Helmut Lang/Prada drama> update*HL-art

[faust]

...write a letter...

adress?

 

[baklanyc]

that is freaky...really a mean yet intangible torture.

I do get what johnny was saying...I also cant help but feel for these designers...you know the idea of building a business, and then selling it is a goal for many entrepreneurs...they often talk about how you should have an exit strategy for selling and leaving. Its just at a different level when its your name!

Yeah...everyone should have learned a lesson from Halston!

 

[softgrey]

Yeah...everyone should have learned a lesson from Halston!

i keep thinking about halston whenever i think about this topic...
but in that case ...he licensed his name outright and wasn't involved in the designs anymore...or was he...do you know bakla...

i feel like jil and helmut never planned on leaving the companies this way...

 

[baklanyc]

i keep thinking about halston whenever i think about this topic...
but in that case ...he licensed his name outright and wasn't involved in the designs anymore...or was he...do you know bakla...

i feel like jil and helmut never planned on leaving the companies this way...

Halston wasn't as involved with the designs anymore, allowing JCPenney to dilute the brand to nothing. Beyond that, I really have no recall. But it was the first real lesson in selling out that I recall in fashion history (a different but concurrent lesson was the dilution of a brand via overlicensing by its own designer, and I'm looking at YOU, Pierre Cardin! ). Also, I think Halston may have died before the brand did anyhow... I'd have to read up on it.

I'm aware of a couple of companies right now that are building the proper amount of buzz, yet are struggling to grow their brands because of the ever-increasing need for funding. I hear about the stories of larger companies taking interest in these relatively nascent brands and supposedly want to cultivate them, but you never know when a story ends up like Lacroix (neglect) or Helmut & Jil (divorce). It's always a hard decision to make, to spurn money that you so desperately need to stay afloat, because you don't want to sell out. Too many have gone that route before, even in recent history: the sad stories of the ill-fated Pegasus group, the short-lived promise of the Tyler-Bartlett-Byblos association, and the many struggles between giants LVMH and the Gucci group, all are lessons to learn from.

It's not always the glamour of the runway, or creating the best new styles; often it's about making enough of the less forward but more saleable styles (read: dumbed down for the masses) just to sell enough to survive another season so a designer can continue to create the the sexier designs that those in the know might covet. I find that people on this site concentrate so much on the design aspects of fashion, but aren't as aware that there are so many sacrifices to be made at all levels, to try and keep a fashion company going. Because after all is said and done, it's still a business.

Okay, end rant.

 

[softgrey]

well bakla...most people on this site aren't completely familiar with the fashion industry because they don't work in it...most are very passionate aficionados...
or still students...

do you find that people that you work with talk about this stuff?...

 

[helena]

baklanyc - I agree with you. I see this happen across all industries every day. At the end of the day it doesn't matter how creative you are its how much you can sell today that ensures you have a tomorrow. The mighty dollar is king. Of course it is - its commerce. However its great to see creativity and commercial success work hand in hand - like with Comme or Yohji. Thank goodness for perfume sales! I do feel sorry for Helmut & Sander - if only they'd known.... but thats the risk you take when you sell your name.

 

[nqth]

I think Comme and Yohji are among those who sell more clothes than accs and perfumes. I remember Comme Parfum sale were around 2 mln euros (or usd:-) before they signed a deal with Puig in 2002. Puig is now producing and distributing Comme2 and 2MAN. I think I read somewhere that the Comme2 alone was estimated for 2 mln. usd sale in US.

In Warsaw Guerrilla perfumes are "best sellers":-) they sold for Christmas about 60 bottles I think:-). Kyoto and Avignon are sold out.

The new Yohji women scent was estimated for 8 mln dol sale in US. It has heavy tv commercial even here n Poland. But the scent is nothing spectacular, unlike the first Yohji EdP. The man scent is very "common". I think these are just for some money now:-)

Sorry for off-topic:-)

 

[faust]

I think Comme and Yohji are among those who sell more clothes than accs and perfumes. I remember Comme Parfum sale were around 2 mln euros (or usd:-) before they signed a deal with Puig in 2002. Puig is now producing and distributing Comme2 and 2MAN. I think I read somewhere that the Comme2 alone was estimated for 2 mln. usd sale in US.

In Warsaw Guerrilla perfumes are "best sellers":-) they sold for Christmas about 60 bottles I think:-). Kyoto and Avignon are sold out.

