Hedi Slimane - Designer

[Phuel]

^^^ Their egos couldn’t handle being treated as everyone else’s. Hedi would absolutely lose it and it would really be all Mullet’s doing; Frida wouldn’t be able to take Lola’s eternal dismissal of her pants; and Ralph… maybe he can posts sketches of his couture designs that he can’t afford to produce for likes/follows/gofundme.

Altuzzara did mention that he’s nervous to read what TFS thinks of his collections. And a member did mention that they didn’t like Haider ever since he sat on their coat LMFAO TFSers can be a tad hard to please.

(It’s such a shame to witness time and time again that it’s the gays that openly flaunt their childish ego for all to ridicule. Matthieu produced a solid effort and Hedi couldn’t stand it— and had to let everyone know he couldn’t stand it. It’s understandable why Chanel may have considered him for that one hot second and realized that the billions and billions of guaranteed profits he would generate, the prestige he’d renewed for the brand, the cool kids he’d bring in, wouldn’t be worth suffering his ego. And I’m saying this as a fashion victim that would take on extra jobs just to afford his Celine. Why can’t these people just remind themselves that they’re just glorified dressmakers LMFAO)

 

[lhhbl]

I'm sure with that after this post from Hedi, Chanel owners are sure they made the right decision (which they did)!

 

[blackcherrified]

I'm sure with that after this post from Hedi, Chanel owners are sure they made the right decision (which they did)!

Hedi is such a PR hot mess in the sense that he’s like that disgruntled middle aged uncle at every family reunion complaining about politics… he hasn’t reached the “grandpapa” age/status like Karl where people would go “oh papa, he’s shooting off from another era” and laugh it off

 

[tricotineacetat]

Truth be told, with none of the top jobs going to far more established designers, (ones that have created collections now canonized as iconic contributions to contemporary fashion history) I too would feel a sense of unease where the industry is headed - And perhaps even see the place in fashion history threatened, considering how forgetful the industry tends to be.

We do not know for certain what went down behind the scenes, who was interviewed and whose demands were considered out of this world. We take it as a given and because we find these speculations entertaining, we let our imagination run wild in this forum.

 

[tricotineacetat]

We could even debate in this place why far superior designers like Nicolas Ghesquière now has a position with lesser prestige as JWA, why Haider Ackermann is the creative director of a relatively niche brand or why Phoebe Philo was not begged by Chanel or LVMH to return to Paris.

I believe the reason for that is less personal than it is the sad truth that the fashion industry of today perhaps no longer values the reputation of the 'superstar designer', otherwise we wouod not have had so many of Raf's, Phoebe's or Nicolas' assistants eventually takibg those top jobs right now.

Brands like Dior Homme or Saint Laurent realized with the right, aggressive marketing and expansion plans, they could still generate more revenue, even without Hedi Slimane at the helm - The same accounts for Virginie Viard's stewardship at Chanel, the revenues were rising even without Karl.

 

[Lola701]

We could even debate in this place why far superior designers like Nicolas Ghesquière now has a position with lesser prestige as JWA, why Haider Ackermann is the creative director of a relatively niche brand or why Phoebe Philo was not begged by Chanel or LVMH to return to Paris.

I believe the reason for that is less personal than it is the sad truth that the fashion industry of today perhaps no longer values the reputation of the 'superstar designer', otherwise we wouod not have had so many of Raf's, Phoebe's or Nicolas' assistants eventually takibg those top jobs right now.

Brands like Dior Homme or Saint Laurent realized with the right, aggressive marketing and expansion plans, they could still generate more revenue, even without Hedi Slimane at the helm - The same accounts for Virginie Viard's stewardship at Chanel, the revenues were rising even without Karl.

Is it that or is it simply that a majority of us, people experiencing fashion today are finally experiencing a shift in the industry that ultimately doesn’t favor our generation and it’s normal: some people will be left out.

For me, the concept of the superstar designer was gone a longtime ago. If we look beyond the paradigm of our obsessions, the generation that Hedi was part of, killed that concept. Hedi, Nicolas, Phoebe were part of a generation that was already more private, more removed than their predecessors.

