Dior: The Borehouse

[mikeijames]

It was the same thing he does season after season... the horny pirates wearing layer on top of layer out for danger, sex and adventure... It is the same show every season since God knows when. Nothing new.

while there's a clear throughline with the menswear at galliano, it's too reductionist to call it all the same.

men.style.com

Nobody knows what happened with Slimane, so it is futile to discuss him and his ventures over at LVMH... if I were Arnault, I would never ever let him leave, but maybe something happened so unavoidable that he had to go...

while it's futile to discuss what happened to slimane, it's not futile to talk about the obvious differences between dior homme then, dior homme now, and the eponymous collection of van asshe. the type of creative stifling we witness on the galliano side of the aisle evidences itself in the subpar work at dior homme as well. seriously, kris van asshe held such promise when he got appointed to the house and we got SO let down witnessing collection after collection of stuff that bore little to no resemblence to his eponymous work.

Tom/Gucci, or Phoebe/Chloe anyone? These things do happen: it is business after all.

and i bet a million dollars both gucci group and richemont would have done things differently in both of those circumstances respectively. i know ysl would sell a few more perfumes if they didn't have to go head-to-head with each new tom ford venture. gucci would sell a few more sunglasses. and we all saw what happened to chloe after phoebe. there are good business decisions and bad ones. the chloe transition from stella to phoebe? good business decision. the chloe transition from phoebe to paulo? not so much.

Charlize was Dior's answer for Nicole. Not that original I must say.

the point is that dior already has the cachet to attract a-list talent in response to the moviestars-as-spokespeople statement:

But now, it seems Dior tries to position its image and place in the luxury industry against Chanel with much more sell-able couture, endless cosmetic and fragrance releases, fine jewelry, skincare, make-up, RtW and costume jewelry, moviestars as spokespeople etc. etc....

i don't think the best path for a dior to gain marketshare or increase sales is to try to become another chanel. it's good in its own right.

 

[cecil]

Wow i didn't know i would enjoy reading all of the comments so much.

Truthfully, i have this feeling that Galliano actually cares about Dior less than any of you who have spent time to dissect the situation, right now.
Boredom, maybe? Or just no more passion for the company/brand, for whatever reasons.

It's such a harrowing thought but i think Dior only has the possibility of change and improvements (like the suggestions previous posters have brought up) when Galliano is replaced by someone else. (That's if you want to revamp the brand.) After all, it'll mark a new beginning and the mass will pay attention to the label once again, due to the press it will garner or just simply due to this drastic change.

I'm actually truly sad that Dior as a fashion house has such a reputation right now...
I wonder how Christian Dior himself would feel about his name being eponymous with "russian prostitute"-style clothings.
I only bother to care about it because i really loved Christian Dior as a designer and i can't even bear to think how many clueless people don't know about him and his works and just have got some of the craps they're selling now to link his name to.

I never really liked Galliano as a designer that much... so i can't really say what he's doing now that's so appalling without not referring to his works in his heyday.
He was and still is an extremely talented designer to many people... but i personally think it's right to replace him.
After all, he still has his namesake label to showcase his talents. People who love him can still see his works (which he has at least put in more effort and passion into). And people who really want to retain at least some integrity to Christian Dior's name... can proudly walk past Dior boutiques without rolling their eyes.

 

[Master Wood]

Firstly can I just commend this thread, it's been a long time coming and lets hope at least one fat cat over at Dior has a tFS username. Now I'm sure others would claim similar, but I'd go as far as to say I am one of John Galliano's biggest fans, Spent hours sourcing articles from as far back as 1997, crossed the english channel to visit his shop on the saint-honoree, hell I've even considered stalking (I stopped at that one) so I am as disheartened as anyone with this situation, this very very sad situation. No one has ever and I doubt will ever make me feel the way he has done, discovering Galliano for Dior was one of the defining moments in my life and certainly the catalyst for my love of fashion.

I have a question...

Many of tFS users concur that 2004 was one of Gallianos better years, his F/W 2004 ready-to-wear show for Dior is my all time favorite collection. It was in my and I beleive the opinion of others from here where things started to go down hill, there were some promising moments in 2005 and 2006 and his madame butterfly couture collection in 2007 was sensational. But it wasn't just Dior where the magic was lost, people have raved about recent collections at Galliano but lets not kid ourselves, they were not the same, it may hve been a different Galliano that appealed to a new fan but for Die hard Gallianoites they will know in their heart of simply wasn't the same.

Therefore can any of the LVMH/Bernard Arnault arguments have any credibility? I know it was suggested in this thread that perhaps Galliano in part is owned by LVMH/Bernard Arnault which could answer this question but I tned to know a lot on this subject and this is the first I have heard of it, the only argument I would have in favuor was up until 2005 some of his collection was being sold on eluxury, the notorious (ly tacky) designer website.

