The Model & Celeb Weight Thread [Read post #1 before posting] #1

[icelynn]

Originally Posted by izzie stevens

The media does influence what women see as beautiful. That's very true. But how many women actually know who these models are, and by name? We here at TFS do, those who follow the modeling industry do... But I'd laugh if my mother, or cousin, or any of my friends ever said to me, "Oh, Coco Rocha is so beautiful." Simply because, really... How the heck did she/they go about finding out that the girl in that editorial is Coco Rocha, or Natasha Poly, or Chanel Iman... Etc., etc., etc. if they are not closely following the modeling industry? The general public does not know these models by name because they are not supermodels. They are just a pretty face. They may be supermodels to us, to those who follow fashion/modeling very closely. But to your older sisters, your fellow peers who don't buy magazines for the sake of seeing McNeil's editorial, but for the sake of seeing what will be in next season, they aren't supermodels. To them, supermodels are Heidi, Naomi, Tyra, Linda. (And all of them do have boobs, and hips, and curves, and are not ridiculously thin.) Those are supermodels to the general public, not these girls who's careers we follow and that's why I don't feel that these girls who we speak of in this thread actually affect what women feel is perceived as beauty all that much. If anything, Hollywood is the biggest culprit in pushing what beauty should look like, not the modeling industry, simply because Hollywood is a monster of big names. People know Charlize Theron, Amy Winehouse, Jessica Simpson, etc., etc. by name.

I hope I am making sense. Jeez. What I mean to say, basically, is that most of the super thing girls... yes, it's a shame that they are this thin and some, more than likely unhealthy. But do they influence women (of the general public) to grow thinner? I don't think so, no.

That's true, but someone finds it attractive, someone likes it and that's a problem. Chanel Iman is very skinny and she's becoming more of a household name (her name is often mentioned along with her ethnic background and summary of her life next to editorials), she could be considered a "role model" to many young, impressionable girls could she not? Along with Karlie Kloss who Teen Vogue seems obsessed with helping her 15 minutes last a little longer. To those who care about fashion (like myself, Grunged, and I would assume you) it does matter what these models look like because they are directly involved with the fashion industry.

[cestmagique]

Originally Posted by Grunged

And you know what, intelligence has a lot to do with it. I don't know of anyone who would want to adopt this body image unless they had no knowledge of how unhealthy it is and/or lacked knowledge of anything overall and just felt that they weren't worth anything more than trying to have a 21 inch waist. When I said "smart" I didn't mean book smarts, I meant someone that has a healthy mindset and is knowledgeable that body images like that are not healthy by any means nor do they send out a healthy message.

Ah, I knew I loved this thread. Look, I wasn't trying to piss you off, I'd just appreciate it if everyone (you, me, everyone) could be civil rather than hostile; it makes it much easier to voice opinions. No one needs to go for the throat.

My point was, of course someone with a healthy mindset wouldn't be bothered, but intelligence (book smarts or otherwise) and vulnerability to messed up societal cues are not mutually exclusive. There are plenty of highly intelligent anorexics, I'm sure.

[icelynn]

I don't really see the situation as hostile. Everyone here is just voicing their opinion, there's no cussing, name calling or anything.

[Grunged]

Originally Posted by cestmagique

Ah, I knew I loved this thread. Look, I wasn't trying to piss you off, I'd just appreciate it if everyone (you, me, everyone) could be civil rather than hostile; it makes it much easier to voice opinions. No one needs to go for the throat.

My point was, of course someone with a healthy mindset wouldn't be bothered, but intelligence (book smarts or otherwise) and vulnerability to messed up societal cues are not mutually exclusive. There are plenty of highly intelligent anorexics, I'm sure.

Lmao are you serious? When and where in my posts did I seem like I was pissed off? I am not and have never been hostile in this thread, maybe it's just my disgust bleeding through my posts that makes it seem that way.

Highly intelligent anorexics? Yeah, there are some, just like there are highly intelligent serial killers, prostitutes, drug addicts but that's another story. Anyways, didn't I say that I didn't mean book smarts? I said I meant a healthy mindset, maybe I should just shut up because nobody is comprehending what I say.

[izzie stevens]

^^^^ It does matter what they look like. I'm not saying that it doesn't. What I am saying is that the general public doesn't even know who most of these girls are. And you're right, Chanel is being pushed down our throats. And she is super thin... But if you're child is reading editorials in magazines suited for adults, then really, you need to be controlling what your child is buying/reading. Karlie in Teen Vogue, I don't see anything wrong with. In my opinion, she's no where near as skinny as the girls mentioned in this thread.

Also, as much as we may think that the general public thinks that these super skinny girls are beautiful because of their weight? They really don't. The other day I over heard a conversation outside of a Gap store between a few women who were pointing at a window poster and saying how ridiculously anorexic and skinny Chanel Iman's thighs looked in the Gap shorts she is shown wearing on the ad. And these women? They were fit. It's not as if they were over weight and pointing out the skinny girl in order to pick her apart and feel better about not being a stick figure.

