Balenciaga Pre-Fall 2024 Los Angeles

[Mrs.T]

This collection is as tired as am I watching those repetitive ideas season after season. And now the "fresh ideas" are just horrendous. He seems to be tired aswell.

 

[tourbillions]

someone save balenciaga while its still selling

 

[KaKe]

Its so so disrespectful. The victims in the audience that allow demna to play in their faces are just the worst. No standards; spineless syncophants.

Are you talking about everyone who legitimized Kim and Kendull?

 

[KaKe]

Demna is an absolute genius. We are living in the technocratic dystopian future of Blade Runner. Right now. People haven't realized it but Demna has and that is what the clothes are, they are of the future. They have nothing to do with Balenciaga but when I see anything he does, my imagination just fires up. Technology, industrialism, design, biology, decay, death, dystopia, I see it all in his clothes. I even found eastern european outcast dressing amazing.

It's hilarious to see the people who welcomed Kim Kardashian and Kendall Jenner with open arms talk about Demna as classless or talentless.

 

[Nimsay]

Are you talking about everyone who legitimized Kim and Kendull?

yes the industry seems to be doubling down on Kim as an f u to Kanye.


Balenciaga was cute and witty and fun in that Blade Runner way for about 10 seasons. Now its drole and passé. We just arent into being sweatpant wearing depressives anymore. Quiet luxury - the way designer clotjes have always looked - is a reaction to Balenciagas proposition. JG went wild at Dior in the 90s and 00s showing denim and sweatpants for a high fashion label. Before that it really didnt exist. had to plug john… anyway Demnas work is the extension of johns work of reimagining the low in high fashion. Chanel doing denim was controversial but they had to because Dior was showing denim RTW.

 

[Lola701]

JG went wild at Dior in the 90s and 00s showing denim and sweatpants for a high fashion label. Before that it really didnt exist. had to plug john… anyway Demnas work is the extension of johns work of reimagining the low in high fashion. Chanel doing denim was controversial but they had to because Dior was showing denim RTW.

Come on, most of the HF brands started doing denim in the 80’s. It was controversial when Chanel did it in the mid 80’s but Italian fashion houses like Ferre, Valentino, Fendi, Versace did it too. Hip brands like Alaia, Mugler or Gaultier were also doing denim.

John’s approach was wild but to put Demna in the same school of design or even approach would be stretch to me. I think they both have that thing for merchandising (when you look at the SS2005 Dior collection, it’s merchandising at it finest). I think the thing that separates Demna to Galliano is the lack of irony. John tried to elevate the banal through design. He did the silk or satin tracksuits, washed silk cargo pants, even when he did the jeans in 2000, it was cut like horse riding pants…

Demna is elevation through status. But it lacks humor. Those sweatpants are relevant because they are Balenciaga. There’s nothing in terms of design or fabrics that is particular to them.

 

[Constructionist]

Demna is elevation through status. But it lacks humor. Those sweatpants are relevant because they are Balenciaga. There’s nothing in terms of design or fabrics that is particular to them.

An excellent summary of the current fashion industry and especially Demna.
The marketing of the industry may falsely and continuously advertise the likes of Demna as geniuses and figures of massive importance, but their collections always say otherwise.
It's always repeated ad nauseam, that his talent can be seen through the traditional fashion pieces that he releases, especially in contrast to the ridiculous and gimmicky piles of hogwash, that accompanies those traditional pieces on the runway.

However, the pieces that are said to showcase his talent, actually showcase how much people's values for true and innovative high fashion has completely diminished and tribal instinct instead orders their affiliations.

You can find Demna's fans in many groups including : Eastern Europeans who celebrate one of their own reaching the highest echelon of fashion, admirers of Belgian fashion and those who emanated from the Antwerp scene(Antwerp 6 and the famous Royal Academy of Fine Arts, which most of them attended including Demna), to others who just want to be associated with high fashion in any way, shape or form and since Demna is the creative director of one of the biggest brands, then he must be amazing, despite evidence to the contrary.

I do fear however that he has established a new normal, the idea that you can do what ever you want, explain it away as irony or social experiment and get away with eye popping prices for very mawkish and banal pieces.

 

[KaKe]

An excellent summary of the current fashion industry and especially Demna.
The marketing of the industry may falsely and continuously advertise the likes of Demna as geniuses and figures of massive importance, but their collections always say otherwise.
It's always repeated ad nauseam, that his talent can be seen through the traditional fashion pieces that he releases, especially in contrast to the ridiculous and gimmicky piles of hogwash, that accompanies those traditional pieces on the runway.

