Junya Watanabe Mens F/W 13.14 Paris

[margielamike2004]

I own this one....which almost looks like a tapestry fabric.

http://forums.thefashionspot.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=567559&d=1292652495

 

[margielamike2004]

This is the tread from 2004 that I'm talking about. There are a few pictures of a solid black jacket where the elbows have been darted and ergonomically curved to fit the arm....also the backside of the jacket has been constructed so as to give more freedom of movement through the shoulders.

http://forums.thefashionspot.com/f60/junya-watanabe-men-f-w-04-05-paris-20042-9.html

 

[margielamike2004]

I'm not saying that I dislike Watanabe. Quite the contraty, actually.

I liked his A/W MAN 2004 collection so much, I invested in buying 5 jackets from just one season.

What I am saying is.....since this collection, and the construction of some of the pieces from THIS collection....he hasn't used any of his highly technical construction capabilities...nothing revolutionary, or constructed in a more modern way.

Most of the collections he's been putting forth for men are more about patch-working techniques.....which is becoming too redundant, season after season.

I'm waiting for him to grow tired of this patchwork concept....and move forward with something more technically constructed FOR MEN......such as he does in his women's collections.

 

[margielamike2004]

Scroll the page down to Post #126 to see the black jacket with the articulated/ergonomic elbows and shoulders that I mentioned, prior.

You'll see what I mean about technical construction....and something considerably more modern than the collection he put forth for A/W 2014.

 

[margielamike2004]

I forgot to add the link so you could see the black jacket. The construction is amazing!!

Scroll down the page to post #126

It's a prior collection from Watanabe MAN.....a/w 2004

http://forums.thefashionspot.com/f60/junya-watanabe-men-f-w-04-05-paris-20042-9.html

 

[runner]

your point was understood with your first three posts in this thread.
please make your posting a bit more compact especially when you are complaining against redundancy and patchwork.
hope junya is checking this and will meet your love and wishes next season.

 

[margielamike2004]

Sorry for being too redundant with my posts, while also being redundant about my complaints about Watanabe and his patchwork.

I was uncertain if I was making myself perfectly clear.....which is why I added links to pictures of prior collections from Watanabe that you could actually SEE....and not just read about.

In regards to this collection, it's also perfectly clear that Watanabe is obviously holding himself back from presenting a collection for men that's a bit more modern in it's approach. He isn't putting forth a collection for men that is constructed to the best of his construction capabilities.....and this collection from F/W 2014 is reflective of that. He could do better, because he's has done better, before.

In comparisons to this collection....F/W 2014.....and his prior A/W 2004 presentation.....it's only logical and sensible to see that his most recent collections are more easy to market, sell, and comprehend.

Men in particular are more responsive and more likely to embrace wearing plaids, stripes, herring-bones.........more "traditional/classic" prints and patterns.

His collection from 2004.....as far as construction, fit, and his choice in colors and patterns...might have been a bit too daring and bold for most men to consider.

I'm not particularly keen on any designer...who puts forth a collection based upon the marketability of a collection....while holding themselves back from putting forth a collection that's a bit more exemplary to their talent.

This collection isn't as awe-inspiring or as thought provoking as the collections from his mentor, Rei Kawakubo...but I think Junya does have the capabilities to do so.

And you're correct, maybe it's simply a matter of his process being gradual and developmental.

But then again, maybe his developmental process has already been established....he's simply waiting for his target audience and admirers (as of late)...to catch up with him.

 

[runner]

for junya, rei is the boss. this is not movable. in his mind it may be eternal even after her future retirement.
when they decided to launch junya man, she didn't say to him anything about artistic/creative directions. but she said some things from management aspects. that is, with the line he is allowed to do whatever but as long as he meets certain sales quota. it's natural that it is a safe/stable line in comparison with homme plus. perhaps junya man has the complemental role so that the company manages to be okay no matter how labile and risky homme plus's creation and business can seasonally be, especially in the midst of this economic gloom. so, if you see junya man getting wild, that should be when the gloom is somewhat being eased at least in his home ground and people including himself feel like being more aberrant ( or when he, awed by your enthusiasm, goes reckless ).

as for what he did with that F/W 2004, though this is just my opinion of course, I didn't see his talent's manifestation particularly in the construction. the shoulder detail in the back of the blazer was something tokito had been known for. the elbow articulation was what ccp had been doing around 2000 ( he started using it again since 2007 ). there must be some others too who had played with those things before. also the fabric choice and fit didn't feel unfamiliar to the CdG (womens as well as mens) fans. each fragment and element alone didn't seem truly revolutionary. but the use of them into his own context. I saw his ability in the art of combination and in the anagram of the contents ever spoken in the CdG language.

 

[margielamike2004]

Thanks, RUNNER!!

I think your info about the partnership between Junya and Rei....as far as the businness aspects between CDGHP and Junya MAN makes perfect sense.

CDGHP can be a bit too much for too many people to handle, or digest.

