Ok I've finally trawled my way through the two parts to this thread over the past few days. Wow
haha BetteT your input is so invaluable
I'm bracing myself (and my concentration/square eyes) to go onto all the other related threads which I have bookmarked from the posts here! I just have one question before I leave this one...
If you're shooting for an editorial, the general consensus (I'm based in London, I think the rate is the same as the US) is that you get paid nothing, or next to nothing. But how about the expense of it all? I've interned at a few magazines and assisted a couple of stylists. Returning all that stuff is not cheap! Especially if you're returning to Paris/NY/Milan, or returning precious items that need to be couriered same day and signed for etc in London. Also, posting things back to other parts of the UK has proved to be freaking expensive too. And then of course, there's getting to and from the shoot, which in London usually means lots of cars being booked (it's very rare for people to drive themselves around here - too expensive, too hard to find parking, too much congestion on the roads already yadda yadda)
As far as freelancing for the bigger magazines goes, I've seen the stylists assistants come in and prep the clothes/organise returns themselves and instruct the interns, so that the interns are basically returning everything as they normally would with the in-house staffs' returns, at the expense of the publishing company. And in some of these magazines, most notably the one I'm in and out of interning right now, they actually have a separate booking team, who organise the models and stylists and photographers and make-up and location and catering and travel/hotels etc. They liaise with the editors about what photogs and models they would like to shoot with (big names here, and some of them are very particular about who they
don't want to work with) but as far as the freelancers go, I'm not so sure how it works? I know that they have regular contributors that will just come in to do a story now and then, but I don't know if the bookers speak to that stylist and say who do you want to work with? (photog and make up wise) or if the photographer is booked first and they get to choose - as suggested in this thread - as after all, these stylists
are regular contributors and the ones who actually come into the office to put all their things on their rails (or at least their assistants do) and have run-throughs with the editors. Sometimes fittings too, with the photog present. Nevertheless, the stylist and their assistant are the ones more frequently in and out of the offices and in contact with the rest of the team. Therefore, I don't see why the photographers commissioned by the magazine would be the only ones who get a say in who styles the story? I think at this publication and some of the others I've worked at, all these people are at the top of their game anyway so will have crossed paths at some point or another and will know who they do and don't like to work with. I'm just not sure if the booking editor/fashion director/EIC have a process of deciding on the photographer/stylist they want to bring in first? or if it changes. I mean, I think it's fairly well known that some big name photographers (Patrick?) have multi-million dollar contracts (with Conde and the like) meaning they have to shoot a certain number of editorials for their magazines per year, so that will make some decisions for them automatically. I just wonder if any of their contributing fashion editors (stylists) might have the same contractual agreement? So many questions!
Ok I'm going off tangent giving more of an insight and not asking my
original Q. Which is, say you want to style an ed for an indie/niche fashion magazine (we seem to have tons of them in London) and you're pretty fresh in the whole styling business, well I personally would be happy to shoot free of pay for the tears and to say 'I've styled an editorial for XYZ mag' rather than 'All I have here is tests but...'
But in this case, I'm still confused at to whether A) the magazine would always be responsible for the clothes I pull should anything happen to them, as per the pull letters and discussions in this thread... and
whether the magazine are responsible for any expenses incurred by working on the editorial?
I would have to spend money either on my own travel going to showrooms, and/or re-imbursing my intern's travel expenses for every day that they work with me should I need an extra helping hand, and the biggest costs of all - getting to and from the shoot with all the clothes and gear, and getting everything returned to the showrooms/stores/designers afterwards. I don't care so much about being paid for the work itself, but those expenses build up and I wouldn't want to end up being out of pocket for it.
It's hard enough to get by doing unpaid work for so long while you build up your book, reputation and contacts, and it's hard enough investing in things like business cards and steamers and prop kits, but then using your own money (which you don't even have to begin with) to fund all those shoot expenses is just not economically viable is it? I think it's so easy to get exploited in this industry, and the amount of people jumping into this thread seeking advice is merely a scratch on the amount of people who are really trying to find their way in this business, and probably being taken for a ride out of naivety and desperation. Sadly, the more vulnerable people out there being exploited, the harder it is for people to get paid their fees/expenses reimbursed when they are right to, because there are so many people around who will cluelessly do it all free or charge so why would they want to pay someone or pay someone a lot to do the same job (in the beginning especially).
To add to my question about expecting expenses to be covered
at least for unpaid editorial work, when you are doing commercial work or anything that pays at least, do you quote them your fee (day rate + prep and return days), then separately quote them for your predicted expenses
on top of your fee?
Apologies for the most incoherent post of the whole tfs forum
