Africa

[Lena]

uh, yes...wouldnt "european-inspired" or "north american-inspired" strike you as odd?

even though i agree about african diversity in styles, eastern european, russian and scandinavian inspired trends are also out there and quite hot at the moment..
of course these trends/styles are not literally correct as definitions, they are only 'codes' we use in order to be able to communicate.
eg: what do we know of Zambian or Ethiopian ethnic dressing?
do people really understand the 'eastern european' term?
does the general public clearly understand the scandinavian trend?

not everyone has knowledge of the ethnic/folk heritage, hence the 'loose' use of the terms

 

[utopia]

^ very true, lena. I was just thinking how the average shopper probably doesn't really know much about the origins of most of the stuff they wear. if I were to ask one of my friends (who isn't really interested in fashion beyond j.crew and oasis) what the basis for rococo or art deco inspired styles would be, they'd most likely not even have a clue what period I was talking about. I think the same goes for traditional 'ethnic' inspired trends. I know it's not really an excuse for people not to educate themselves about other cultures, but it is just a reality that many people are still very focused on their immediate cultural group...and I guess it trickles down into the broad terms that we use to associate trends with.

 

[Papercut Crisis]

Comes down to this.

It's all in semantics.

No one thinks the Tauregs are the same as the Egyptians. Dont let this stuff get under your skin too much.

Less bickering, more pics and discussion of the pics.

 

[adorevintage]

^ *hehe*

From http://www.adorevintage.com

 

[Deleted member 1957]

fresh africa approach from costume national ss05

those colours and the bead work are very 'africa' used in several areas of teh continent especially the east, west and suothern parts. i believe there are several ways to interprete africa, some may not be as obvious as a gaultier mask or giant beaded necklace but its still there. about clasifying it as one country i think it makes it more interesting thereby one has more variety from the gold loving egyptians, to the east africans that are mad about bead work or the west africans and their colourful fabrics
heres one lady that came to africa and has always let the continent inspire all her collections be it the fabrics, the cut or even the jewelry
this was inspired by zanzibar

read more about it here
http://www.kikoromeo.com/html/zanzibar.html

turkana
http://www.kikoromeo.com/html/hotseason9.html

here she incorporates the jewelry

 

[Lena]

hmm those are great adorevintage
beaded necklaces are my fave 'african/primitive' touch,
love them best when made by antique/folk beads

* been wearing wooden african rings for maybe three years now,
i have a big collection, maybe more than fifty of them..
in all sizes and shapes, always made out of dark wood
they are like my 'trademark' accessorie, never take them off

 

[morgan38]

even though i agree about african diversity in styles, eastern european, russian and scandinavian inspired trends are also out there and quite hot at the moment..
of course these trends/styles are not literally correct as definitions, they are only 'codes' we use in order to be able to communicate.
eg: what do we know of Zambian or Ethiopian ethnic dressing?
do people really understand the 'eastern european' term?
does the general public clearly understand the scandinavian trend?

not everyone has knowledge of the ethnic/folk heritage, hence the 'loose' use of the terms

Exactly. That's what I was trying to get across...but well you articulated it much better Lena. Trends are based on loose inspirations. Nobody is going to know the difference between clothing inspired by Zaire and clothing inspired by the Ivory Coast. While Africa is home to many different cultures, a lot of these cultures do share some similar aesthetic similarities when it comes to dress, hence the term. If trends were meant to be exact representaions of a culture, then I would agree with you. But, like I said, trends are loose interpretations, and many African cultures do share similar aesthetic values in their clothing, thus the trend.

 

[Deleted member 1957]

kikoys are another aspect of african fashion dunno if they have their origins here though. they are light and very colourful by the way adorevintage thats a great bag and jewelry!!

thenm theres kitenge which is controversial since its actually made in denmark or is it the netherlands not sure but has now become another symbol of africa

IMO safari is not really an african trend since it was worn by the europeans that came as colonialists and missionaries and not rally taken in by the locals apart from the 'traitors" but then again safari looks great when worn with afrcan jewelry or mixed with african fabrics because of its neutral colours

heres one aspect of africa that has been overdone and for those that dont know despite the fact that the masai image stands for africa the actually live in 2 countries kenya and tanzania


http://www.on-the-matrix.com/africa/masai_people.asp

some beautiful ethiopian jewelry

visit this site for plenty of interesting stuff
http://www.ecosandals.com/

heres a collection of jewelry
http://www.justafrica.com/kazuri.htm

 

[inzombia]

Nobody is going to know the difference between clothing inspired by Zaire and clothing inspired by the Ivory Coast.

Well, that's one outcome of US high school students scoring so poorly on geography compared to students in other Western industrialized nations.