I don't think the argument that Galliano ran out of points of inspiration is particurly credible either, what happened to the collection inspired by high-tech down town tokyo, the ottoman empire, or english eccentrics, I don't think its possible to run out of inspiration more likely to stop being inspired.

Also of note has anyone noticed in videos for style.com etc how down he sounds when talking to Tim et al. I think something has certainly happened but whether its personal/proffesional I'm not sure, I often argued the can of Robinson but there were signs of this long before his death and as sad a loss it was Galliano still has many of his long term team around him.

I'm thinking maybe we're in a transitional period for Galliano, Just sadly I can't identify what he might transition in to.

 

[Zazie]

I just wish Galliano will just STOP with the "theme", "****** models" and "show" and get on with the DESIGN of the clothes, different shapes, proportions, cut, construction, textures, materials, anything. He is doing the same "costumes" over and over, the embellishments just different each time according to the theme, Geisha, Marie Antoinette, etc. For once, I wish he'd send out models with no makeup and just let the clothes speak for themselves. That alone will look fresh, and elegant.

 

[Street_a_Licious]

not to destroy your thesis Master Wood, but Dior RTW was sold on eluxury up until it closed as an online shop and became that..... *new thing*. whatever that might be.

 

[iluvjeisa]

To me, it was definitely the Spring 2007 RTW that was the first sign something was wrong. I'm not one for the oiled up 1999-2002 look, that some apparently think is sexy, but the type of beige frigidity that was introduced at the Spring 2007 RTW was rather appalling.

 

[tatouejeremie]

i wonder if the sales of dior went up when they took this new direction..

it seems like it was just gay guys and broke-*** fashion students that were mainly into the wild and crazy galliano for dior stuff, no viable customers there..

 

[Master Wood]

I'm going to need some clarity street-a-licious, your remark makes little sense!

 

[dior_couture1245]

For once, I wish he'd send out models with no makeup and just let the clothes speak for themselves. That alone will look fresh, and elegant.

I totally agree. And in all honesty, I think it's really the only option he has in order to make Dior fresh again.

RTW SS 06, and even SS 07 are good examples of great clothes that speak for themselves. Neither of those shows relied on over-the-top drama, outrageous make up, or loud colors. I remember a lot of people, myself included, thought RTW SS 07 was a really boring show, but I've come to like it quite a bit. The clothes were really beautiful, and I especially love the armor suits...but I think what I love most is that the color palette was so focused and so sophisticated - army greens, cements and pale pinks.

If I had power over Galliano, I would have him create a collection using nothing but white muslin...he loves showing off the inner workings of couture, and I've always found white muslin mock-ups to be incredibly beautiful and charming. Nude make up on the models, no nail polish, no platform heels, grungy bed hair...it would be so elegant.

 

[Inaya]

^ really great points. in 2007 it wasn't so bad, but the fact that it is still carrying over, years later, it is really sad. you can tell he is grasping at straws, trying to prove something with this horrible theme that he's drenched the label in - and you're right, to do that... he really just needs to start from a clean slate, an entirely new direction.

 

[mikeijames]

i wonder if the sales of dior went up when they took this new direction..

it seems like it was just gay guys and broke-*** fashion students that were mainly into the wild and crazy galliano for dior stuff, no viable customers there..

while i wonder the same thing with respect to their recent sales' figures, i find your last statement quite offensive. we seem to reduce all of galliano's work before this recent perid to something of gimmick, poorly constructed, mass market dreg when that does not do justice to all of the work he did there. his red carpet creations caught the eyes of the biggest names in music and film and society -- have we all forgotten melania knauss getting married in a dior? or sarah jessica parker and hilary swank and anna wintour and tilda swinton or drew berrymore on the carpet in his designs?

galliano made "it shoes" before we had a name for the phenomenon. and his bags sold to the widest swath of fashion lovers possible from the fendi-baguette crowd to the quilted-chanel crowd. his ready to wear found itself on the backs of many fashionable women particularly in north america and asia where it wasn't uncommon to see his dresses swinging in nightclubs, his suits in the boardrooms, and his trend pieces on the streets.

i simply can't imagine that this change has yielded the same kind of excitement at all nor the revenues that excitement produced.

 

[Street_a_Licious]

... the only argument I would have in favuor was up until 2005 some of his collection was being sold on eluxury, the notorious (ly tacky) designer website.

Master Wood, i was referring to that part of your comment

RTW SS 06, and even SS 07 are good examples of great clothes that speak for themselves. Neither of those shows relied on over-the-top drama, outrageous make up, or loud colors.

THAT'S the reason why i love that collection so much. the lace on nude. the deconstruction. no extreme makeup or hair. everything was simple and gorgeous. only ugly point: those clunky shoes for the final etheral looks.

i wished Galliano would explore that more. it's was simple and simply breathtaking.

