Jonathan Anderson - Designer, Creative Director of JW Anderson & Christian Dior

[Lola701]

LV (runway) RTW in a way is exclusive because only a few pieces are made. Back then in Balenciaga years, some NG's creations were also limited in quantity. They don't have to be uber expensive to be exclusive, though everyone still needs to make a bottom line.
What makes couture interesting is also the lower margin part...it's partly for art and the love of the trade.

Again, the key is to keep the know how. American businesses did outsourcing earlier/more aggressively than other countries, and during covid many reflected and realized that it went too far. Some of the re-shoring activity we see today not only reflect policies but also a realization from the business community that domestic production also has many benefits. Profit margin is not everything, and ultimately automation/technology can also help them to accomplish the same goals without the logistics challenges. Hope the French businesses are smarter this time.

Louis Vuitton RTW runway is more distributed today than Balenciaga RTW runway has ever been.
Balenciaga was super expensive. The runway pieces! It was insane. They had clothes exceeding the 90000€ in RTW. The leggings from SS2007 were insanely expensive, the furs from FW2011 were too.

But then a distribution strategy will always make things more or less exclusive. Louis Vuitton RTW is distributed only through a fraction of stores compared to the numbers of stores they have worldwide. And in those stores, the buys are different and generally targeted for a local clientele. So it changes the approach.

At Balenciaga, the funds were limited for Ghesquiere. However he was clever to introduce the capsules and the reproductions under editions.
SS2008 wasn’t really a commercially successful collection for the runway stuff. But the commercial collection sold fairly well and the brand had so much buzz anyway that the aura of the collection helped sell the motorcycle Jackets that were part of the capsules and adapted from the SS2007 collection…

I love the idea of Couture in theory making low margins. They are. Fashion anyway is making less margins.

But I’m against the idea of Couture making no margins and only working for the Art.
There are jobs, they have to preserved, it has to be attractive for younger generations and you have to have a profitable Couture activity to maintain it.

My grandmother started to work as a seamstress in Couture in the 60’s. She stopped in the early 00’s. When Lacroix closed, we discussed about her work and so many houses that disappeared.
When Couture is not making money, business people don’t see a value in it and it could be an activity that gets chopped quickly. And when you have the Lack of fortune with RTW and fragrances, it’s doomed.

And it’s such a circle. A house close, it means less clients for Les Metiers d’Arts. Yes the seamstresses can go to RTW Ateliers where they are sometimes paid more. There aren’t that much Couture houses anyway. That’s why in Paris the success of Chanel and Dior as the driving locomotive is so important.

To protect the know how, margins and profits are important. However, what France offers is a protection through the status of Artisans.

That’s why it’s always funny to talk about a fashion industry in France because actually, it’s mostly Artisanal. The real industry is in Italy, India and all.

And it’s a bit of the snake that bite it own tail situation because despite it huge industrial weight, I’m not sure the fashion industry at least in France would have been that protected without the fact that it’s mostly marketed, protected, viewed, cultured as an Artisanat d’Art.

 

[Caffeine]

Louis Vuitton RTW runway is more distributed today than Balenciaga RTW runway has ever been.
Balenciaga was super expensive. The runway pieces! It was insane. They had clothes exceeding the 90000€ in RTW. The leggings from SS2007 were insanely expensive, the furs from FW2011 were too.

But then a distribution strategy will always make things more or less exclusive. Louis Vuitton RTW is distributed only through a fraction of stores compared to the numbers of stores they have worldwide. And in those stores, the buys are different and generally targeted for a local clientele. So it changes the approach.

At Balenciaga, the funds were limited for Ghesquiere. However he was clever to introduce the capsules and the reproductions under editions.
SS2008 wasn’t really a commercially successful collection for the runway stuff. But the commercial collection sold fairly well and the brand had so much buzz anyway that the aura of the collection helped sell the motorcycle Jackets that were part of the capsules and adapted from the SS2007 collection…

I love the idea of Couture in theory making low margins. They are. Fashion anyway is making less margins.

But I’m against the idea of Couture making no margins and only working for the Art.
There are jobs, they have to preserved, it has to be attractive for younger generations and you have to have a profitable Couture activity to maintain it.

My grandmother started to work as a seamstress in Couture in the 60’s. She stopped in the early 00’s. When Lacroix closed, we discussed about her work and so many houses that disappeared.
When Couture is not making money, business people don’t see a value in it and it could be an activity that gets chopped quickly. And when you have the Lack of fortune with RTW and fragrances, it’s doomed.

And it’s such a circle. A house close, it means less clients for Les Metiers d’Arts. Yes the seamstresses can go to RTW Ateliers where they are sometimes paid more. There aren’t that much Couture houses anyway. That’s why in Paris the success of Chanel and Dior as the driving locomotive is so important.

To protect the know how, margins and profits are important. However, what France offers is a protection through the status of Artisans.

