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Untranslatable Words

xPedro

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In portuguese e have SAUDADE, that is a noun for the feeling of missing someone, then in portuguese we don't say "I miss you", we say "I feel SAUDADE of you" ^_^

In english I only can remember FIERCE :p

So guys, is there any other words in english that you can't translate to your language, or words in your language that you can translate to english? If there is describe to us! ^_^
 
Fierce, really? :lol: That's interesting. (In Spanish, it's fiero. Is it not similar to that in Portuguese?)

The English language has A LOT of words, so I don't doubt there is word for this story:

My cousin who was studying English from Korea in America asked me if we had a word for people walking next to each other not holding hands. :huh: I'm sure we have a word, but I don't know what it is.

Maybe that isn't the best example of "untranslatable" but I do know that translating from Spanish to English and vice versa gets fuzzy sometimes. :doh:
 
^ it's feroz in Spanish.
It can be used in the same context as in English but it sounds just as silly.
It's also used to intensify phrases (unlike 'fierce'), for instance: tengo un hambre feroz/I'm ("fiercely") hungry.
I tend to hear it mostly in a sarcastic tone, ex. driver suddenly accelerates and cuts into your lane: "uy que feroz"/"that was fierce".


..I love the word saudade ever since ckgirlbr explained it to me.. and I like how it's pronounced, even if it's hard to get it right!
 
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re: saudade... then how would you express in portugese the noun for deeply longing or yearning for someone?

or could it's english equivalent also be to pine for someone/something?

In English, the verb "To Pine". To Pine for somebody, something or someplace that you miss deeply, to wish you could be there or have it again. A nostalgic yearning for something which may no longer exist, melancholic, fatalist overtone that the object of longing may never return.
wikipedia

sorry, I'm just trying to understand the word and why it is untranslatable to English.
 
How do you guys define "sans" ? I came across the word in an article on a Resort coll on Style.com and still can't understand it
 
^I think that might be just the French word "sans" thrown in here which means "without".
 
Ah, what a nice thread ^_^

As far as I know the german words WANDERLUST and BLITZKRIEG don't have a real translation (at least not in english). Well, of course you can describe them but there is no real synonym.
 
Yup, "sans" just means witout. I doubt I am using it correctly, but I always say, "I'll have #13 sans the meat." :p
 
re: saudade... then how would you express in portugese the noun for deeply longing or yearning for someone?

or could it's english equivalent also be to pine for someone/something?

wikipedia

sorry, I'm just trying to understand the word and why it is untranslatable to English.

If yearning is what you feel like when you miss something and you stay with the memory of that thing for a period of time (like when someone dies and you keep remembering things about that person) you could use the expression to feel saudade too.

The English Wikipedia has an interesting article about the word saudade (I'm copying the parts that I think are the most interesting, not the whole article)

Saudade (singular) or saudades (plural) (pronounced [sɐ.uˈdaðɨ] or [sawˈdaðɨ] in European Portuguese,[1] [sa.uˈdad(ʒ)ɪ] or [sawˈdad(ʒ)ɪ] in Brazilian Portuguese[2] and [sawˈdade] in Galician) is a Portuguese and Galician word difficult to translate adequately, which describes a deep emotional state of nostalgic longing for something or someone that one was fond of and which is lost. It often carries a fatalist tone and a repressed knowledge that the object of longing might really never return.
Saudade has been described as a "vague and constant desire for something that does not and probably cannot exist ... a turning towards the past or towards the future".[3] A stronger form of saudade may be felt towards people and things whose whereabouts are unknown, such as a lost lover, or a family member who has gone missing. It may also be translated as a deep longing or yearning for something which does not exist or is unattainable.
Saudade was once described as "the love that remains" or "the love that stays" after someone is gone. Saudade is the recollection of feelings, experiences, places or events that once brought excitement, pleasure, well-being, which now triggers the senses and makes one live again. It can be described as an emptiness, like someone ( e.g., one's children, parents, sibling, grandparents, friends) or something (e.g., places, pets, things one used to do in childhood, or other activities performed in the past) that should be there in a particular moment is missing, and the individual feels this absence. In Portuguese, 'tenho saudades tuas', translated as 'I have saudades for you' means 'I miss you', but carries a much stronger tone. In fact, one can have 'saudades' of someone with which one is, but have some feeling of loss towards the past or the future.
In Brazil, the day of saudade is officially celebrated on January 30.
Definition

Saudade (or Saudades) is defined as "a somewhat melancholic feeling of incompleteness. It is related to think back situations of privation due to the absence of someone or something, to move away from a place or thing, or to the absence of a set of particular and desirable experiencies and pleasures once lived"Similar words in other languages