 

[Enigma89]

Firstly can I just commend this thread, it's been a long time coming and lets hope at least one fat cat over at Dior has a tFS username. Now I'm sure others would claim similar, but I'd go as far as to say I am one of John Galliano's biggest fans, Spent hours sourcing articles from as far back as 1997, crossed the english channel to visit his shop on the saint-honoree, hell I've even considered stalking (I stopped at that one) so I am as disheartened as anyone with this situation, this very very sad situation. No one has ever and I doubt will ever make me feel the way he has done, discovering Galliano for Dior was one of the defining moments in my life and certainly the catalyst for my love of fashion.

I have a question...

Many of tFS users concur that 2004 was one of Gallianos better years, his F/W 2004 ready-to-wear show for Dior is my all time favorite collection. It was in my and I beleive the opinion of others from here where things started to go down hill, there were some promising moments in 2005 and 2006 and his madame butterfly couture collection in 2007 was sensational. But it wasn't just Dior where the magic was lost, people have raved about recent collections at Galliano but lets not kid ourselves, they were not the same, it may hve been a different Galliano that appealed to a new fan but for Die hard Gallianoites they will know in their heart of simply wasn't the same.

Therefore can any of the LVMH/Bernard Arnault arguments have any credibility? I know it was suggested in this thread that perhaps Galliano in part is owned by LVMH/Bernard Arnault which could answer this question but I tned to know a lot on this subject and this is the first I have heard of it, the only argument I would have in favuor was up until 2005 some of his collection was being sold on eluxury, the notorious (ly tacky) designer website.

I don't think the argument that Galliano ran out of points of inspiration is particurly credible either, what happened to the collection inspired by high-tech down town tokyo, the ottoman empire, or english eccentrics, I don't think its possible to run out of inspiration more likely to stop being inspired.

Also of note has anyone noticed in videos for style.com etc how down he sounds when talking to Tim et al. I think something has certainly happened but whether its personal/proffesional I'm not sure, I often argued the can of Robinson but there were signs of this long before his death and as sad a loss it was Galliano still has many of his long term team around him.

I'm thinking maybe we're in a transitional period for Galliano, Just sadly I can't identify what he might transition in to.

How well did the 2004 F/W RTW collection even sell? There were some wearable pieces, but the mast majority of it was unwearable. How many people did you really see walking around with ridiculous oversize fur collars? I respect Galliano because he can come up with a lot of crazy ideas. The problem is, almost all of them are crazy and once you go crazy every season, it starts to become boring. Maybe he is just trying to ground the house again after a lot of rediculous seasons.

 

[Fabulyss]

I actually prefer what he is doing now, classic Dior. No more of the tacky transient trends which inevitably ends up producing hideous knock offs. I also think you have to take Galliano with a grain of salt...his catwalks are ****** but just look at Charlize Theron and Marion Collitard...they're some of the best dressed women in Hollywood, very chic.

 

[mikeijames]

How well did the 2004 F/W RTW collection even sell? There were some wearable pieces, but the mast majority of it was unwearable. How many people did you really see walking around with ridiculous oversize fur collars? I respect Galliano because he can come up with a lot of crazy ideas. The problem is, almost all of them are crazy and once you go crazy every season, it starts to become boring. Maybe he is just trying to ground the house again after a lot of rediculous seasons.

fw 2004 was a little fluke-y because ss2004 was the d-trick season which caused sensations at the stores and the next season really calmed down with lots of must have bags, logoes, and denim (which also sold).

 

[Littleathquakes]

How well did the 2004 F/W RTW collection even sell? There were some wearable pieces, but the mast majority of it was unwearable. How many people did you really see walking around with ridiculous oversize fur collars? I respect Galliano because he can come up with a lot of crazy ideas. The problem is, almost all of them are crazy and once you go crazy every season, it starts to become boring. Maybe he is just trying to ground the house again after a lot of rediculous seasons.

None because when the clients buy these clothes, they're not going to wear exactly what's on the runway. You probably wouldn't recognize the clothes because they've been altered at the atelier. That's how haute couture works.

You really don't expect to see women walking around with lace underwear and stockings underneath dress suits because that's what the latest HC collection showed, do you?

 

[Enigma89]

None because when the clients buy these clothes, they're not going to wear exactly what's on the runway. You probably wouldn't recognize the clothes because they've been altered at the atelier. That's how haute couture works.

You really don't expect to see women walking around with lace underwear and stockings underneath dress suits because that's what the latest HC collection showed, do you?

I was talking about the RTW not Haute Couture.

 

[Street_a_Licious]

even that was toned down.

i remember a thread showing his Teddy boy collection (F/W 04. with those heartstoppingly fugtastic creepers) and how it finally appeared on the salesfloor. with toned down collars, less frills and whistles, less neon-y colors and animal prints, etc etc.

during his crazy era, his shows were basically at least 80% show pieces. these days, nearly everything shown lands on salesfloors the way it was depicted on the runways.

 

[Enigma89]

Isn't that better for business though? In the end these fashion houses are businesses. If you want to see art, look at Galliano's own line.

 

[Littleathquakes]

I was talking about the RTW not Haute Couture.

Oops sorry