be brilliant. Hell,he could even give Jil herself a run for her money....however I don't know what the work will be like. I mean being such an independent and free-spirited in his creativity,how will the design restraints affect him emotionally? Look what happened to McQueen at Givenchy...he got sick of being controlled after so many seasons and it was a reflection in the work and eventually his ultimate departure. I'm being pessimistic because this is an utter shock to me....I could have never imagined a designer from such an anti-establishment atmosphere(for which he was part of)such as Antwerp to Prada Group.

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27-05-2005
  34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott
I'm not really denying the fact that he could be brilliant. Hell,he could even give Jil herself a run for her money....however I don't know what the work will be like. I mean being such an independent and free-spirited in his creativity,how will the design restraints affect him emotionally? Look what happened to McQueen at Givenchy...he got sick of being controlled after so many seasons and it was a reflection in the work and eventually his ultimate departure. I'm being pessimistic because this is an utter shock to me....I could have never imagined a designer from such an anti-establishment atmosphere(for which he was part of)such as Antwerp to Prada Group.
Exactly.

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27-05-2005
  35
gromosexual
 
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this is so awesome but honestly, Bertelli will most likely somehow force him to quit in a few seasons I'm sure.

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27-05-2005
  36
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I think it will work out perfectly.

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27-05-2005
  37
V.I.P.
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott
I'm not really denying the fact that he could be brilliant. Hell,he could even give Jil herself a run for her money....however I don't know what the work will be like. I mean being such an independent and free-spirited in his creativity,how will the design restraints affect him emotionally? Look what happened to McQueen at Givenchy...he got sick of being controlled after so many seasons and it was a reflection in the work and eventually his ultimate departure. I'm being pessimistic because this is an utter shock to me....I could have never imagined a designer from such an anti-establishment atmosphere(for which he was part of)such as Antwerp to Prada Group.
I read 4 articles on this today. Raf said that he is very excited and that he always loved Jil Sander's minimalism and he wants to see how he'll operate in this vein. So I don't see him rocking the boat at all. As a matter of fact his cutting skills are perfect for the job, so I see a total fit there. And if he doesn't like it at Prada, he'll quit - as simple as that. There won't be emotional connections that Jil and Helmut had to face by leaving their own brands. I'm very happy for him and I hope he'll do great.

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27-05-2005
  38
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Faust, I was waiting for your opinions on this issue:-)

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27-05-2005
  39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nqth
Faust, I was waiting for your opinions on this issue:-)
Thanks I STILL don't think that there will be a major turn around for Jil or Helmut without them EVER, so Raf gets to have all the fun while Bertelli gets to lose more money. Yippie!

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27-05-2005
  40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faust
...Raf gets to have all the fun while Bertelli gets to lose more money...
I love the sound of that.

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27-05-2005
  41
Stitch:the Hand
 
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If he's under contract,and not satisfied months or years on,doesn't that mean he'd still have to stay? Believe you me,I understand totally why he might have signed on....to help finance his own label. That's great! But,we're also talking fascist Prada here....and Bertelli is a complete twat unto himself...I definitely think with Raf's spirit,there will be clashes between them,creatively.

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27-05-2005
  42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott
If he's under contract,and not satisfied months or years on,doesn't that mean he'd still have to stay? Believe you me,I understand totally why he might have signed on....to help finance his own label. That's great! But,we're also talking fascist Prada here....and Bertelli is a complete twat unto himself...I definitely think with Raf's spirit,there will be clashes between them,creatively.
I don't think Raf needs help financing his own label. Neither did Jil nor Helmut, not like they were poor, they just wanted to expand. There is not a word about financing his label or taken over his label or anything like that. He's just an employee of another company, completely unrelated to his own. I do hope he is smart enough to sign a short term contract. :p

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28-05-2005
  43
etre soi-meme
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metal-on-metal
Well I think "hyped" constitutes someone who receives unworthy praise. . I know not everyone has to be in love with him but you can't deny that he's skilled and gifted in what he does.
i dont deny he's talented, but he's still hyped in my book..
hyped for me goes well with anyone who's talents have been like 'over-exaggerated' thats how i see Raf, he's good, but he's portrayed as much much better than he actually is :p

in anycase, good luck to him with the Prada Group, hopefully he will be clever enough..

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28-05-2005
  44
front row
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faust
Thanks I STILL don't think that there will be a major turn around for Jil or Helmut without them EVER, so Raf gets to have all the fun while Bertelli gets to lose more money. Yippie!

I actually thought the same thing as you, Faust. As long as Jil Sander and Helmut are still alive (and still young, healthy, and at their creative peak... which they are) I don't see how anybody could expect much more than just breaking even.

As I see it, if Raf keeps much with Jil's silhouette and style, then sales might not rise too much because it will be seen as "diluted" Jil Sander and not as good as Jil's Jil Sander. Also, if he does this, then fans of his own label will probably not transfer over to buy the more expensive Jil Sander.

On the other hand, if Raf does a stellar, stand-out, break the mold collection, then perhaps there will be some immediate sales from new customers (or from buyers of Raf's own label) but the loyal Jil Sander buyers who have grown with her style might feel alienated. And, thus, after an initial peak, sales will probably slump again.

So... while I'm excited to see what happens, it might prove a little tricky.

Of course, it is all a little premature to guess until we actually see a collection, but I still think it is almost a lose-lose situation in terms of a big "turnaround." What it will do is give Raf a chance to get his name, image, and ideas into a very different "circle" of fashion. So, good for him.

John

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28-05-2005
  45
etre soi-meme
 
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i think the archetype of Sander's design 'signature' is not that far from Raf's tailoring/style, hence the Sander clients wont hold back on Raf.. its a smooth replacement, commercially it should work, creatively, Raf knows how to deal with low budget materials/fabrics so he wont have trouble with mr B.'s tight Sander budgets either..

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