There are other words in other languages which can have similar meaning. Saudade relates to the Italian nostalgia (melancolia in Portuguese), in which one feels an interior satisfaction because it is impossible to find something, but one never stops thinking that one is searching for it. It is an incompleteness that one unconsciously wants to never completely resolve. Saudade relates to the French regret, in which one feels a hard sentiment, meaning hardful, but in nostalgic sense. Saudade relates to the Spanish extrañar, in which one feels a missing part of oneself, which can never be completely filled by the thing you cannot have or get back. The word can also be translated by the Spanish expression "echar de menos", which would be roughly an equivalent to the Portuguese "ter saudades", missing something or someone. The Greek word that comes close to translating saudade is νοσταλγία (nostalgia). Nostalgia also appears in the Portuguese language as in the many of other languages with a Indo-European origin, bearing the same meaning of the Greek word "νοσταλγία". There is yet another word that, like 'saudade', has no immediate translation in English: λαχτάρα (lakhtara). This word encompasses sadness, longing and hope, as does the term saudade.
In Albanian, a direct translation of saudade is the word mall, which encompasses feelings of passionate longing, sadness, and at the same time an undefined laughter from the same source. Other variations which give different nuances to this word are: pëmallim, përmallje, etc.
In the Torlak dialect of Bulgarian, spoken today in the easternmost part of Serbia and the remote southern mountains of Kosovo, there is an expression which corresponds more closely to the Japanese and Greek examples below, but can be compared to saudade in the broader sense of longing for the past. It is жал за младос(т) / žal za mlados(t) i.e., "yearning for one's youth." (Since the dialect has not been standardised as a written language it has various forms.) The term and the concept have been popularised in standard Serbian through short prose and plays by Vranje born fin-de-siècle writer Borisav Stanković.
One translation of "saudade" into Dutch is weemoed; a fuzzy form of nostalgia. In the Romanian language, the word dor bears a close meaning to "saudade". It can also stand for "love" or "desire" having a derivation in the noun dorinţă and the verb dori, both of them being translated usually by "wish" and "to wish". However, although the word dor has a complex meaning, it still does not encompass the full meaning of "saudade". Dor is derived from the Latin dolus ("pain"), the same root as the Portuguese word dor, also meaning "pain". In Welsh, Saudade is said to be the only exact equivalent of the Welsh hiraeth and the Cornish hireth.[9] Esperanto borrows the word directly, changing the spelling to accommodate Esperanto grammar, as saŭdado.[10]
In English, the verb "To Pine". To Pine for somebody, something or someplace that you miss deeply, to wish you could be there or have it again. A nostalgic yearning for something which may no longer exist, melancholic, fatalist overtone that the object of longing may never return.
The Finnish language has a word whose meaning corresponds very closely with saudade: kaiho. Kaiho means a state of involuntary solitude in which the subject feels incompleteness and yearns for something unattainable or extremely difficult and tedious to attain. Ironically, the sentiment of kaiho is central to the Finnish tango, in stark contrast to the Argentine tango, which is predominantly sensuous. Kaiho has religious connotations in Finland as well, since the large Lutheran sect called the Awakening (Finnish herännäiset, or körttiläiset more familiarly) consider central to their faith a certain kaiho towards Zion, as expressed in their central book Siionin Virret (Hymns of Zion). However, saudade does not involve tediousness. Rather, the feeling of saudade accentuates itself: the more one thinks about the loved person or object, the more one feels saudade. The feeling can even be creative, as one strives to fill in what is missing with something else or to recover it altogether.
In Korean, keurium (그리움) is probably closest to saudade. It reflects a yearning for anything that has left a deep impression in the heart - a memory, a place, a person, etc. In Japan, saudade expresses a concept similar to the Japanese word natsukashii. Although commonly translated as "dear, beloved, or sweet," in modern conversational Japanese natsukashii can be used to express a longing for the past. It connotes both happiness for the fondness of that memory and goodness of that time, as well as sadness that it is no longer. It is an adjective for which there is no quite fitting English translation. It can also mean "sentimental," and is a wistful emotion. The character used to write natsukashii can also be read as futokoro 懐 [ふところ] and means "bosom," referring to the depth and intensity of this emotion that can even be experienced as a physical feeling or pang in one's chest~ a broken heart, or a heart feeling moved.
In Armenian, "Saudade" is represented by "կարոտ" (karot) that describes the deep feeling of missing of something or somebody.
The Arabic synonym for Saudade is وجد (Wajd), a state of transparent sadness caused by the memory of a loved one who is not near, it's widely used in ancient Arabic poetry to describe the state of the lover's heart as he or she remembers the long gone love. It's a mixed emotion of sadness for the loss, and happiness for having had loved that person. In Turkish, the feeling of saudade is somewhat similar to hüzün. Its position in Turkey is similar to saudade in Portugal in that it's a melancholic feeling popular in art and culture following the fall of a great empire. However hüzün is closer to melancholy and depression in that it's associated with a sense of failure in life and lack of initiative.
In Ithkuil, the root x-ḑ is equivalent to saudade.
wikipedia
 
And in the Portuguese Wikipedia there is a curiosity about the word saudade that says that english translators classified the saudade as the 7th most difficult word to tranlsate.
So I was curious and I searched the most difficult words to translate and I found this:

Mamihlapinatapei
From Yagan, the indigenous language of the Tierra del Fuego region of South America. This word has been translated in several ways in English, always implying a wordless yet meaningful look shared by two people who both desire to initiate something but are both reluctant to start.