John Galliano, Alexander McQueen, Tom Ford kind of emerged or at least became known at a time where the idea of success in fashion came with the idea of fame. With that fame, came a certain power because the persona hold as much value as the product.

I just think that different eras respond to different issues. The concept of modernity is a thing that is ever changing.

Every generation question the industry, it codes and it purpose.

We originally went from the figure of the Couturier to the figure of the Creative Director. And all the evolutions challenges that figure because it always comes with a new set of…Challenges.

27 years ago when people like Hedi, Nicolas and Phoebe rose to fame, there were people far more superior than them that could have had their position. I mean, Hedi was a self taught assistant of a great figure of the industry. Him getting YSL in the first place was a happy circumstance concours rather than the result of meritocracy. NG became the CD of Balenciaga because there was a happy circumstance concours. Phoebe was the number 2 of famous daughter of. Then again, happy circumstances gave her the position she had.

Those 3 names were in no way star designers. It’s only fair that their success and undeniable influence would have an effect on the following generation.

 

[tourbillions]

Those 3 names were in no way star designers. It’s only fair that their success and undeniable influence would have an effect on the following generation.

With all the shifts, it seeem only one thing remains the same. Its never about talent and skill. Connections and being at the right place at the right time is all it takes.

 

[tricotineacetat]

Is it that or is it simply that a majority of us, people experiencing fashion today are finally experiencing a shift in the industry that ultimately doesn’t favor our generation and it’s normal: some people will be left out.

For me, the concept of the superstar designer was gone a longtime ago. If we look beyond the paradigm of our obsessions, the generation that Hedi was part of, killed that concept. Hedi, Nicolas, Phoebe were part of a generation that was already more private, more removed than their predecessors.

John Galliano, Alexander McQueen, Tom Ford kind of emerged or at least became known at a time where the idea of success in fashion came with the idea of fame. With that fame, came a certain power because the persona hold as much value as the product.

I just think that different eras respond to different issues. The concept of modernity is a thing that is ever changing.

Every generation question the industry, it codes and it purpose.

We originally went from the figure of the Couturier to the figure of the Creative Director. And all the evolutions challenges that figure because it always comes with a new set of…Challenges.

27 years ago when people like Hedi, Nicolas and Phoebe rose to fame, there were people far more superior than them that could have had their position. I mean, Hedi was a self taught assistant of a great figure of the industry. Him getting YSL in the first place was a happy circumstance concours rather than the result of meritocracy. NG became the CD of Balenciaga because there was a happy circumstance concours. Phoebe was the number 2 of famous daughter of. Then again, happy circumstances gave her the position she had.

Those 3 names were in no way star designers. It’s only fair that their success and undeniable influence would have an effect on the following generation.

While it‘s absolutely true that all three of them obviously rose up to their standing from humble beginnings, I think people recognized immediately an exceptional talent, much like Junya Watanabe, Hussein Chalayan, Viktor & Rolf or Olivier Theyskens were recognized from their very first outings as talents that were put on the map by the big players.

I think the success stories at Saint Laurent by Bellettini/Vaccarello showed in hindsight as a strong case that the authority of the well-known creative director was not needed as the catalyzer of revenue growth.

 

[Lola701]

While it‘s absolutely true that all three of them obviously rose up to their standing from humble beginnings, I think people recognized immediately an exceptional talent, much like Junya Watanabe, Hussein Chalayan, Viktor & Rolf or Olivier Theyskens were recognized from their very first outings as talents that were put on the map by the big players.

I think the success stories at Saint Laurent by Bellettini/Vaccarello showed in hindsight as a strong case that the authority of the well-known creative director was not needed as the catalyzer of revenue growth.

But people recognized also a talent on the new ones. The talent may be open to debate. I have always found Chalayan overrated and while I like Adrover, it’s was already the prémices of that « culture-led » fashion as opposed to design.

