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09-05-2013
  436
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valliaddict's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softgrey View Post
this is totally pathetic...

why should he have to have a public therapy session in order to teach a class...?!
that is beyond crap...it's total BS...
and has nothing to do with the subject he was scheduled to teach...

i could see if it was some lecture on the dangers and traps one could fall into when working in fashion...
but that is a whole other ball of wax...

crap---just a load of crap...

this is why i didn't go to parsons...
bunch of rich b*tch, self-entitled a**holes...
For him, this is more than just a class. This was supposed to be some form of redemption for him. A way to slowly step back into the industry, but as a very public, very famous figure, he shouldn't be allowed to ignore the elephant in the room. It's not like he's going back to some basic 9-to-5 job after this whole thing blows over. With all this overwhelming support from the industry, he will most likely find another seven figure job & things will go back to normal. This Parsons thing is just a bump in the road on his sympathy tour. Don't worry though. He has enough people in the fashion industry who are more than happy to ignore the issue & help him get back on top. While what Parsons did was sneaky (I doubt the part about him having to speak on the controversy was in big, bold font in the contract), he should've just been a man about it, taken the job, & answered the questions. Politicians have to deal with this all the time when they do something bad. So do actors, musicians, athletes, socialites, etc. John liked being a public figure before all of this. He should be treated like one. Face your critics & don't be a coward.


Last edited by valliaddict; 09-05-2013 at 02:40 PM.
 
 
09-05-2013
  437
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he's not a politician, though...
he is an artist...
much more sensitive by nature and not necessarily good at fielding the prying questions of nosy people who just want to hear some juicy gossip...

frankly-
if he had gotten drunk and made those statements iin another country, those people couldn't have even pressed charges on him because we have a thing here called free speech...
and you can't be arrested for just not liking someone and calling them a name...
can you imagine...?!?
every kid in school would be arrested if name calling were illegal...


the way he is being persecuted is the hate crime, as far as i am concerned...

and like i said earlier---
complete BS...
ugh!

...

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09-05-2013
  438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iluvjeisa View Post
That idea might ultimately be what brings the western world down to its knees. It's a serious threat against democracy IMO.

Might sound melodramatic, but it essentially means you can never say anything without first carefully going over it with a PR consultant...
Yes to melodramatic, because 999 out of 1000 non-PR professionals would be able to tell you that what John said (unplanned, I'm sure) was an extremely bad idea. There are certainly threats to democracy, but I don't see this as one of them. I think clearly democracy is at work here ... the people voted no on this class.

It would be interesting to know if a more technical class would have met the same level of protest.

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09-05-2013
  439
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I would argue that it's not democratic - the people who voted no are an oligarchy in this case - those with the power to make the choice. They did not respresent a constituent of the population, the same way we vote in America for a president.

 
09-05-2013
  440
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softgrey View Post
he's not a politician, though...
he is an artist...
much more sensitive by nature and not necessarily good at fielding the prying questions of nosy people who just want to hear some juicy gossip...

...

the way he is being persecuted is the hate crime, as far as i am concerned...

and like i said earlier---
complete BS...
ugh!

...
the fact that he's an "artist" and "sensitive" does not excuse him from being accountable, and especially to students.
he failed to maintain a fairly basic level of social and cultural decency and he is a public figure...a role
that he has cultivated and enjoyed, as pointed out above.

i think this whole thing was a bit of a stunt from the beginning--not fair to John or the student body.
he may be a brilliant designer, but there is no evidence that he would be a good teacher.
i would argue that in the vast majority of cases, the two things do not go hand in hand (and the level of ego involved here only exacerbates what's typically true).
And I'm 100% confident that the decision to cancel this thing was due to financial pressure.
They are back-pedaling on a bad business decision (because universities are a BUSINESS these days)
and they are using this open forum thing as a scapegoat.

in any case, losing a job at Parsons is hardly tantamount to "persecution" or to being ruined. :p
i'm sure Galliano will be fine...he has a lot of friends and a lot of resources.

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Last edited by laika; 09-05-2013 at 10:27 PM.
 
09-05-2013
  441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Littleathquakes View Post
I would argue that it's not democratic - the people who voted no are an oligarchy in this case - those with the power to make the choice. They did not respresent a constituent of the population, the same way we vote in America for a president.
I'm sure this info is not totally public (as to who voted no), but from what I've read, some members of the university community were opposed--faculty & students, as well as some members of the larger fashion community.

I don't see really what the reason for them to cave to outside pressure would be--clearly this was going to be controversial. The pressure that would work must have come from within, IMO ...

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10-05-2013
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People change, I honestly think constantly ostracizing him is gone to the extreme now. Even Mark Wahlberg was forgiven and he is a big star now , and he did some pretty heinous racial crimes. What Galliano did was wrong but the price he paid for it was much much more than what he deserved. I find it so tragic that he breathed life into Dior and made it the powerhouse it is today and many people in the company act as if he never existed. Regardless of his personality and personal life, his body of work speaks for itself.

