For Male Models, It is Game Over

Discussion in 'Fashion... In Depth' started by ThatDudeOverTher, Jul 24, 2017.

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  1. ThatDudeOverTher

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    Came across this interesting piece today on the state of the male modeling industry (sector within industry?) which is largely irrelevant. It's interesting to read about how agencies are adapting to all these social media changes and that scandalous bit on an agency acting more like an escort service?? :shock:

    bonneny.com
     
  2. dodencebt

    dodencebt Well-Known Member

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    Not surprising at all. This all started with womenswear anyway at the beginning of this second decade - the rise of the instamodels, casting girls that can't walk for shows which less than ten years ago required strength and pizzazz.
     
  3. IloveDiorHomme

    IloveDiorHomme Active Member

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    Yes, male models from these days are not the same as the ones from the 00's, 90's or 80's. They all don't look like CK underwear models anymore. You can still find fit & Abercrombie style models walking for many shows ( Versace, Armani, Balmain, Jeremy Scott etc) though. Male fashion carries more diversity of bodies than years ago. And not all the girl have a crush on muscled macho guys, no ?

    The idea of "model" is wrong anyway. Because the customer will rarely have the body of a model. Either statuesque or skinny, all those models used by designers embody an ideal of body that is not real. So I am not shocked.

    And it's the same with female models. We used to have bombshells and now most of the it-models are extra-skinny, pale, fragile looking teens. I'm still surprised when I follow a model on Instagram to see how she can look on the runway ( sexual object, cinched, on high heels ) and out of the runway ( quirky girl next door ).


    Maybe those models have no with no charisma, and we dont have the time to know their charisma, because they are picked to be forgotten easily and replaced after 3 seasons. That said, male models last longer because society still finds a grown man in his 30's, 40's, 50's sexy and are likely to get more opportunities as they grow old.
     
    #3 IloveDiorHomme, Jul 25, 2017
    Last edited by moderator zouzou: Jul 25, 2017
  4. Bertrando3

    Bertrando3 Active Member

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    This has to be one of the very best articles I have ever read in my life that summons extremely well the reality of men´s modeling nowadays and what it used to be in the golden era of the 90´s, the words he used, the references he made, the names he dropped, the changes in agencies: EVERYTHING was accurate and sooooo true!!!
     
  5. Pricciao

    Pricciao Active Member

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    One particular key changing event is the rave of alternative model agency rising in 2011. It was the time , synchronizingly, from Georgio Armani to Raf Simons, Anna Sui to Rick Owens started favoring TIAD type of street looking models over. The social media game was less of a factor in male modeling market changes. It happened in the early 2013 that noted models of the previous season got completely wiped out by a new gang in the next season, when the social game didn't started until Lucky Blue started his modeling life around 2015. But it sure did hit a crucial strike.
     
    #5 Pricciao, Sep 22, 2017
    Last edited by moderator joepkje: Sep 22, 2017
  6. arvage

    arvage Member

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    Sorry but this is all just blabber from an inexperienced writer.

    I'll try to come up with hard FACTS(TM) to support my argument instead of just taking everything at face value.

    I for one AM GLAD that male models today need not the body of a beautifully sculpted Greek statue to get jobs. There's still a market for those types of models but it's nice for the industry to be INCLUSIVE for once. That fantasy should be extinguished as it is unrealistic. Time to get our heads out of the cloud and buckle down to what's realistically attainable.

    Men's fashion has been excruciatingly drab? Well I'm sorry if guys don't dress up like a Brooks Brothers mannequin EVERYTIME they go out. And do they HAVE TO wear high tier designer brands? Argue all you want about Supreme but it's what caters to a large population of men of all age groups. There's still the occasional GUCCI sneaker thrown in there, an LV cross body. For the more avantgarde, something from Comme des Garcon SHIRT perhaps or Balenciaga or even Dries van Noten. I think men are spending more and more designer brands rather than grabbing something from Adidas or Nike and go. I for one think men's fashion is exciting with brands like Gosha Rubchinskiy and JW Anderson.

    Please name those Other Shows that cast guys directly from the street. Even brands like Acne Studios, Sunnei, Christian Dada, Palm Angels ALL GO TO AN AGENCY AND BOOK MODELS THERE

    And I hate it when everyone blames the "Social Media Star". The only Social Media Star in campaign right now that I know of is for Dolce and Gabbana.