Also... I just want to point out that many women who do have self esteem issues don't develop them because of what they see in editorials and ads. For example... Anorexics aren't likely to have developed anorexia because they spotted Vlada in an editorial and thought her to be beautiful, and wanted to be just like her. No. These women/girls who are anorexic? They have self esteem issues, issues that affect their thinking, emotional issues, psychological issues and these issues cause they to want to become thin. A lot of them will say that they want to become thin because they want to disappear. They want to be so thin that they won't be noticed. It's not that the media has shoved being thin down their throats, no. That's not where it begun for a lot of them. (Although I am sure that there is some cases out there. Never say never, right?)

I think that a lot of people, when they think of "thinspiration," they think that models and the industry is to blame, and that's not quite true. Anorexics may use models as thinspiration, but it's highly unlikely and very rare for an anorexic to have become anorexic due to the images that they have used as thinspiration. Before many anorexics get to the point of looking for thinspiration in these models? Their problem with weight issues is already present.

On the other hand, I do agree that many of these super thin/young girls should not be modeling. It's not good for them at all.

[Starry_Night]

It's true that Hollywood influences the general public more than say Vlada. However, models do still play a role in society's ideal of beauty. Many teenage girls and young women buy vogue, bazaar, w, elle, etc. Even though the vast majority of those girls will have absolutely no idea as to who the models they are frequently seeing are, one cannot erase the fact that while flipping through the pages of their favorite magazines, these young women will be exposed to the glorification of hyper-thin models through the ads, the runway snaps, and the editorials.
Much like the images and messages which are ingrained in our heads through repetitious advertisements, the notion that hyper-thin is beautiful, which is presented the fashion industry, will eventually stick in the minds of impressionable young women. On top of that, models can be seen in gossip magazines like Us, People, Star, etc. in different ads, so avoiding fashion oriented magazines will not allow one to escape the images of thin models. Therefore, more likely than not, there are many people in america who have seen Lily Donaldson, Daria Werbowy, Gemma Ward, etc. many, many times, without actually realizing it.
On top of that, it appears that hollywood has become more and more interested and influenced by fashion. As the models have grown thinner, it appears that young hollywood has downsized with it. It's no surprised that the thinnest celebrities are often the ones who are most interested in fashion (and who are also most frequently pictured at fashion shows). Therefore, the public is influenced by the hyper-thin model craze either directly, or indirectly.

[icelynn]

Originally Posted by izzie stevens

^^^^ It does matter what they look like. I'm not saying that it doesn't. What I am saying is that the general public doesn't even know who most of these girls are. And you're right, Chanel is being pushed down our throats. And she is super thin... But if you're child is reading editorials in magazines suited for adults, then really, you need to be controlling what your child is buying/reading. Karlie in Teen Vogue, I don't see anything wrong with. In my opinion, she's no where near as skinny as the girls mentioned in this thread.

True, but there are also articles about her in Teen Vogue as well and for some reason they think she's someone to look up to. To me, you have to do something to be considered a role model, not just be acclaimed for not falling down drunk or dancing on tables.

Also, as much as we may think that the general public thinks that these super skinny girls are beautiful because of their weight? They really don't. The other day I over heard a conversation outside of a Gap store between a few women who were pointing at a window poster and saying how ridiculously anorexic and skinny Chanel Iman's thighs looked in the Gap shorts she is shown wearing on the ad. And these women? They were fit. It's not as if they were over weight and pointing out the skinny girl in order to pick her apart and feel better about not being a stick figure.

Ughh I've seen those billboards in Gap, she looks ridiculously thin so I agree with those women. But once again, the point is why is the fashion industry (everyone included here, designers, editors, agents etc) promoting this look? Most people who buy these clothes can't achieve the model look without unhealthy eating and exercise habits. Why is it appealing?

I think that a lot of people, when they think of "thinspiration," they think that models and the industry is to blame, and that's not quite true. Anorexics may use models as thinspiration, but it's highly unlikely and very rare for an anorexic to have become anorexic due to the images that they have used as thinspiration. Before many anorexics get to the point of looking for thinspiration in these models? Their problem with weight issues is already present.

But the fashion industry supports it. Otherwise, why use a 29 inch bust or 21 inch waist or 32 inch hips for their runway show? And after all, they're just measurments, not humans anymore to the designers and agents.

[Mchunu]

it's getting hot in hurr..so take off all your clothes (& posts)

[izzie stevens]

^^^^ The fashion industry supports the use of these thin models, yes. But what does that have to do with a girl leading herself to anorexia due to these super thin models when really, the likelyhood of a girl who isn't following the modeling industry closely knowing who Vlada/Chanel/etc. are is very low? That's the connection I am not seeing.

And yeah, that shot of Chanel in the Gap ad isn't good at all. Her thighs really do look super thin. But, as far as why the fashion industry uses these models? I don't know, really. I haven't the slightest clue. I'm in no way saying that I think it's right that they do, I don't. I am just saying that I think, to the general public, the culprit is more so Hollywood than the fashion industry.