People (especially men) are more prone to be responsive and comfortable choosing Junya MAN over CDGHP.

Basically.....for the lack of money that HP generates......Junya MAN is (more or less)...like the "cash-cow" that generates more profits for the company.

It's very much like certain designers who don't make a lot of profits from their ready-to-wear collection.......so they create a diffusion collection (more affordable)....or they make most of their profits from perfumes, cologne's, accessories, etc.

Gucci in particular comes to mind. I don't see very many people actually wearing the clothing from Gucci....but I definitely see TONS of men and women wearing Gucci belts, handbags, shoes, sunglasses, etc.

 

[margielamike2004]

And you definitely nailed it with the construction (shoulders, elbows, backside) being very similar to what Carol Christian Poell had been doing prior to Junya F/W 2004.

As you said....many other designers besides CCP has toyed with the concept, too.

A.F. Vandervoorst comes to mind....also Christopher Nemeth, Dirk Schonenberg, Ann Demeulemeester, and even Martin Margiela.

 

[runner]

Basically.....for the lack of money that HP generates......Junya MAN is (more or less)...like the "cash-cow" that generates more profits for the company.

about homme plus, it's just a bit too labile and risky rather than not profitable.
and rei is not only the designer but also the person who is responsible for the life of all the people involved there.

It's very much like certain designers who don't make a lot of profits from their ready-to-wear collection.......so they create a diffusion collection (more affordable)....or they make most of their profits from perfumes, cologne's, accessories, etc.

Gucci in particular comes to mind. I don't see very many people actually wearing the clothing from Gucci....but I definitely see TONS of men and women wearing Gucci belts, handbags, shoes, sunglasses, etc.

strictly speaking, this is not exactly the case because rei really wants men to wear homme plus and actually produces the clothes shown on the runway and fills all her stores with them regardless of whether or not they sell ( also at the showroom seriously tries to sell them to the buyers, that is, the stores others own and run ).
I'd say this is not fake nor mere vanity. this is different from thom browne.
but, as you say, most men wear basics generally, even if some of them secretly want to at least try on something new, free. it's this kind of situation that she has been trying to change. in this regard she is incredibly serious. so she must at first prepare reality (instead of runway fantasy) for your experience and then be waiting for your visit.

that's why junya stands by her stably.

 

[margielamike2004]

Trust me, RUNNER....I know very well how much how the business at CDG.

I work here at a boutique on Newbury Street in Boston....and along with the owner the store....I go along with him to do the buying for our store.

At the showroom, practically every piece from the runway....and also some pieces not shown..... including shoes and accessories are available for purchase.

I also him my boss with the buying of Junya Watanabe.....amongst several other designers we market in our store.

The name of the small boutique is called Riccardi.

Whenever were on a buying trip.....we all have to decide which pieces will sell in a city such as Boston. Basically, "knowing your market and clientele."

A client in NYC is most likely going to be more responsive to a Garcons pieces that is considerably less conservative than someone in more conservative Boston.

It's a matter of trying to get our customers and clients more comfortable with what we have to offer from the designers we have.

 

[softgrey]

i am seriously jealous of all the guys who get to wear these amazing clothes...
especially the jackets and coats...

i just watched the video here-
http://vimeo.com/58385256
so many amazing details from the back as well as the front...

honestly- i don't even know how one chooses which one(s) to own because there are
SO many good ones...

 

[softgrey]

mike- as a retailer, i would think that having a collection that is so easy to wear (ie:SELL) would not exactly be something to complain about...

and i don't think we can fault Junya for being 'too Junya'...
it's his design language and as far as I am concerned he expresses his point of view beautifully using the language that he has developed and refined throughout the years...



i'm not sure the world is looking for brocade or tapestry jackets just now...

 

[runner]

Trust me, RUNNER....I know very well how much how the business at CDG.

I work here at a boutique on Newbury Street in Boston....and along with the owner the store....I go along with him to do the buying for our store.

At the showroom, practically every piece from the runway....and also some pieces not shown..... including shoes and accessories are available for purchase.

I also him my boss with the buying of Junya Watanabe.....amongst several other designers we market in our store.

The name of the small boutique is called Riccardi.

Whenever were on a buying trip.....we all have to decide which pieces will sell in a city such as Boston. Basically, "knowing your market and clientele."

A client in NYC is most likely going to be more responsive to a Garcons pieces that is considerably less conservative than someone in more conservative Boston.

It's a matter of trying to get our customers and clients more comfortable with what we have to offer from the designers we have.

although I don't know how your city is conservative honestly, I think she is fortunate and grateful for your introducing her clothes over there.

if the pieces used/shown on her runway are 200, the entire collection for one season consists of 600 approximately, since each style could have a couple of variations (moreover, another couple multiplication considering color variations etc). they all basically go into production. putting her belief into practice requires intuition in the right brain and method in the left.

 

[runner]

cool-trans.net

.