Numéro Switzerland Issue #1

[blueorchid]

Yeah, sure. I guess saying "straight men can be sent to jail, even innocent, because we are breathing" is... what figure of speech exactly? Hyperbole verging on hysteria?

Also, why should people with a history of the behaviour Testino, et al. have been accused of be welcomed back with a "blank page" anyway? Has Testino taken any accountability for his actions? Has he made any amends? Has he SINCERELY apologized? Taken actions to prevent this from happening in the future? Testino isn't a photographer I've followed on purpose, so maybe he has. I'm not saying he has to go live out his life in obscurity in a cave, but c'mon. If you don't want to face the consequences of your own actions... maybe make better choices.

 

[Alquimista]

Testino's cover is so beautiful

 

[Bertrando3]

Yeah, sure. I guess saying "straight men can be sent to jail, even innocent, because we are breathing" is... what figure of speech exactly? Hyperbole verging on hysteria?

Also, why should people with a history of the behaviour Testino, et al. have been accused of be welcomed back with a "blank page" anyway? Has Testino taken any accountability for his actions? Has he made any amends? Has he SINCERELY apologized? Taken actions to prevent this from happening in the future? Testino isn't a photographer I've followed on purpose, so maybe he has. I'm not saying he has to go live out his life in obscurity in a cave, but c'mon. If you don't want to face the consequences of your own actions... maybe make better choices.

I'm not his lawyer nor a highest grammarian to debate on the hyperbole of things LOL hence my first question earlier: if, like Weber and the likes, he is allowed to come back after spending some time away from the highest spheres of fashion; but understand this Sherlock, like I said: I've been in this for 20 years and he's clearly not the only photographer in the fashion industry to have been accused and won't be the last one (Hollywood and many other areas of this world is full of dangerous people with tremendous power to use it on the young and innocent) but as the justice system says, at least in democratic countries : innocent until proven guilty.

 

[blueorchid]

Okay, so… because other people get away with bad behavior… everyone else should be able to? Because historically the fashion industry tolerates it? Right… it’s so weird how people in industries, such as yourself, shrug and tolerate it as if it’s a normal thing lol. Innocent until proven guilty in A COURT OF LAW is not the same thing as “innocent”. I’ll never understand how people can work in industries where this is tolerated, probably even encouraged.

 

[Bertrando3]

Okay, so… because other people get away with bad behavior… everyone else should be able to? Because historically the fashion industry tolerates it? Right… it’s so weird how people in industries, such as yourself, shrug and tolerate it as if it’s a normal thing lol. Innocent until proven guilty in A COURT OF LAW is not the same thing as “innocent”. I’ll never understand how people can work in industries where this is tolerated, probably even encouraged.

Nope, erh you tried but didn't win this one; it's ok : you can't always win in life.
Don't try to transform my words:
- by no means did I say that since it's being done elsewhere then it should be accepted
- neither did I say that ''we'' need to tolerate it either
I was simply asking a rhetorical question whether or not Testino should be welcome back like others.
What I also said was that it's common practise in many areas of the professional spheres to ''accept'' or ''amend'' or ''excuse'' or ''welcome'' back people who did wrong. Still, I have no proofs he did or didn't do what he was accused of.
I think these forums still are a ''free speech platform to ask questions''.

 

[testinofan]

Enough already, leave personal things with professional things, nobody went to court and we know that the fashion world became too conservative and politically correct, because of this situation everything became boring, surely your Helmut Newton would be alive and would be accused, those were other times and nobody is so innocent, if someone takes advantage of me in a bed as they accuse him because I went back to work with him and photos in a bed naked, is time to mario back

 

[versustito]

I love Helena editorial !!

 

[BlueRuin]

Enough already, leave personal things with professional things, nobody went to court and we know that the fashion world became too conservative and politically correct, because of this situation everything became boring, surely your Helmut Newton would be alive and would be accused, those were other times and nobody is so innocent, if someone takes advantage of me in a bed as they accuse him because I went back to work with him and photos in a bed naked, is time to mario back

lol Mario, is that you?

He used his professional career as a means to sexually assault many men. You don’t have to go to court for it to be true. His actions were one of the worst kept secrets along with that of Bruce Weber and Terry Richardson. Everyone in the industry knew and turned a blind eye until the me too movement allowed victims to finally feel safe to come forward.

There are plenty of talented photographers who don’t sexually assault people so no he shouldn’t be welcomed back. He had his “fun” and made tons of money doing it.