And who's "nobody"? Not to be mean, but by "nobody" you seem to mean "nobody who isn't African or otherwise care to know Africa better." Because I imagine it's significant to persons from Egypt or the Ivory Coast, right? And so I think it does matter, because it's indicative of a greater problem about a Eurocentric imaginary that can't be bothered to learn the difference.

And I think it's different, knowing rococo from "ethnic," since the latter involves still-living people with histories but also their own moments in time that deserve recognition.

 

[morgan38]

Well, that's one outcome of US high school students scoring so poorly on geography compared to students in other Western industrialized nations.

And who's "nobody"? Not to be mean, but by "nobody" you seem to mean "nobody who isn't African or otherwise care to know Africa better." Because I imagine it's significant to persons from Egypt or the Ivory Coast, right? And so I think it does matter, because it's indicative of a greater problem about a Eurocentric imaginary that can't be bothered to learn the difference.

And I think it's different, knowing rococo from "ethnic," since the latter involves still-living people with histories but also their own moments in time that deserve recognition.

No I mean nobody, as in hardly anybody, even educated people (black or white) would know the difference bewtween the clothing of those two cultures. Just like I bet most people couldn't tell the difference between Austrian or German fashion. It's unreasonable to demand the average consumer know the difference between clothing inspired by Zaire or clothing inspired by the Ivory Coast, etc.

 

[Lena]

yes true morgan , who knows the difference between austrian and german?
(ooops not even me, and i'm supposed to have a clue ...)

africans should get a bit 'softer' with fashion's ignorance,
if i were you, i would be glad with all the 'fashion' attention the african esthetics are attracting ..it may not be 'perfect' but its not a reason to get upset either
(apart maybe from mixing safari with african trend themes, which can be considered even a tiny bit 'rude')

 

[Deleted member 1957]

one funny thing is that the way people out there say african inspired is the same way we say western or european fashion be it paris hilton or a 19th century corset. IMO theres no reason to get behind the anatomy of a trend unless you are doing it for research purposes.

 

[inzombia]

No I mean nobody, as in hardly anybody, even educated people (black or white) would know the difference bewtween the clothing of those two cultures. Just like I bet most people couldn't tell the difference between Austrian or German fashion. It's unreasonable to demand the average consumer know the difference between clothing inspired by Zaire or clothing inspired by the Ivory Coast, etc.

I have a student who can tell the difference actually, and she's not a design major, but a young black woman who's interested in Afrocentric politics. But let's ignore the so-called "average consumer," though as an educator I shudder to think that the hope that a person might be bothered to learn something new is "unreasonable" -- what about the designers themselves? You'd think they would be "educated" or otherwise interested in researching particular design histories, even if only as an aesthetic. Their clothes wouldn't suffer for their being more fully aware of the complicated and specific design histories of different nations or local populations, and we wouldn't be forced to sit through yet another cycle of "African-inspired" designs that feature the same geometric designs, wooden masks, and colors that hit the runways the last time -- the same old European "primitivist" aesthetic that's been recycled for the last century, actually, over and over and over, as if design or clothing in Africa hasn't changed in a hundred years!!

africans should get a bit 'softer' with fashion's ignorance,
if i were you, i would be glad with all the 'fashion' attention the african esthetics are attracting ..it may not be 'perfect' but its not a reason to get upset either

I'm not African, but this attitude amazes and depresses me. It seems to me that you're suggesting that African persons are not themselves involved in producing fashion, or interested in fashion, though this hardly bears out in reality; and that Africans should be "grateful" for any attention that fashion (encoded in your suggestion as "Western") deigns to grant, and that there's nothing to "get upset" about.

But you demonstrate your own lack of interest, or knowledge, about the long history of Western fascination with Africa --which so often was (and is) accompanied by violence-- and African clothing practices, which were once deemed "heathen" when worn by actual natives, and are understood narrowly as "costume" now, but are otherwise dubbed "high fashion" when Western women don these "inspirations."

But hey, colonialism is such a downer, man, and why should fashion be burdened with such discussions, right?

 

[sugarpea]

^^THANK YOU inzombia! i spent the winter in Ghana and I can tell you that they find it very silly and quite offensive when Americans come there for inspiration from "the Africans." It is Eurocentric thinking that allows people to gloss over people's irritations with the notion of "african-inspired." While Africans and other people of color learn about the differences between differnt European ethnic groups, Europeans and other Westerners are allowed to clump people of color into different groups -- African, Asian etc. Furthermore, equating the idea of not knowing differences between African dress to the idea of not knowing the difference between Austrian and German dress further highlights people's ignorance and insensitivity to African cultures. Austria and Germany have significant cultural and historical connection whereas Kenya and Ghana have few aside from a shared British colonial past. To suggest that Kenya and Ghana, for instance, are the similar in the way Austria and Germany are is quite superficial.