 
10-05-2013
  443
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I guess we're about to find about some new things in a few weeks

Quote:
Vanity Fair Lands John Galliano Interview

GALLIANO TALKS:
John Galliano has refused interviews since a drunken anti-Semitic outburst at a Paris bar two years ago cost him his job at Christian Dior, and much of his reputation. But he’s been slowly mounting a return to the fashion world, first with a “designer in residence” spot at Oscar de la Renta and, later, with an anticipated teaching gig at Parsons The New School for Design, an invitation that was rescinded this week. The public campaign kicks into higher gear in the July issue of Vanity Fair, where the designer gives his first extensive interview since his exile from fashion.

There had been much jockeying in the media to land that first interview with Galliano, but up until now he’s chosen to express contrition by deferring to powerful allies to speak on his behalf, like Vogue editor in chief Anna Wintour, Condé Nast International chairman Jonathan Newhouse and the Anti-Defamation League’s national director Abraham H. Foxman.

Presumably Galliano again expresses contrition for his behavior and hope for a return to design, but details have been kept under wraps and not much is known about the Vanity Fair interview beyond its broad scope. Asked to comment on the subject of the interview, Galliano’s publicist Liz Rosenberg said, “I have no idea because I haven’t seen the article. I don’t know if there’s a slant.”

Negotiations before such a high-profile interview would include discussion of any topics that might be covered, but Rosenberg declined to go into specifics or why Vanity Fair was chosen as the vehicle for Galliano’s awaited confessional. One advantage Vanity Fair had is that the interview was conducted by Ingrid Sischy, whose position as the coeditor of Italian, German and Spanish Vanity Fairs likely means broad play among several international editions, an attractive selling point for someone eager to make a bold reemergence.

A spokeswoman for Vanity Fair said the magazine never confirms or comments on upcoming stories. Sischy declined comment, citing the magazine’s policy.
wwd

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10-05-2013
  444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laika View Post
the fact that he's an "artist" and "sensitive" does not excuse him from being accountable, and especially to students.
he failed to maintain a fairly basic level of social and cultural decency and he is a public figure...a role
that he has cultivated and enjoyed, as pointed out above.

i think this whole thing was a bit of a stunt from the beginning--not fair to John or the student body.
he may be a brilliant designer, but there is no evidence that he would be a good teacher.
i would argue that in the vast majority of cases, the two things do not go hand in hand (and the level of ego involved here only exacerbates what's typically true).
And I'm 100% confident that the decision to cancel this thing was due to financial pressure.
They are back-pedaling on a bad business decision (because universities are a BUSINESS these days)
and they are using this open forum thing as a scapegoat.

in any case, losing a job at Parsons is hardly tantamount to "persecution" or to being ruined. :p
i'm sure Galliano will be fine...he has a lot of friends and a lot of resources.

well- duh!
but i didn't mean that...
i mean the overall way he is being treated...

Quote:
frankly-
if he had gotten drunk and made those statements iin another country, those people couldn't have even pressed charges on him because we have a thing here called free speech...
and you can't be arrested for just not liking someone and calling them a name...
can you imagine...?!?
every kid in school would be arrested if name calling were illegal...
this bit that i wrote (but you did not quote) indicates that...
...

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10-05-2013
  445
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Totally interesting about the Vanity Fair interview. I used to subscribe for many years ... they are known for the depth of their interviews. If it's typical, it will leave no stone unturned. Should be well worth reading ...

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10-05-2013
  446
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I wonder why it wasn't Vogue, as Anna is his most powerful authority figure/defender? I don't get the bit about VF's Ed-in-chief being a poly-EIC for their various international editions and thus would get a broader readership. Couldn't Conde Naste just simply reprint the interview in their international editions of Vogue as well?

 
10-05-2013
  447
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I think Vanity Fair was chosen as it is more of a celebrity magazine as a opposed to a fashion magazine. It is the magazine that frequently writes on scandal and the inner workings of Hollywood so I think it is the perfect place for his interview. And didn't Anna just get a position as artistic director at Conde Nest? That suggests that she could have used her influence to have Vanity Fair get this interview.

 
10-05-2013
  448
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williscrazy View Post
The students are also where the complaints are coming from, there are jewish student who were completely against it and kept on protesting and persuading other students to be with them.
Exactly. I am sick of hearing how sad this is for the students who will miss out on the class. What about the students who felt marginalized and unsafe because he was hired in the first place? What about the students who would miss out on a class because of the same reason? Do these students not deserve to a class taught by someone who isn't violently opposed to their very existence? Do these students not deserve to feel safe at their own institution?

Personally, I was very happy when I heard this was cancelled. He doesn't deserve a second chance when he hasn't shown any remorse or change. He expects forgiveness without truly apologizing.