The appreciation of talent is different because context is different. It took me JWA first 3 Loewe shows to see what people saw before. I found him terribly overrated in the beginning. But Adrian, Manuela, Donatella saw something in him before a lot of people. The same for Anthony. Parisian editors were rooting for him before Donatella put him on the international map.

Vaccarello was already more of a star when he took over Saint Laurent than Hedi was when they gave him Dior. A context exterior of a pure fashion conversation made Solitaire an iconic show. Much like Vaccarello at Saint Laurent, we only discovered the ability for Hedi to be a great CD at Dior as Pierre Bergé was in charge of the creative direction at Saint Laurent.

But there’s one thing that I will concede. The new generation of stars is living behind the shadows of the older generation, no matter how discreet they are.

When you have designers who have defined a concept of modernity that is still relevant today despite all the technological push, it’s harder to create your room to shine on your own. So in the end, you have to build out of something that exist.

Vaccarello is having a success at Saint Laurent because he has the authority of a creative director. Hedi was a success because he was someone who at some point changed the way people dress, which gave him an authority.

Vaccarello in some ways is not that different from Frida Giannini at Gucci to follow your point. And Gucci experienced great growth under her.

But I agree with you overall. It’s just that for me things have to be put with more perspective maybe.

 

[Nimsay]

It’s hard being the king. Nobody can relate to the king.

Anyway, I was thinking considering Hedi and Hermes are both so out of date, they’d actually be the perfect match. Keep all the timeless stuff together and away from the Celine and Versace crowd.

 

[Nimsay]

Pretty sure I said this before - Hedi’s unemployment is probably just a “too many suitors” situation. Everyone assumed someone else was chasing him, so they went for the easier targets. He’s basically the perfect 10 girl everyone thinks is already taken.

…But now that brands realize he’s actually available, don’t be surprised if they start dumping their mousy, easy to handle, unassuming creative directors to get their moody, hard to please bombshell back.

 

[Phuel]

But people recognized also a talent on the new ones. The talent may be open to debate. I have always found Chalayan overrated and while I like Adrover, it’s was already the prémices of that « culture-led » fashion as opposed to design.

The appreciation of talent is different because context is different. It took me JWA first 3 Loewe shows to see what people saw before. I found him terribly overrated in the beginning. But Adrian, Manuela, Donatella saw something in him before a lot of people. The same for Anthony. Parisian editors were rooting for him before Donatella put him on the international map.

Vaccarello was already more of a star when he took over Saint Laurent than Hedi was when they gave him Dior. A context exterior of a pure fashion conversation made Solitaire an iconic show. Much like Vaccarello at Saint Laurent, we only discovered the ability for Hedi to be a great CD at Dior as Pierre Bergé was in charge of the creative direction at Saint Laurent.

But there’s one thing that I will concede. The new generation of stars is living behind the shadows of the older generation, no matter how discreet they are.

When you have designers who have defined a concept of modernity that is still relevant today despite all the technological push, it’s harder to create your room to shine on your own. So in the end, you have to build out of something that exist.

Vaccarello is having a success at Saint Laurent because he has the authority of a creative director. Hedi was a success because he was someone who at some point changed the way people dress, which gave him an authority.

Vaccarello in some ways is not that different from Frida Giannini at Gucci to follow your point. And Gucci experienced great growth under her.

But I agree with you overall. It’s just that for me things have to be put with more perspective maybe.

Very poignant and absolutely potent point. The fashion era and its consumer absolutely defines the creative vision and those that lead that creative vision and sensibility of the time: It’s why the likes of lessers JW/Anthony/Jacquemus are the new creative leaders. And it’s for that very same reason that Hedi had never returned to the couturey aesthetic and sensibility of his Dior Homme days starting from his Saint Laurent. I’m not completely convinced when he debuted at Saint Laurent that he was designing on just his creative intuition and instincts, but also he sensed a shift in the fashionscape and its paradigm, and adjusted his own standards accordingly. Whether that was of his own accordance or alongside Kering directions, we can only speculate. But on a purely pragmatic level, his Dior Homme wouldn’t be a commercial success nor a sustainable investment for the corporation had he insisted on simply continuing Dior Homme into Saint Laurent.