Jayus
From Indonesian, meaning a joke so poorly told and so unfunny that one cannot help but laugh.


Prozvonit
In both Czech and Slovak language, this word means to call a mobile phone only to have it ring once so that the other person would call back, allowing the caller not to spend money on minutes.


Kyoikumama
In Japanese, this word refers to a mother who relentlessly pushes her children toward academic achievement.


Tartle
A Scottish verb meaning to hesitate while introducing someone due to having forgotten his/her name.


Iktsuarpok
From the Inuit, meaning to go outside to check if anyone is coming.


Cafuné
From Brazilian Portuguese, meaning to tenderly run one’s fingers through someone’s hair.


Torschlusspanik
From German, this word literally means “gate-closing panic” and is used to describe the fear of diminishing opportunities as one ages. This word is most frequently applied to women who race the “biological clock” to wed and bear children.


Tingo
From the Pascuense language of Easter Island, it is the act of taking objects one desires from the house of a friend by gradually borrowing all of them.


Ilunga
From the Tshiluba language spoken in south-eastern Democratic Republic of the Congo, this word has been chosen by numerous translators as the world’s most untranslatable word. Ilunga indicates a person who is ready to forgive any abuse the first time it occurs, to tolerate it the second time, but to neither forgive nor tolerate a third offense.


Hyggelig
In Denmark, the word Hyggelig is used often, and is said to be closely tied to the Danish national character. A dictionary will provide translations along the lines of cozy, warm, and nice, but a typical Dane will argue that these words don’t come close to capturing the full meaning of the word. Perhaps a true Dane would like to share some thoughts here?


Wabi-Sabi
We recently featured an entire blog article on the Japanese concept of Wabi-Sabi. It is a compound word with a long history, and carries a lot of meaning. Put succinctly, it’s a way of living that emphasizes finding beauty in imperfection, and accepting the natural cycle of growth and decay.



Duende
This Spanish word has a long and interesting history. It’s original use was to describe a mythical entity that lives in forests, sort of like a fairy or a sprite, that possesses human beings and causes them to feel awe, fear, or a sense of beauty in their natural surroundings. Since being updated by the Spanish poet and playwright, Federico García Lorca, in the early 20th century, it is now used to refer to the mysterious power of a work of art to deeply move a person.


Saudade
This Portuguese word was also featured in our most beautiful words post a while back. It refers to the feeling of longing for something or someone that you love and which is lost.


Fairness
This past January, a blog post from the Atlantic Monthly by economist Bart Wilson sparked a debate about whether the English word Fair can be accurately translated. In the Beyond Words analysis of the Fairness translation debate, we explored all the sides, and discussed Wilson’s position that Fairness is a uniquely Anglo concept that carries historical baggage making it very different from notions of equity and right vs. wrong. You decide.
altalang

(I had totally forgotten the word cafuné!)
 
Are we talking that untranslatable means there is no English equivalent to it?
 
^ I didn't think of that when I created the thread, but I'm afraid because of that TFS rule that says that we have to talk in english on the threads the words should be untranslatable to English...
 
^ the rule was implemented for the exchanges/discussions/fights/remarks in other languages, which can be problematic and obviously rude to those that don't speak the language .. this thread, next to the Teach me your language thread, are far from that as it's all usually accompanied by a translation, or an attempt to it like in this case :p..

So..I'm now fully confused on saudade, I mean, in the article you posted it says you can feel saudade for something in the future and that may or may not even exist (be realistic??).. I think I've never felt saudade for anything. :lol::ninja:
 
^ the rule was implemented for the exchanges/discussions/fights/remarks in other languages, which can be problematic and obviously rude to those that don't speak the language .. this thread, next to the Teach me your language thread, are far from that as it's all usually accompanied by a translation, or an attempt to it like in this case :p..

So..I'm now fully confused on saudade, I mean, in the article you posted it says you can feel saudade for something in the future and that may or may not even exist (be realistic??).. I think I've never felt saudade for anything. :lol::ninja:

:lol::lol::lol:
The definition of saudade is very tricky indeed (sometimes even I can't understand it) :D
I think that what he said about feeling saudade for something in the future and that it can or cannot exist is more connected to the lyrical "side" of the word (I hope I didn't make you more confused :lol:)
 
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