That’s why it’s always funny to talk about a fashion industry in France because actually, it’s mostly Artisanal. The real industry is in Italy, India and all.

And it’s a bit of the snake that bite it own tail situation because despite it huge industrial weight, I’m not sure the fashion industry at least in France would have been that protected without the fact that it’s mostly marketed, protected, viewed, cultured as an Artisanat d’Art.

A clarification in terminology:
Margins.
In this context it means bottom line after paying workers and everything. The whole idea is that you pay special artisans a nice market wage to keep the know how.

Chanel is not public, so i will use LVMH as an example. Its net income margin is ~15%.
Is it a crazy idea for a conglomerate to have a couture business (i know LV doesn't but this is a business discussion) with much lower revenue than the commercial business to have a 5% or even 0% net income margin? I don't think so.

Many businesses have profit losing divisions called R&D. Couture businesses can certainly be treated as R&D. It is an investment for future revenues in the commercial business.

While the US is generally protective of its innovators and engineers with high wages, IP protection, and a highly sophisticated capital market, hence attracting talents in many fields, France can in theory enhance its investments in these fields. And I have no doubt that LVMH does it to a certain extent.

There has been some discussions about state capitalism in the US. If the couture industry has a special meaning in France's national identity (i think so), I suppose that it should be supported through government policies. Otherwise all countries will always move to the lowest production country and the romantic idea of globalization means your own people who originated the idea of couture will lose their jobs and eventually the know how. This scenario is shortsighted, and many businesses in the US has realized that automation/technology and less outsourcing is more sustainable even though their net income margin might suffer for a few years.

And perhaps this will be the message from Chanel and Dior one day: our commercial rtw is insourced/outsourced, but if you want 100% made in France couture, we welcome you with open arms to pay the $$$$$$. Because you are a benefactor of our special art.

 

[Lola701]

A clarification in terminology:
Margins.
In this context it means bottom line after paying workers and everything. The whole idea is that you pay special artisans a nice market wage to keep the know how.

Chanel is not public, so i will use LVMH as an example. Its net income margin is ~15%.
Is it a crazy idea for a conglomerate to have a couture business (i know LV doesn't but this is a business discussion) with much lower revenue than the commercial business to have a 5% or even 0% net income margin? I don't think so.

Many businesses have profit losing divisions called R&D. Couture businesses can certainly be treated as R&D. It is an investment for future revenues in the commercial business.

While the US is generally protective of its innovators and engineers with high wages, IP protection, and a highly sophisticated capital market, hence attracting talents in many fields, France can in theory enhance its investments in these fields. And I have no doubt that LVMH does it to a certain extent.

There has been some discussions about state capitalism in the US. If the couture industry has a special meaning in France's national identity (i think so), I suppose that it should be supported through government policies. Otherwise all countries will always move to the lowest production country and the romantic idea of globalization means your own people who originated the idea of couture will lose their jobs and eventually the know how. This scenario is shortsighted, and many businesses in the US has realized that automation/technology and less outsourcing is more sustainable even though their net income margin might suffer for a few years.

And perhaps this will be the message from Chanel and Dior one day: our commercial rtw is insourced/outsourced, but if you want 100% made in France couture, we welcome you with open arms to pay the $$$$$$. Because you are a benefactor of our special art.

In theory it works but there’s not already an uniform way in which Ateliers are functioning beyond their empiric hierarchy.
In Paris most of the Ateliers, from RTW to Couture are a bit functioning as Couture anyway because the prototypes that are walking the shows in a lot of instances are made in house depending on the houses.

If we decide to use the workforce for Couture as R&D, that means that we have to use the Metiers d’Arts as R&D too.

But can you substain a profit losing division, with that many people, the administrative weight of France in a long term? Fashion in France is dependent on 2 ministeres: economy and culture. And the Chambre Syndicale with the weight of the Maisons has no issues pleading their cases…

For a lot of houses where Couture was money losing activity, the advertising budget was there to make it work. So the question is not so much on if it could work or not. Thierry Mugler did those extraordinary collections because he was selling a ton of fragrances. Pierre Cardin could sustain his Atelier because his licences brings a lot of money.

But it still makes the Couture activity fragile and likely to be sacrifice.

I like that Gaultier sacrificed the RTW to maintain the Couture activity, supported by the sales of the beauty. Couture elevates the image, they can sell to their clientele, it keeps jobs and a savoir faire. But I’m sure that if Gaultier wasn’t there as a moral and authority figure, suits could have sacrificed that activity.

I think about a house like Givenchy. This is an example of what happens when a Couture division is not making profits.
The reality is that the workforce will be use in RTW and special projects. But in times of crisis, Couture is likely to be sacrificed.

I just think that when Couture is strong in creativity, craftmanship, it ability to attract workers, to pay people well and on top of that to sell and be profitable and in short can be autonomous it becomes undeniable in the life of a house and nobody can discuss or dismiss it existence.