Someone like Anthony definitely picked up on Hedi’s bending to the will of the times in order to succeed: His first few attempts at SLP were pathetically and unashamedly picking up the scraps of Hedi’s long discarded seconds. Then that infamous showcase of pure style over any semblance of substance when Anthony finally discovers Yves’ archive dumbed it down to an 80s department-store’s sensibility— with a lot of expensive production value courtesy of Kering, launched him and his SLP to stratospheric success. And proves that talent and skill will never be the most important virtue to success. Helmut Lang stated long ago that it was with luck that he got to where he was, something no creative of his era would ever admit to. Maybe more humble in his admission, but it’s never only about talent and skill. And Hedi is someone that reigned back, even restrained his creative vision, as he saw what was right for the time. Olivier Theyskens has that versatility to bend to the wills of the fashion times while staying his course, but unfortunately he’s been unable to capture the fashion zeitgeist for some reason (…even for being by far the fairest one of all didn’t help him to ascend LMFAO). Phoebe absolutely is giving minimum effort for maximum profit in her current incarnation with her namesake.

(…One of those conversations we fashion nerds should be having over bottles and bottles of fine wine and finer food, in a restaurant far far far into the night…)

 

[yslforever]

My issue with Mathieu’s appointment, instead of Hedi, is that Mathieu was the leading CD of a major house only once and for 3 years only.
He was practically unknown before 2021 so I just don’t know if he has any range or a broad vision of a label or even endurance.
But I m sure he is corporate compatible, while Hedi needs Hedi-compatible companies (or shareholders more accurately).

 

[Caffeine]

The same accounts for Virginie Viard's stewardship at Chanel, the revenues were rising even without Karl.

It is a very interesting situation. If you ask a sales person, the answer is that her jeans and pants sold far better than Karl's. I think that the fit was more forgiving and you can afford to have a big lunch and still sit in front of the desk being comfortable. Under VV, this was the first phase. The female clients were happy.

Then the logo pieces started to show up more. Fewer lesage pieces in Metiers collections (they used to offer very innovative lesage fabrics, some wild), and the craftsmanship was "represented" by cheaper and cheaper looking beading work. new proportions and silhouettes were replaced by superficial crafty decorations. Fewer pure cashmere sweaters. The fitting room experience progressively got worse (not due to sales people). But the young, logo-chasing crowd kept corporate happy. What was missing was vision. (similarly with Chiuri, I think.)

So both JWA and Blazy were brought in to solve the vision crisis, IMHO.

Objectively speaking, JWA's collection fared far worse than Blazy's, but it was less concerning to me as a consumer. Dior always offered the 30 Montaigne line. (That wool + silk fabric is heaven.) It will also always offer commercial pieces that are rich girls friendly. You know that these are not going anywhere.

The Blazy situation, given how Chanel used to offer RTW with the Act I vs. Act II system (the commercial collection is still more or less related to the runway theme), makes it more uncertain. It will be interesting to see how it plays out. I am certain that if buyers strike, the C suite will ask Blazy to make adjustments.

Heidi's celine was another interesting case. I'm glad to get a couple of things from his last collection - they were very well made. In the mean time, he was also corporate friendly enough to offer blouses made with acetate rather than silk, logo tshirts, basic yet cute sneakers, etc.. (Feel free to come in and lecture me on how necessary it is to use acetate in certain designs...) If he were to start his own label, I will follow him. Come to think of it, maybe I just belong in that old generation now.

p.s. love the cat fights. Thanks for sharing all the Instagram drama. Keep them coming.

 

[Caffeine]

My issue with Mathieu’s appointment, instead of Hedi, is that Mathieu was the leading CD of a major house only once and for 3 years only.
He was practically unknown before 2021 so I just don’t know if he has any range or a broad vision of a label or even endurance.
But I m sure he is corporate compatible, while Hedi needs Hedi-compatible companies (or shareholders more accurately).

How likely is it for him to start his own label?