However, the pieces that are said to showcase his talent, actually showcase how much people's values for true and innovative high fashion has completely diminished and tribal instinct instead orders their affiliations.

You can find Demna's fans in many groups including : Eastern Europeans who celebrate one of their own reaching the highest echelon of fashion, admirers of Belgian fashion and those who emanated from the Antwerp scene(Antwerp 6 and the famous Royal Academy of Fine Arts, which most of them attended including Demna), to others who just want to be associated with high fashion in any way, shape or form and since Demna is the creative director of one of the biggest brands, then he must be amazing, despite evidence to the contrary.

I do fear however that he has established a new normal, the idea that you can do what ever you want, explain it away as irony or social experiment and get away with eye popping prices for very mawkish and banal pieces.

you couldn't be more wrong. Not only is this not what Demna does but you are accusing him of what every other fashion brand does. How many magaznes with kardashians do you buy?

 

[tourbillions]

Demna is an absolute genius. We are living in the technocratic dystopian future of Blade Runner. Right now. People haven't realized it but Demna has and that is what the clothes are, they are of the future. They have nothing to do with Balenciaga but when I see anything he does, my imagination just fires up. Technology, industrialism, design, biology, decay, death, dystopia, I see it all in his clothes. I even found eastern european outcast dressing amazing.

It's hilarious to see the people who welcomed Kim Kardashian and Kendall Jenner with open arms talk about Demna as classless or talentless.

I hope this is sarcasm...

Balenciaga went from a fashion house to a merch seller. Almost none of the "designed" pieces are being bought, its mostly oversized t shirts or logo dressess. Both doesnt need any designing

 

[KaKe]

I hope this is sarcasm...

Balenciaga went from a fashion house to a merch seller. Almost none of the "designed" pieces are being bought, its mostly oversized t shirts or logo dressess. Both doesnt need any designing

it's not a joke at all, he is the only thing that is new going on and that has a vision, even if that vision is eastern european former ussr motorist, it doesn't matter, it is still a vision and it's getting the attention of people who didn't follow fashion because it is that different and out of the norm. people on this board have been so buried in the kardashian worship because they are so afraid to be left out of whatever anna wintour thinks is in, that they can't recognize when something that's truly in and avant garde like demna comes along.

 

[Constructionist]

it's not a joke at all, he is the only thing that is new going on and that has a vision, even if that vision is eastern european former ussr motorist, it doesn't matter, it is still a vision and it's getting the attention of people who didn't follow fashion because it is that different and out of the norm. people on this board have been so buried in the kardashian worship because they are so afraid to be left out of whatever anna wintour thinks is in, that they can't recognize when something that's truly in and avant garde like demna comes along.

I keep wondering why you incessantly mention the Kardashians in every post and why you think anyone in this forum respects them or cares for them at all.

Also, why do you think mentioning them as a rebuttal to Demna criticism makes sense? Isn't he the one who has had Kim walk his runway multiple times, while making her a muse?

 

[KaKe]

I keep wondering why you incessantly mention the Kardashians in every post and why you think anyone in this forum respects them or cares for them at all.

Also, why do you think mentioning them as a rebuttal to Demna criticism makes sense? Isn't he the one who has had Kim walk his runway multiple times, while making her a muse?

because accepting the kardashians demonstrated how rotten everyone working in the industry truly is. Part of being a fashion editor or publisher is being able to say no, we won't publish that because it's not fashion. They did it to paris hilton but laid down for kardashian and they are all just fulfilling her doll house dreams, all those artists working overtime to make it happen for her like steven klein, so cringe, would love to see how much money she makes for others, my guess is not much.

insane to think there was a time in fashion when ines de la fressange lost her entire career because karl lagerfeld fired her over posing for marianne, a huge honor for every french woman, yet it destroyed her career and everyone accepted it. now the same people put kim kardashian on every cover. Edie Sedgwick said it best describing the fashion industry, "very sick people".

Yes Demna uses her, it sucks, but i can't deny his vision just because he lacks integrity. The rest of the industry, no vision and no integrity.

 

[Nimsay]

like darling we are selling clothes here. We will throw fhem on the backs of whatever celebrity will have us. Im genuinely befuddled since nobody here cares about Kim like that. Or Demna.