While people may feel that we are overreacting, we are not. It really upsets me when I hear people say things like "I love african clothes!" or "African-inspired things are beautiful" because, although it suggests a superficial appreciation for a non-Western aesthetics, it also suggests a glossing over of significant differences and a lack of understanding -- and willingness to understand -- the complexities, nuances and diversity of African cultures just as people in non-White countries are expected to learn about the West.

 

[sugarpea]

furthermore, in the process of finding inspiration from Africa or Asia, you would think that designers would feature, say, more than two African models or Asian models per show. Alas, finding beauty in all things "african" or "asian" doesnt mean finding beauty in women of color...and puhleease dont cite alek and liya as examples of diversity...for every liya there are 100 european models donning "african-inspired" clothes

 

[Lena]

ohh come on inzombia, fashion is a global story..
i cant see whats wrong when designers/mass manufacturers get inspired by africa, asia or north countries.. i'm greek and i didnt mind at all when the 'greek goddess' theme was all over the place.. why should i mind?
should people from easter europe get upset with the rise of the 'eastern folk' trend?

you can call me ignorant as much as you want , still the whole argument here makes very little sense to me, sorry guys

 

[clay]

Wow very interesting points made here. Like Lena I see no real harm is generalizing
"African" influences in fashion. Fashion has to be taken to the lowest common denominator always, rather we like it or not. For it to be grasps by the masses that are wanted to buy it. Yeah the buzz words may be silly, but Ive come to learn being in design they are quite a powerful tool in getting across ideas, that the common person just does not understand in terms of why a designer or a trend is what it , why it is relevant or why people should even consider it. There are many facets to design concepts that the average consumer is not even expected to be aware of. No harm in making keeping things simple in my humble opinion. Just getting it out there makes people aware and hopefully gets them to think and appreciate an aspect of something they were not. So I am happy to see the African cycle return beyond animimal prints, or Kente cloth suits. The photos posted, some go back a few years and you can see when Ysl, Prada, Gucci, Dior and many others started turning in Africas direction This time around. I know I remember the 60's and 70's versions quite well ( Many of our parents black, white or brown had Disheekis (so what if I spelled it wrong)). Not to mention what has been going on in interior design for the last 50 years or so.

Anyway at the end of the day some people get it and many people do not.

Personally I have been drawn to african textiles for about 10 years now and i love some of the stuff designers have been out in the last 6 years. That red/white YSL jacket I think tom did was greeeaaaattt! I freaked when i first saw it, Just like I did when Rifat did the Bone jacket....

 

[sugarpea]

ohh come on inzombia, fashion is a global story..
i cant see whats wrong when designers/mass manufacturers get inspired by africa, asia or north countries.. i'm greek and i didnt mind at all when the 'greek goddess' theme was all over the place.. why should i mind?
should people from easter europe get upset with the rise of the 'eastern folk' trend?

you can call me ignorant as much as you want , still the whole argument here makes very little sense to me, sorry guys

if you cannot understand the implications behind Western countries finding "inspiration" from non-Western countries which, until 50 years ago, they exploited through a colonial system, thats your problem. The African inspiration in fashion, with its use of animal prints, fetishized masks and ambiguously African" prints, is an appendage of a larger hierarchal system where European, white cultures are treated with more respect than non-white cultures. If you cant understand it, there is no point in this argument...it requires that you consider the historical and political relationships between Western and African countries which causes me and inzombia, among others, to understand that "african-inspired" possesses colonial undertones....im sorry if thats too difficult to understand

 

[fashionyork]

i got this bracelet at a little african store on st mark's place...

seems to fit here...

African store in St Mark's? What part Softgrey? I havent been there for couple weeks but i dont remember this store... anyways, did you ever went in the african market on Harlem? My sister went there other day and she bought the most fabulous earrings, Im going there soon!

I really like the african influence in fashion, I love wood jewelery. I have some from Brazil, made by indians there and people think its african....

But anyways, just a touch of it IMHO, otherwise you look like you're in a costume. No offense to anyone please, just a personal prefference, because I am more in the less is more theory.

But some people here said safari, for me safari its another thing, its all that kakhi (sp?) stuff... I like african much better than safari

I think im gonna take some pics of my sister stuff to post here

 

[Lena]

look, no need to get upset with my posts, much more since western 'fashions' have been influenced by 'colonial styles' since the 1800's even before.
you seem to have no problem with paisleys, dragons or mandras checks.
if you want to focus your argument on african influences and just throw mad on my face, please feel free and be my guest .