    Neil Barrett? Willow Barret 2k Instagram followers and William Allen 755 followers

    Dior Homme? Christophe t'Kint 1k followers, Dylan Roques, a house favorite, 6k followers.

    Louis Vuitton? Luc Defont 5k followers

    Calvin Klein? Jonas Gloer 10k followers, Jared Manhardt 1.2k, Luc Defont 5.2k, Fernando Albaladejo 2.5k followers

    Prada? other than Jonas Gloer
    Kaissan Ibrahima 982 followers, Joaquim Arnell 1.6k followers

    Coach? Oscar Kindelan 12.5k followers

    Gucci? Lorens Miklasevics 500 followers

    Now for those models bordering on 10k and above followers you might think WOW! A FOLLOWING! but those are just peanuts when compared to the hundred Ks of social media stars and yet brands never took them in for a campaign.

    "Models now must have considerable follower counts on social media to book jobs" Please refer to the above and tell me if they have considerable follower count. Oh you meant runway? Let's take a look!

    Finnlay Davis, 1st most booked male model, 15.3k followers

    Willow Barrett, 2nd most, as previously mentioned 2k followers.

    Dylan Fender, 3rd, 7.5k followers

    Myles Dominique, 4th, 1.1k followers, Burberry campaign

    Kohei Takabatake, 5th, now keep in mind this guy is really new, 1.6k followers
    BUT
    he has walked:
    Tommy x Gigi which is supposed to be a social media starfest
    Emporio Armani which is supposed to be fit, gentleman vibes
    Dolce and Gabbana (SURPRISE!) social media starfest
    FENDI
    Valentino
    Balenciaga which is supposed to be TIAD type
    Coach
    Calvin Klein

    To conclude, MALE MODELS ARE FINE AND ARE RELEVANT. You sure as hell don't need a social media following that people are so quick to point at. Brands like Saint Laurent and GUCCI don't even pick male models that are in-demand among male models. So what male models aren't muscly guys that have basic Armani faces. I welcome the diversity and this article is horribly misinformed.
     
    #6 arvage, Sep 22, 2017
    Last edited by moderator savvyelegance: Sep 22, 2017
  7. modela

    modela Active Member

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    How is the writer horribly misinformed?He gets his information from the people who work within the industry .Male models are indeed not fine and not relevant anymore .The male models will be the first to confirm that.Look at how mens fashionweek is on its last legs , mens fashionmagazines are closing down with no other mensmag coming to take their place.This also isnt about diversity/asthetic either which seems to be your core point.With the rise of the social media star fashioncompanies have seen a way of cutting costs down and raising their profits .The models are the first ones to feel that pinch.There is a reason why there is such a high turnover amongst male models and why their dayrate has gone lower and lower.
     
  8. modela

    modela Active Member

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  9. arvage

    arvage Member

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    I would accept your argument if you've provided me with facts. Again, there are no brands to back you up there. Prada has a cast that's majority new and unknown even amongst male models, GUCCI constantly uses roughly the same models over and over again (Bakay Diaby, Oliver Hayes, Xie Cheng Lin), Saint Laurent picked completely fresh faces (Louis Marzin, Dalibor Urosevic) for both campaign and runway. Where are the brands using social media stars other than Dolce and Gabbana?
     
  10. ThatDudeOverTher

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    You refer to the writer as inexperienced and the piece blabber and yet you fail to present a strong case to defend your position. Newsflash, the $2 trillion dollar fashion industry isn't made up of only these top 10 brands you keep bringing up.

    If the writer has his information wrong, then so does everyone who works in the industry, including the male models, because they all say the same thing. :rolleyes:
     
  11. arvage

    arvage Member

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    I may be wrong. I can and will admit to that as soon as I see actual proof. Name me the brands that use socmed stars. Everyone's saying it but is it really happening? Back up your statements with much more solid proof than "the writer works in the industry" As far as these 10 brands go, they ARE NOT hiring social media stars.

    You yourself said "the $2 trillion dollar fashion industry isn't made up of only these top 10 brands you keep bringing up." The writer has raised how many brands? Let's see. Balmain and Dolce and Gabbana. Chanel is irrelevant because no male models. FENDI? Nicolas Ripoll as campaign, 12.9k followers, measly comparison towards socmed stars and NO socmed stars for runway. So you want to take the mention of 2 brands over my 10 to be a more accurate representation? Okay.

    And yes there are other brands out there, but if the big ones aren't doing it, why would the smaller ones do?