I also think Kim will work for low appearance fees just bc part of her business is having her face out there. The balenciaga relationship at the beginning was syngerous with kim and kanye both being the balenciaga couple.

karl said it was déclassé to do marianne. I think he didnt want to be associated with it from a ideological standpoint since Karl is not French. Isnt ines like a billionairess anyway. Immconfused

 

[KaKe]

like darling we are selling clothes here. We will throw fhem on the backs of whatever celebrity will have us. Im genuinely befuddled since nobody here cares about Kim like that. Or Demna.

I also think Kim will work for low appearance fees just bc part of her business is having her face out there. The balenciaga relationship at the beginning was syngerous with kim and kanye both being the balenciaga couple.

karl said it was déclassé to do marianne. I think he didnt want to be associated with it from a ideological standpoint since Karl is not French. Isnt ines like a billionairess anyway. Immconfused

no he didn't want Chanel to be associated with something "populous", but being associated with sex tapes is fine.

 

[Nimsay]

yea bc it was like 30 yrs later and tastes chsnged. Did karl ever cosign kim. I think he used kendall bc we are trying to sell clothes here not make ideological standpoints.

 

[KaKe]

yea bc it was like 30 yrs later and tastes chsnged. Did karl ever cosign kim. I think he used kendall bc we are trying to sell clothes here not make ideological standpoints.

part of being a professional, an expert, an artist is being able to say yes we want to sell clothes but we are not going to use kendall because she's the worst model of all time. Otherwise you are just a stooge. Which of course, Karl was, even if he was a genius, that is the point. The only standard he lived by is being an elitist and keeping the populace out. 30 years ago the populace was marianne, now it's whoever dares not to accept the kardashians but the dynamic hasn't changed.

Chanel was a true iconoclast and she most definitely would have said no to the kardashians and to anyone she didn't approve of. That's why Karl made that "what is your next crime under my name" cartoon, he knew he was inferior to Chanel in everyway. Just my opinion.

 

[Lola701]

because accepting the kardashians demonstrated how rotten everyone working in the industry truly is. Part of being a fashion editor or publisher is being able to say no, we won't publish that because it's not fashion. They did it to paris hilton but laid down for kardashian and they are all just fulfilling her doll house dreams, all those artists working overtime to make it happen for her like steven klein, so cringe, would love to see how much money she makes for others, my guess is not much.

insane to think there was a time in fashion when ines de la fressange lost her entire career because karl lagerfeld fired her over posing for marianne, a huge honor for every french woman, yet it destroyed her career and everyone accepted it. now the same people put kim kardashian on every cover. Edie Sedgwick said it best describing the fashion industry, "very sick people".

Yes Demna uses her, it sucks, but i can't deny his vision just because he lacks integrity. The rest of the industry, no vision and no integrity.

But there’s also a shift in the industry. The early 00´s was the return of actresses engaging again with fashion and with glamour. The demography of HF customers was really different. Brands weren’t trying to sell clothes to 15 years old girls. 30 years old women were considered a young customer at the time as many brands had secondary lines ( Versus, MiuMiu, D&G, Just Cavalli, Marc by Marc, Junior Gaultier) to speak to 15 to 25 years old girls.

And Paris Hilton was the high class talking to the mass. Kim Kardashian however was mass and elevated…

I think that Demna has a real genuine fascination for the Kardashians and for celebrities that is really coherent to his age and demography. The same way that Olivier Rousteing or Riccardo Tisci had the same affection for her.

For designers like Karl, I think it’s a different type of fascination. Firstly because his generation of designers were celebrities themselves. People know Karl, they knew Valentino, they knew Saint Laurent and if we use the generation after, they know Gaultier. Even discreet Alaïa was somehow known.

Paris was embraced by HF one time when Carine put her on the cover of Vogue Paris in Alaia which was a hit because it was such a contrast to her image… But Paris had a privilege that was her name and her status. I don’t think she cared for approval because she is a Hilton.

Kim’s career is dependent on her ability to stay relevant in media. She was luckily married to a man who forced her presence in HF circles. Without Kanye West, Riccardo Tisci and Carine Roitfeld, the acceptance of the Kardashian would have been impossible.

And Ines lost her contract because she asked for more money in front of the Weirthemers. Karl though it was rude and at that time apparently her fortune went into her head and she did the Marianne thing without consulting Chanel. Marianne was probably the icing on the cake but to say that she lost her career would be a stretch. She married a very rich man, launched her brand, lost her brand, modeled here and there for her friends, appeared on the cover of magazines, married a richer man again, became an extremely well paid ambassador for Roger Vivier…There’s worse. You don’t loose things when you have that kind of status.