Also, as a Jewish woman, I find it incredibly offensive to say that ADL forgave him so we all should. They do not speak for all Jews, and they are not the definitive source for Jewish issues. We are not a monolith, and we should not be treated as such. Or to say that he is being persecuted when this entire situation occurred because he mocked and celebrated the systematic persecution of Jews.

This Buzzfeed article sums it up perfectly for me:

Quote:
Why John Galliano Just Can’t Bounce Back

1. There’s nothing relatable about him or his offenses... most people probably don’t have a hard time refraining from saying, “I love Hitler,” even if provoked by an unruly bar patron.

2. He’s been nothing but a Page Six shadow figure since Dior fired him. Rather than come out in a cover story, People magazine–style, to explain what happened and how everything’s different now, all we’ve gotten are official statements of apology here and there. We need something bigger — a good 60 Minutes segment, or at least an interview in Vogue (a magazine which I’m pretty sure hasn’t acknowledged his scandal at all, which is just bizarre). The public needs to hear Galliano himself discuss what happened like a normal person, because as his personal style and entire persona have suggested over the course of his career, he is an otherworldly individual of extreme creativity, which puts him on a different strata than 99.999% of the population. We need to see a glimmer of his humanity and normalcy.

3. The ADL and Galliano are being cagey about what the designer has done to learn about Judaism and atone for his mistakes. The ADL is known to have “rehabbed” Galliano, after being connected to him by Anna Wintour and Condé Nast. The organization’s national director Abraham Foxman told BuzzFeed Fashion recently in a statement: “John Galliano has met with ADL on numerous occasions. He has expressed remorse for his actions [and] made a clear and unequivocal apology for his words. He has met with rabbis and Holocaust scholars and has gone on an intellectual and moral pilgrimage to learn from his past mistakes. He has also offered to do volunteer work with fashion schools in Israel.” But beyond official statements, the public hasn’t seen Galliano doing this work. Well, why is his involvement with the ADL such a hush-hush operation? Parsons’ Jewish Student Union President Jennifer Kaplan told BuzzFeed Fashion she felt like neither the ADL nor Galliano had given her organization proper proof of his moral retribution. Questioning his sentiments seems valid when the public has been assured of them only in canned statements. (When I interviewed Foxman following the announcement about the Parsons class, he said he and Galliano are “friends” but declined to go into specifics about their relationship.)
In an era when we know everything about everybody thanks to social media, for a public figure like Galliano to maintain such privacy and communicate to the public only via statements can’t help but create distrust. He was noticeably absent from Oscar de la Renta’s runway show in February, though his influence was evident in the clothes themselves. Often after scandals, people return to the public spotlight eventually, compelled by a mission to govern or create or inspire. If Galliano wants to bounce back, he’ll have to start taking his image into his own hands. At the very least, he’ll have to prove he can carry on a gaffe-free conversation with a reporter.
full article here http://www.buzzfeed.com/amyodell/why...nt-bounce-back


and surprise, after getting canned for not talking, he announces he is going to have an interview in Vanity Fair


Last edited by masquerade; 10-05-2013 at 01:19 PM.
 
10-05-2013
  449
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Why is it that only Jewish people are cited as offended, he said "I love Hitler" not "I hate Jews" so shouldn't everybody be equally offended since Hitler killed gays too?

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10-05-2013
  450
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Quote:
Originally Posted by masquerade View Post
Exactly. I am sick of hearing how sad this is for the students who will miss out on the class. What about the students who felt marginalized and unsafe because he was hired in the first place? What about the students who would miss out on a class because of the same reason? Do these students not deserve to a class taught by someone who isn't violently opposed to their very existence? Do these students not deserve to feel safe at their own institution?

Personally, I was very happy when I heard this was cancelled. He doesn't deserve a second chance when he hasn't shown any remorse or change. He expects forgiveness without truly apologizing.

Also, as a Jewish woman, I find it incredibly offensive to say that ADL forgave him so we all should. They do not speak for all Jews, and they are not the definitive source for Jewish issues. We are not a monolith, and we should not be treated as such. Or to say that he is being persecuted when this entire situation occurred because he mocked and celebrated the systematic persecution of Jews.
You have no proof for what you are saying. All we have is a video of a man drunk off his *** saying embarrassing and disgusting things to people.

You know - pathetic drunks - this is exactly what they do - scream strange insults. It is absolutely pathetic and reprehensible - but it's also quite obvious that kind of person is not themselves and needs help.

Some of these vitriolic comments two years after the incident in question baffles me. Sure, it was really nasty. But he has paid a high price and seems to behave in a bashful manner.

He is a very flamboyant, extroverted man and he has now been out of the public sight for two years. If that is not testament to the shame he feels for what he said and how he behaved, I don't know what is.

That said, I understand how the things he said are tremendously hurtful. And it's of course everybody's own choice when/if to forgive.


Last edited by iluvjeisa; 10-05-2013 at 02:04 PM.
 
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