    Let's take H&M
    Thibaud Charon (a model with 0 social media) is the star of the main campaign

    UNIQLO?
    Roberto Sipos, 23k followers, decent following but still nowhere near as socmed stars.

    TOPMAN?
    Benoit Michel, a TIAD model, 871 followers. Alton Mason, 30k followers. Alton blew up starting purely from modelling and that GUCCI campaign as well as FILA with Dilone. Roberts Semjonovs, 1056 followers.

    Yes the casting directors may ask how many followers the models have BUT by the looks of the campaigns and runways, I say, most of it are unaffected. and again I'm not just making up random points, I have facts to prove my point. The writer raised the statement of runways being street casted (what brands?) and having runway jobs casting social media stars. As far as all the runway shows go, unless it's Tommy Hilfiger, Balmain or Dolce and Gabbana, the other $2trillion of that industry are NOT doing socmed stars for their runway or campaigns.
     
  12. billiejbob

    billiejbob Active Member

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    Male modelling is dead. The writer has hit the nail on the head.
    The only male "supermodel" I can think of who is relevant today is Jon Kortajarena. Other than that there is no one. David Gandy last decade along with Matthias L etc but today ask the random person to name a male model and they'll be stumped.

    Like what the article says, mens fashion is so boring and drab. Most relevant brands in mens fashion pretty much only produce suits and nice semi-casual wear like Armani or Ralph Lauren. Other than that the average consumer doesn't care. The only people who buy over the top mens wear (ie pieces from Balmain and DG) are a very small handful of celebrities (ie Kanye) as well as fashion bloggers (ie Bryan Boy).
     
  13. arvage

    arvage Member

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    It isn't dead. It moved on. The term "supermodel" for males is no longer relevant. You can't have one model portray hundreds of different brands in an age where fashion is out-differentiating one another. You want a Gucci boy? Think Jack Chambers or Alton Mason. Calvin Klein? Jonas Gloer or Fernando Albaladejo. All of this information is out there ... (***edited). They haven't worked for a brand outside their muses for a long time.
     
    #13 arvage, Sep 23, 2017
    Last edited by moderator Natasa: Sep 23, 2017
  14. thefashionisto

    thefashionisto New Member

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    I think the point is more so that no one cares. Before the social media craze took over, you had models that had a fabulous launch season by dominating the runway and then booking several campaigns. Models of that calibre have been replaced by social media friendly models like Jordan Barrett, Luka Sabbat, or Lucky Blue Smith. While a model like Jonas Gloer may have an impressive portfolio, it's not going to land him the type of press the latter generates.

    Finally, what are the chances that this current generation of "traditional models" is going to turn out a Clément Chabernaud or Sean O'Pry?
     
  15. arvage

    arvage Member

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    I see the point of everyone not caring. That argument is valid but for people in the know of the male modelling industry, these campaigns and runway jobs happen for a reason and if you pay attention you'll know which models are being booked again and again, which agency hosts the best model to book from etc. It's exciting for me but not the general public. So it's a very niche interest in today's age where every kind of information is thrown at you at every possible angle.

    But for the social media friendly models, see that's where it gets very conflicting. While Jonas Gloer doesn't generate that much press, his face is seen more on the catwalk and campaigns than the 3 you mentioned. In my opinon, I think the social media star epidemic is blown way out of proportion (in the male model department). No, they're not booked for shows everywhere. No, they're not the faces of that many campaigns. Therefore, they aren't replaced.

    But because they generate such a buzz, people think that male models are replaced but tune into any of the shows aired during men's (or even women's for that matter) fashion week and see if they are actually walking. I can open a magazine right now and see Cameron Dallas for D&G. But not for Coach, GUCCI, Dior Homme, Calvin Klein, Prada, Neil Barrett, Loewe, Juun.J, VERSACE, Saint Laurent, Louis Vuitton, Ferragamo, Paul Smith. Those brands are still using traditional models.

    Also, while they generate a lot of press, not all brands want that kind of press - as shown above where I listed various brands and who were in their campaigns.

    For your last question, I think the idea of success for a male model has changed. You don't need to be in a music video with Taylor Swift to know that you've made it. I think male models are happy enough when they get a campaign, or e-commerce and editorials where they get to fly to exotic places. For males, they're happy with whatever job they get. They don't aspire to be on the cover of so and so magazine or brand. They're very lax in every sense of the word. If they turn out to be the next Clement, it's their luck. They know that the industry is shaky and there aren't as many job opportunities as women's. Their idea of success is much lower than what the general public sets it if not entirely different. Or at least that's my take on it.
     
