Jonathan Anderson - Designer, Creative Director of JW Anderson & Christian Dior

[PDFSD]

Jonathan is going to sell gimmicks and hype which will mainly translate into accessories sales, but as for real clothes that people will actually wear? I don't think so. Which is why this appointment is going wild on social media with all the fashion people who get given things for free and get invited to shows for free but not really exciting the current client base that actually buys Dior.

He is a brilliant designer but in all honesty he really struggles to do classic and chic clothes, which is really what Dior RTW and HC is all about. I know Dior wants to be at the cutting edge of fashion and blah blah blah, but at its essence, it really is a classic kind of brand. And Jonathan is literally the opposite of that.

You just watch, they're going to sell the most basic RTW ever in stores (t-shirts and knitwear with logos) when he comes on board because 90% of the Dior client base is not going to wear stuff like this, even if it does have a Dior label on it....

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LOEWE

absolutely a risk agree totally .... also to some degree Blazy at Chanel and what we seen already at Burberry when modern IG friendly hype quirky design needs to mesh with a more classical warm romantical brands like Chanel Dior and Burberry.

I think he will adapt more successfully than the other two boys somehow he is more savvy and not so singular to one silhouette or taste .

 

[tourbillions]

Burberry when modern IG friendly hype quirky design needs to mesh with a more classical warm romantical brands like Chanel Dior and Burberry

The design isn't much of a problem in burberry. There was always some room for quirkiness there, its really just the price point which eliminated the people who would actually buy and wear lee's designs.

 

[jeanclaude]

he is more savvy and not so singular to one silhouette or taste .

Of course! He is always open to copy from here and there!

 

[Frederic01]

I think he will adapt more successfully than the other two boys somehow he is more savvy and not so singular to one silhouette or taste .

This is going to be a massive problem at Dior if he doesn't lock down an identifiable aesthetic. We are in the current fashion age where every brand is doing everything and the consumer is confused. You can see the same jacket silhouette in twenty different luxury brands and with not much difference.

The danger of Jonathan at Dior is also that he will be going head to head with Matthieu, as they have a similar way of approaching these heritage brands and in some ways a comparable aesthetic. Matthieu though will have the upper hand because he won't be doing menswear and therefore purely focused on womenswear. Less shows means better and more dynamic ideas. The more shows the worse the output.

 

[PDFSD]

This is going to be a massive problem at Dior if he doesn't lock down an identifiable aesthetic. We are in the current fashion age where every brand is doing everything and the consumer is confused. You can see the same jacket silhouette in twenty different luxury brands and with not much difference.

The danger of Jonathan at Dior is also that he will be going head to head with Matthieu, as they have a similar way of approaching these heritage brands and in some ways a comparable aesthetic. Matthieu though will have the upper hand because he won't be doing menswear and therefore purely focused on womenswear. Less shows means better and more dynamic ideas. The more shows the worse the output.

I agree with the top part absolutely but JWA was already doing his brand beside Loewe and longer than Matthieu.

The reporthing was conflicting as its understood his JWA brand will be put on hold for him to concentrate on Dior.

I find JWA world building way stronger than Matthieu at BV, JWA just for the fact that he always does interviews and handles the press to convey his message etc he knows how to play the part from communication to design hype products with marketing.

Matthieu has been one note in his message like his trilogy on Italy fashion shows or craft focus shows he is much slower in approach to developing ideas where as JWA is doing multiple collections both at his brand and Loewe with ever changing ideas or approaches for much longer than Matthieu.(hence JWA has a longer and stronger track record)

Sure like VV at Chanel she did not have to talk or address the press like KL did commercially it was even more successful than KL final years, so ist true that it's not a metric for success to have a strong narrative or even strong fashion point of view at Chanel as the house codes are stronger than at Dior. So sure he will have it easier at Chanel.

But Matthieu has his own issues with design for me, where what you see overstyled at BV shows can almost convince you of his modernity, but once you break it down to a more normal singular look falls flat and looks frumpy even his shoes are very old lady. This at Chanel might be even as bad as VV worst looks wich also had issues with frumpiness at Chanel.

I just bet on JWA like the Devil works harder and is maybe even more convincing than the Chanel boy. (based of his track record)

 

[Frederic01]

I find JWA world building way stronger than Matthieu at BV, JWA just for the fact that he always does interviews and handles the press to convey his message etc he knows how to play the part from communication to design hype products with marketing.