The new Yohji women scent was estimated for 8 mln dol sale in US. It has heavy tv commercial even here n Poland. But the scent is nothing spectacular, unlike the first Yohji EdP. The man scent is very "common". I think these are just for some money now:-)

Sorry for off-topic:-)

Really, the new Yohji women's scent is so incredibly bland. I love the men's though.

What about Dries, people?! He is the perfect example of doing just fine and being independent, no? Granted, his designs may not be edgy, but neither were the ones of Jil and Helmut.

I wonder how the new "partnerships" will influence Ann Demeulemeester and Dirk Schonberger...

 

[metal-on-metal]

What about Dries, people?! He is the perfect example of doing just fine and being independent, no? Granted, his designs may not be edgy, but neither were the ones of Jil and Helmut.

I'm pretty sure Dries comes from a very, very good background, and is himself independently wealthy.

 

[baklanyc]

well bakla...most people on this site aren't completely familiar with the fashion industry because they don't work in it...most are very passionate aficionados...
or still students...

do you find that people that you work with talk about this stuff?...

The ones who are in the situations, yes, all the time (in between the "Did you see what so and so did this season?" and the "I can't believe we designed the same things at the same time!" conversations). After orders come in, it's always a problem finding the cash to first manufacture what was ordered (after the initial fear of not making enough orders), and then it's a question of waiting for the payments to come in from your stores a good two to three months after your company has outlaid the production costs, all the while looking two seasons ahead trying to promote the next round of designs while hoping your sellthroughs at the stores this season will warrant them buying you again. This routine makes the concept of getting funded or bought by a Prada or an LVMH really attractive, because a lot of the high end (new) designers I know often barely make a salary that would allow them to buy the very clothing they sell!

But as this thread is testament to, getting funded by a big company is obviously not without its downside.

 

[softgrey]

faust...
i don't know if the comparison to ann and dirk is valid here...because they weren't bought out by some monstrous conglomerate...i think that may be the only way it really works..

individual investors...who respect the designer and their visions and support them...i think that the investor has to allow the designer the freedom to continue to pursue their vision...otherwise it all falls apart...i have an extremely talented friend who experienced this the hard way...when her investor became too involved ...

oh...it would be so nice if money was not an issue...

bakla ...you describe the situation so perfectly...it's so so very hard for young designers...even the ones who look like they're doing well...

 

[*Happiness*]

...write a letter...

so funny but true. I once wrote a letter to my gym about changing a class around because it felt so good to do low impact first and then body sculpting second...it worked...all because I wrote a letter.

 

[Kimkhuu]

I just read the news off Yahoo.

How sad, I have always admired Helmut Lang, I didn't really like his S/S 05 collection with all the weird knots, but his S/S 04 collection was the most beautiful and innovative collection ever.

This is such a sad resignation, I wish him the best of luck, but I am secretly wishing he'll one day be back. He mastered a lot of great cutting techniques, his shapes were exquisitely sleek but with a ''Helmut'' twist. How sad......

 

[MarzenaDM]

I absolutally agree
Colletion s/s 2004 was fantastic.
Modern mode

 

[whawhat]

just my 5 cents = prada is a terrible company and their designs are awful = the only reason people buy their ugly designs is because they advertise advertise advertise.....all this money they spend on ad pages means the big mags like vogue, w, etc. have to feature them in their editorial, which is basically just more advertising = eventually, people see it over and over again and just buy it....damn shame. here's wishing that people realize this and stop buying their CRAP!

 

[whawhat]

Prada closes Helmut Lang NYC offices

Prada is shutting down all of Helmut Lang's New York offices (store is staying open, for now) by the end of this week. The brand will now officially be run by prada people......lame

 

[faust]

Boooo!!!

 

[Arturo21]

Oh god ..this is awful.

I've been wondering..when Prada starts disgracing (A.K.A "running") Helmut Lang, will Helmut Lang himself retire? Because, say, he wants to start a new label...He can't call it "Helmut Lang", can he? Unless he buys it back or something. Otherwise he'd have to design for another already existing label or create a new one not called "Helmut Lang". It would still be weird, though...Helmut Lang owning his own label and designing for it, while there's another label that's actually called "Helmut Lang" who he has nothing to do with now..

 

[liberty33r1b]

this is tooo sad for words, i'm shattered!

 

[brian]

this is tooo sad for words, i'm shattered!

me too ... i'm so sad right now

and i had plans to visit the helmut lang boutique in nyc when i go next fall!