 

[testinofan]

lol Mario, is that you?

He used his professional career as a means to sexually assault many men. You don’t have to go to court for it to be true. His actions were one of the worst kept secrets along with that of Bruce Weber and Terry Richardson. Everyone in the industry knew and turned a blind eye until the me too movement allowed victims to finally feel safe to come forward.

There are plenty of talented photographers who don’t sexually assault people so no he shouldn’t be welcomed back. He had his “fun” and made tons of money doing it.

When you make a complaint it must be made in court and with evidence, otherwise anyone can smear others, every complaint is supported by justice, the world has become too moralistic and boring, and politically correct, rumors are not evidence, you should study.

 

[kokobombon]

^in this type of case, the victim's account is evidence enough for the police (if the victim chooses to prosecute)*. It should be enough for the rest of us.
It's more complicated than saying you went back and got naked so it's on you (victim shaming much?), specially with this difference in power.
Let's say he was prosecuted, found guilty, went to jail, completed his sentence and now he's free and wants to come back to work: it's on us as consumers to choose, and magazines/brands to take that gamble... we saw what happened with movies, people stopped going to the cinema to watch accused men (Kevin Spacey), I don't know if the fashion world wants the possible social media backlash or more decrease in sales.
I think that he's back on this debut magazine because any publicity is good publicity so even backlash gets people talking about the magazine.
Anyway, his cover sucks imo and that little blurb on IG is practically an insult.

*source: It happened some time ago

 

[testinofan]

^in this type of case, the victim's account is evidence enough for the police (if the victim chooses to prosecute)*. It should be enough for the rest of us.
It's more complicated than saying you went back and got naked so it's on you (victim shaming much?), specially with this difference in power.
Let's say he was prosecuted, found guilty, went to jail, completed his sentence and now he's free and wants to come back to work: it's on us as consumers to choose, and magazines/brands to take that gamble... we saw what happened with movies, people stopped going to the cinema to watch accused men (Kevin Spacey), I don't know if the fashion world wants the possible social media backlash or more decrease in sales.
I think that he's back on this debut magazine because any publicity is good publicity so even backlash gets people talking about the magazine.
Anyway, his cover sucks imo and that little blurb on IG is practically an insult.

*source: It happened some time ago

In the first case, there is no police report and justice has not worked by default, no accused has come forward, this is not the case of Weber or Terry
Because of such linear and inclusive thinking and so full of cheap values, they are making the world of fashion a boring world,
eg surely everyone still watches Woody Allen and Roman Polanski movies, old Miramax movies, cheap hypocrisy

 

[kokobombon]

^the point was that the victim's allegation is enough. And me personally, would rather err on the side of the victim.
Surely thinking that he might be a predator but takes such pretty pictures so let's forgive and forget is quite the cheap value, I prefer not to go there myself 😅

imo Testino or Weber not working is not why the fashion world is where it's at now, some of my old favorite photographers like Sims, McDean or even I&V are simply not producing the quality work they used to. I think it's more that fashion is mistaken on its target...

 

[blueorchid]

eg surely everyone still watches Woody Allen and Roman Polanski movies, old Miramax movies, cheap hypocrisy

Well, they haven't been "found guilty," either... so why are you bringing them up! They're as innocent as Testino!

 

[testinofan]

^the point was that the victim's allegation is enough. And me personally, would rather err on the side of the victim.
Surely thinking that he might be a predator but takes such pretty pictures so let's forgive and forget is quite the cheap value, I prefer not to go there myself 😅

imo Testino or Weber not working is not why the fashion world is where it's at now, some of my old favorite photographers like Sims, McDean or even I&V are simply not producing the quality work they used to. I think it's more that fashion is mistaken on its target...

I prefer people who create art and not people who accuse without proof, where the parameters are different and today even looking is wrong, the world has become something stupid.

 

[blueorchid]

I prefer people who create art and not people who accuse without proof, where the parameters are different and today even looking is wrong, the world has become something stupid.

We can hardly call Testino's photography before he was "cancelled" art...

 

[avonlea002]

I haven't followed Testino's case but I am just happy someone stopped his awfully retouched tacky photographs from polluting magazine pages lol.

 

[MagFan]

^same was I with Demarchelier. His banal lazy photographs were in every Vogue

 

[testinofan]

We can hardly call Testino's photography before he was "cancelled" art...

Art is evrething! With that thought, after Michelangelo, nothing could be called art. Whether you like it or not, that is subjective.