Originally Posted by Starry_Night

It's true that Hollywood influences the general public more than say Vlada. However, models do still play a role in society's ideal of beauty. Many teenage girls and young women buy vogue, bazaar, w, elle, etc. Even though the vast majority of those girls will have absolutely no idea as to who the models they are frequently seeing are, one cannot erase the fact that while flipping through the pages of their favorite magazines, these young women will be exposed to the glorification of hyper-thin models through the ads, the runway snaps, and the editorials.
Much like the images and messages which are ingrained in our heads through repetitious advertisements, the notion that hyper-thin is beautiful, which is presented the fashion industry, will eventually stick in the minds of impressionable young women. On top of that, models can be seen in gossip magazines like Us, People, Star, etc. in different ads, so avoiding fashion oriented magazines will not allow one to escape the images of thin models. Therefore, more likely than not, there are many people in america who have seen Lily Donaldson, Daria Werbowy, Gemma Ward, etc. many, many times, without actually realizing it.
On top of that, it appears that hollywood has become more and more interested and influenced by fashion. As the models have grown thinner, it appears that young hollywood has downsized with it. It's no surprised that the thinnest celebrities are often the ones who are most interested in fashion (and who are also most frequently pictured at fashion shows). Therefore, the public is influenced by the hyper-thin model craze either directly, or indirectly.

How many women do you think really read Vogue to see the models as opposed to seeing the clothing? Most women who read Vogue/Elle/Vanity Fair/etc. don't even notice who is modeling what. They are looking at the clothing. And when in Vogue/Elle/Vanity Fair/etc. have you seen any super thin models looking as ridiculously thin as they do in their polas or on the runway? In all actuality, models only really look that thin and drained in their polas/on the runway. And how many women of the general public actually sign on Getty Images or First View to see runway shots?

[iluvjeisa]

Originally Posted by Grunged

I'm not sure, but she could be 13 and her age still would not justify her being a working model with those measurements.

But it does....of course kids have different measurements than grown women.

[Grunged]

That wasn't my point, you obviously didn't get what I meant. "she could be 13 and her age still would not justify her being a working model with those measurements", you made it like I said "her age will not justify her measurements." which I clearly did not say.

[iluvjeisa]

Originally Posted by Grunged

That wasn't my point, you obviously didn't get what I meant. "she could be 13 and her age still would not justify her being a working model with those measurements", you made it like I said "her age will not justify her measurements." which I clearly did not say.

Yeah, actually, I just realized that

[Starry_Night]

Originally Posted by izzie stevens

^^^^ The fashion industry supports the use of these thin models, yes. But what does that have to do with a girl leading herself to anorexia due to these super thin models when really, the likelyhood of a girl who isn't following the modeling industry closely knowing who Vlada/Chanel/etc. are is very low? That's the connection I am not seeing.

And yeah, that shot of Chanel in the Gap ad isn't good at all. Her thighs really do look super thin. But, as far as why the fashion industry uses these models? I don't know, really. I haven't the slightest clue. I'm in no way saying that I think it's right that they do, I don't. I am just saying that I think, to the general public, the culprit is more so Hollywood than the fashion industry.


How many women do you think really read Vogue to see the models as opposed to seeing the clothing? Most women who read Vogue/Elle/Vanity Fair/etc. don't even notice who is modeling what. They are looking at the clothing. And when in Vogue/Elle/Vanity Fair/etc. have you seen any super thin models looking as ridiculously thin as they do in their polas or on the runway? In all actuality, models only really look that thin and drained in their polas/on the runway. And how many women of the general public actually sign on Getty Images or First View to see runway shots?

I personally know a lot of young women who read vogue. I don't think it's that uncommon for women to read fashion magazines. Specifically women who are in their late teens through their twenties and thirties.
Women who do read fashion magazines do not have to log onto getty in order to see the images of hyper-thin girls on the runway. It's very common for fashion magazines to show runway pictures in each issue. I have seen Olga Sherer, Vlada, Kim, etc many times in Vogue, Bazaar, etc. in runway snaps many times. In fact, I have seen pictures of models on the runway in select issues of Us, Star, People, etc.
Also, regardless of whether or not a reader is paying attention solely to the clothes featured in an editorial, one cannot help but store the image of how the clothes are supposed to look, and what body type is considered the most attractive in order to wear the clothing ideally.

[Mchunu]

Originally Posted by icelynn

Ughh I've seen those billboards in Gap, she looks ridiculously thin so I agree with those women. But once again, the point is why is the fashion industry (everyone included here, designers, editors, agents etc) promoting this look? Most people who buy these clothes can't achieve the model look without unhealthy eating and exercise habits. Why is it appealing?

i'm getting in this conversation a bit late, but i agree.

I even must say that i even detest the fact that people believe that models/celebrities/actresses (& others who simply are in the public eye) are not responsible for the image we have as a people of what is attractive and what is not attractive. It's not so much that models/celebrites/actors etc. are responsible, but those who enable them to get work..i mean, if i was a 14 y/o 100 lbs and 6' girl from a third-world country and a scout told me i could get "x" amout of money by doing this show, this campaing, this editorial..do you think i'd say no? nope

[izzie stevens]

^^ I think you completely mis-read my post because no where did I say that young women don't read magazines... So, I really can't respond to your reply. I was saying that they do read them, but the likelyhood of them reading for the sake of the models as opposed to the clothing is, well, unlikely!