 

[susseinmcswanny]

Wow Lola a new pic!!!

 

[Lola701]

Wow Lola a new pic!!!

New year ahead, new pic but still Guy Bourdin ☺️

 

[visvim2001]

while we’re on the subject of margins…I’ve always assumed, perhaps mistakenly, that there was a tacit understanding in the high fashion world that while basic logo merchandise forms the bulk of rtw sales, they should never be featured front and centre in any campaign. to me this is only logical, right? you have to preserve the illusion of creative integrity, especially in a house as prestigious as Dior. to do otherwise is to signal you’ve joined the lowbrow mallcore crowd.

that’s why I find the rugby shirt so objectionable, along with the jumpers or whatever the heck they are. the logo just doesn’t belong there, in large font, square in the middle. it is quite frankly offensive, far worse than the stupid big ponies Ralph once did. it’s also styled terribly with that dumb belt. it no way does it cohere with the heritage of Dior Homme, which for me has always been clean, slim, minimal, refined. I don’t know why JWA even put it out to be honest.

 

[TianCouture]

Just gunna leave this here...

 

[Frederic01]

Unboxing the New Dior​

Jonathan Anderson's debut collections launch January 2nd


DIOR

 

[jeanclaude]

Just gunna leave this here...

He looks like a grandma with a very big hirsutism problem!!

 

[youthinasia]

Just gunna leave this here...

I knew as soon as he tied the belt, it was gonna give him art teacher body

 

[plentyofhorns]

Just gunna leave this here...

6 months for that and it just looks like it needs to be ironed lol

 

[susseinmcswanny]

? that was 6 months ago???

 

[Cocteau Stone]

Just gunna leave this here...

All I see is a frumpy, unflattering iteration of Chanel fall 1998 RTW collection.

And why on earth would one actively wear something that clearly makes them look like a pear? It’s awful.

 

[Frederic01]

All I see is a frumpy, unflattering iteration of Chanel fall 1998 RTW collection.

And why on earth would one actively wear something that clearly makes them look like a pear? It’s awful.

Omg you are so right!! So hilarious that Jonathan Anderson copied Karl for a Dior collection! Even the same belt! And the exact same length lmao!!!


GETTYIMAGES & DIOR

 

[Lola701]

Maybe he needed to size up…
It’s a beautiful coat but sometimes, very beautiful things, even when we got the budget, don’t fit us…

It’s meant to be worn by someone skinny or more athletic.

Omg you are so right!! So hilarious that Jonathan Anderson copied Karl for a Dior collection! Even the same belt! And the exact same length lmao!!!

View attachment 1442858 View attachment 1442860
GETTYIMAGES & DIOR

At Loewe he did copy Karl’s Chloe. So there’s an evolution lol

 

[yslforever]

Just gunna leave this here...

Clearly one (or two) size too small, the definition of the French "boudiné", ie stuffed like a sausage .
Those pleats are not meant to be that much contrived, it's extremely unflattering

 

[donyan]

^quite a shock to see this coat on a normal body. It looked beautiful in the show.

 

[susseinmcswanny]

Maybe he needed to size up…
It’s a beautiful coat but sometimes, very beautiful things, even when we got the budget, don’t fit us…

It’s meant to be worn by someone skinny or more athletic.

That is why "'luxury' rtw" is the biggest joke because it's one pattern with a standard grading. Been there enough times. Pre-order something because most likely no store will order your size. The one-off thing they made arrives, you put it on and it looks like that instagram post... you want to k1ll yourself... but what are you gonna do, exchange for store credit? Cut the losses and have the dumb thing displayed on a hanger to remind yourself how stupid you are for spending that much money on a mass produced trophy.

 

[visvim2001]

That is why "'luxury' rtw" is the biggest joke because it's one pattern with a standard grading. Been there enough times. Pre-order something because most likely no store will order your size. The one-off thing they made arrives, you put it on and it looks like that instagram post... you want to k1ll yourself... but what are you gonna do, exchange for store credit? Cut the losses and have the dumb thing displayed on a hanger to remind yourself how stupid you are for spending that much money on a mass produced trophy.

Couldn’t that simply be solved with a set of published measurements?

 

[Lola701]

That is why "'luxury' rtw" is the biggest joke because it's one pattern with a standard grading. Been there enough times. Pre-order something because most likely no store will order your size. The one-off thing they made arrives, you put it on and it looks like that instagram post... you want to k1ll yourself... but what are you gonna do, exchange for store credit? Cut the losses and have the dumb thing displayed on a hanger to remind yourself how stupid you are for spending that much money on a mass produced trophy.

I didn’t want to be rude but to put it simply, he is oddly shaped. And we can see it when he ties the jacket.
He probably had a dramatic weight loss or is still on his weight loss journey.
Because it terms of shoulders it fit perfectly but clearly his body is not firm and the texture of the coat is not really one of a tailored classic wool coat that creates a strong frame form the body.