And let’s be honest, celebrities and designers used each others today. Relationships are not genuine anymore because everybody is looking for either relevance or for Ambassador contracts. But I think the Demna / Kim thing is somehow genuine. After all, he worked for Yeezy too.

 

[KaKe]

And Paris Hilton was the high class talking to the mass. Kim Kardashian however was mass and elevated…

This makes no sense, and the industry most definitely wants to sell to teens.

 

[Lola701]

This makes no sense, and the industry most definitely wants to sell to teens.

This is very recent phenomenon. The fashion industry being interested in selling to teens as a premier group is only something that started to rise with IG becoming a major player, couple that to also the work of Hedi Slimane for YSL and Riccardo Tisci at Burberry. And looking at that, it’s only a decade long affair.

The success of Riccardo and Hedi changed the landscape of luxury. Of course you could find tshirts and jeans part of the offering of Balenciaga (by Nicolas Ghesquiere), Chanel or even Hermes (under Gaultier) but it was not push and the mass wasn’t comfortable yet to spend hundreds of euros on such pieces.

When Galliano did the J’adore Dior tshirts, it was a hit among millennials. I remember that everybody wanted them back then, it was for a lot of young people of my time their introduction to luxury. With that also came the Chanel « Cambon » line that was targeted to a younger audience. The same audience was buying D&G and all secondary lines…
But, brands realized that the pushing of such products could jeopardize their image. Chanel stopped the Cambon line, released jeans or tshirts in a seasonal way and started to push the 2.55 in 2005. Arnault stopped the Dior J’adore thing and infused a drastic change that was materialized by the SS2007 collection of Galliano (it was also at that time that they started to push the Lady Dior again).

And if you remark, Paris Hilton at that time, was replaced by girls like Nicole Richie and the Rachel Zoe clique which was embraced by fashion but also push to the mass.

Kim was mass for years with her Dash brand. But Kanye allowed a rebranding that was more elevated but would also reach the mass. Because it’s still the ideas of the fashion elite that trickles down to the mass. Kanye being a cultural icon, his choices influenced the youth and as the youth started to consume luxury brands in a very strong way, brands started to adapt.

The offering of luxury brands today is less specific than it was 15 years ago. And this is because they are all targeting teens. The frenzy in the signing of K-pop stars is the ultimate proof of that.

 

[KaKe]

This is very recent phenomenon. The fashion industry being interested in selling to teens as a premier group is only something that started to rise with IG becoming a major player, couple that to also the work of Hedi Slimane for YSL and Riccardo Tisci at Burberry. And looking at that, it’s only a decade long affair.

The success of Riccardo and Hedi changed the landscape of luxury. Of course you could find tshirts and jeans part of the offering of Balenciaga (by Nicolas Ghesquiere), Chanel or even Hermes (under Gaultier) but it was not push and the mass wasn’t comfortable yet to spend hundreds of euros on such pieces.

When Galliano did the J’adore Dior tshirts, it was a hit among millennials. I remember that everybody wanted them back then, it was for a lot of young people of my time their introduction to luxury. With that also came the Chanel « Cambon » line that was targeted to a younger audience. The same audience was buying D&G and all secondary lines…
But, brands realized that the pushing of such products could jeopardize their image. Chanel stopped the Cambon line, released jeans or tshirts in a seasonal way and started to push the 2.55 in 2005. Arnault stopped the Dior J’adore thing and infused a drastic change that was materialized by the SS2007 collection of Galliano (it was also at that time that they started to push the Lady Dior again).

And if you remark, Paris Hilton at that time, was replaced by girls like Nicole Richie and the Rachel Zoe clique which was embraced by fashion but also push to the mass.

Kim was mass for years with her Dash brand. But Kanye allowed a rebranding that was more elevated but would also reach the mass. Because it’s still the ideas of the fashion elite that trickles down to the mass. Kanye being a cultural icon, his choices influenced the youth and as the youth started to consume luxury brands in a very strong way, brands started to adapt.

The offering of luxury brands today is less specific than it was 15 years ago. And this is because they are all targeting teens. The frenzy in the signing of K-pop stars is the ultimate proof of that.

I don't see people as "mass" and i certainly don't consider myself as "mass" or a person things trickle down to.
Paris Hilton was rightly so not embraced by the fashion industry because she is trash, just like Kim Kardashian. You can look up her style before the Balmain designer started giving them free clothes. They are just working overtime to build her dream house and I would love to see what numbers she's brought to the table.

Also Dash was a vanity boutique that was going bankrupt. why do you have to twist things to fit a narrative?