  16. Bertrando3

    Bertrando3 Active Member

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    That is an EXCELLENT point, in fact, here in Spain where I work as a photographer with many New Faces and agency male models it´s true that 90% of them all (at least in Spain) don´t have the same business savvy or the same DESIRE to be doing 100 covers or booking top notch campaigns, they are just happy booking anything and travelling. They aren´t seeing the big picture or looking ahead to be `supers´ either because they know it´s only one of them in a generation will become the next Clément Chabernaud or Sean O´Pry. It´sad, I try to teach them to want bigger things for their modeling careers but they are most worried about where to hang out on Saturday night... :doh:
     
  17. Phuel

    Phuel Well-Known Member

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    ^^^ That’s a common scenario with the guys all around the world, Bertrando. Guys know that they’re 3rd-class citizens next to the girls in the industry that's so slanted against them. They know to just work and get paid is more than enough to expect. The days of male Supermodels is long gone— not that even then guys were anywhere near the girls in terms of celebrity status and earnings. There's never been any equality for the guys in this industry LOL

    And there are more beautiful guys with model potential than there are beautiful girls with model potential, so the competition is ferocious. With a guy who’s got the right bone structure and height, it’s so much easier to tell them to loose some weight, train or build muscle-mass. With a girl, she may have the face, but if she’s not tall with long legs and a size 2, she’s never going to even be a consideration: No amount of diet and training is going to extend her legs and narrow her hips…
     
  18. billiejbob

    billiejbob Active Member

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    I think it's important to note that another major reason for why male modeling is dead is because mens fashion is, well, so bland and one dimensional.

    Yeah, big brands bust out new collections each season but there's only so many times you can redesign a suit, tuxedo, sports jacket, or a mens sweater.

    Mens fashion is NOWHERE near the same level as womens so there's no need for men to be major in the industry.

    There's no excitement behind a new LV or Dior Homme collection anymore. Even big name mens shows like Versace and D&G have toned it down so much so that now they mean nothing. Well, D&G is in a separate category for its disasters over the past decade including hiring male Instamodels and socialites but let's not go there.

    The only show these days that puts SOME emphasis on the male models where casting would be a BIG deal is Balmain...and that's saying something.
     
  19. Bertrando3

    Bertrando3 Active Member

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    Indeed :lol: but I wish the modeling industry was more inclusive indeed so the girls don´t all have to be a size 2 or 0 in fact and 5,10 to be considered a high fashion working model.

    As for the male models expectations I tend to disagree a little bit: so many Asian designers and brands in Latin America are much more experimental and edgy and they push the limits and what we, as men, could and should be able to wear. Therefore the need for great male models is there; I´m not saying to have skirts for men and nails and wacky kind of outfits just for the sake of expanding the men´s different kinds of accessories and styles but it´s great that some designers on the planet think about us and try to expand the men´s wardrobe.
     
  20. Bertrando3

    Bertrando3 Active Member

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    The models I work with, those I modelled with back in the day, those who the agencies send me to work with for my magazine, they don´t have a master plan. NONE of them say : I will be a supermodel, I will be like Tyson Beckford or Mark Vanderloo or Marcus S. They just want to travel, have a few pics for their instagram (a.k.a the new male model evolution lol: the instaboys/instagramers etc.) but they don´t focus on modeling as a CAREER. Most top female models work their *** off (when they reach the big doors or Fashion and do the major runway shows and shoot for Vogue and Harper´s) do work because they want fame, they want to book international covers of Vogue, they want to be invited to talk shows, to be seen with celebrities, become actresses, book a lot of Ad campaigns, getting cosmetic contracts. So they have REAL big goals and with top agency bookers and a solid book and friendships with top designers, then they get it = Victoria´s secret girls, top Vogue editorial models and beyond.

    My question then is WHY don´t male models think the same way? My only answer is (because of what I previously said about my own experience with models in Spain) that they don´t take it too seriously so it´s more like a hobbie and a fun thing to do but very very very few have the mindset of let´s say David Gandy or Andrés Velencoso or Noah Mills. Normal young model guys and the working male models doing international runways and ad campaigns don´t see (I think) the big picture at the end of the tunnel, MODELING for them is a means to an end but not a career builder.

    What do you guys think? Or is it also the public´s lack of interest in male models too?
     

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