Matthieu has been one note in his message like his trilogy on Italy fashion shows or craft focus shows he is much slower in approach to developing ideas where as JWA is doing multiple collections both at his brand and Loewe with ever changing ideas or approaches for much longer than Matthieu.(hence JWA has a longer and stronger track record)

Do you really think so @PDFSD? I think they are very comparable in terms of "world building". Matthieu was quick to build his codes even though he was there for only three years. Jonathan was at Loewe for 11, so he had a lot more time to consolidate his aesthetic. If you look at his first three years at Loewe, there was not much going on. So in that way Matthieu is more dynamic.

What was good about Matthieu also was the way in which he balanced the concept of modernity with the bourgeois. Jonathan's clothes and accessories on the other hand are much skewed towards a younger and very fashion-forward crowd. I don't see how his stuff could appeal to a more mature audience for example. This was why Loewe was a 2/3 billion dollar brand and why Dior under Maria Grazia was basically double or triple that. Her "classicism" had mass appeal and is what sold at the end of the day.

The danger with Jonathan is that he will go too fashion forward and alienate the existing client base. For me, he is yet to prove that he can do something intemporel. Sure he can do "of the moment" and "cool" and all of that, but something truly timeless? I have my doubts. Matthieu on the other hand, can do classic and can do modern at the same time. In that way he is better positioned to succeed at Chanel.

 

[PDFSD]

The design isn't much of a problem in burberry. There was always some room for quirkiness there, its really just the price point which eliminated the people who would actually buy and wear lee's designs.

Price is an problem when brand aura & hype versus design output are misaligned.

I really don't subscribe to the price point narrative for the main issues at Burberry i really don't .
It would be last in a top 5 of naming why Lee is flopping at Burberry.

Lee Design approach to Burberry was from the first show a misalignment of ideas (too much too jarring)
and he is still adjusting his approach without much success on a design level, its all over the place and not clear nor distinct.

If the design was not a problem people would buy it like crazy in sale/outlet and that did not happen either for some seasons now.
Prada most basic items made for outlets or out of season items put in sale/outlets still sell well i bet you it helps that they are a hot brand again.

Glitz.paris​

Prada and Miu Miu success lies partly in factory outlets​

A significant proportion of Prada's sales are made through factory outlets and outlet shops. © Studio Pachamama
The success of Prada and Miu Miu, which are posting insolent growth while their competitors' results plummet, is based in part on production for factory outlets. Glitz.paris looks at how the Italian group is defying the crisis. [...]
Published on 07/11/2024



I don't know anybody in or out of the industry that was or is lusting after anything from Burberry the convo´s don't even get to mention of price.

it starts and end with the desire for the product , you don't create it you don't have the desire for it .
whole luxury industry is build on being overpriced and not for everyone aura people are Happy to over pay for something they desire or lust after for what ever reason.

 

[PDFSD]

Do you really think so @PDFSD? I think they are very comparable in terms of "world building". Matthieu was quick to build his codes even though he was there for only three years. Jonathan was at Loewe for 11, so he had a lot more time to consolidate his aesthetic. If you look at his first three years at Loewe, there was not much going on. So in that way Matthieu is more dynamic.

What was good about Matthieu also was the way in which he balanced the concept of modernity with the bourgeois. Jonathan's clothes and accessories on the other hand are much skewed towards a younger and very fashion-forward crowd. I don't see how his stuff could appeal to a more mature audience for example. This was why Loewe was a 2/3 billion dollar brand and why Dior under Maria Grazia was basically double or triple that. Her "classicism" had mass appeal and is what sold at the end of the day.

The danger with Jonathan is that he will go too fashion forward and alienate the existing client base. For me, he is yet to prove that he can do something intemporel. Sure he can do "of the moment" and "cool" and all of that, but something truly timeless? I have my doubts. Matthieu on the other hand, can do classic and can do modern at the same time. In that way he is better positioned to succeed at Chanel.

JWA is few steps and heads ahead and i don't even like him when he talks lol

yes sure JWA track record is longer this i don't deny but JWA was doing his own brand and had buzz since those years as well his hype is not just today.

Agree absolutely with above on Dior and MGC Dior is at 10 billion mark already yes.
JWA is at Dior to do that bring youthfulness and modernity , Chanel same via Blazy with the big bent towards craft mantra as they have issues as we know.

like what happened with LV with Marc (it became to much mass a brand for secretary so that's why they went for Nicholas to bring this high concept fashion and youthful edgy at the top of the pyramid making it future forward looking.

And it worked!! like it or not NG crazy obsession with future makes for trickle down design for the commercial collections.

Will be same what will happen at Dior and Chanel, top will be fashion in the know design and parts will influence the wider product range, the old story of the parfum versus the au the toilet :-)

NG LV shows are very hard to wear yet LV is bigger than ever, its a plus JWA is fashion forward they want the buzz around Dior every show it helps bottomline sales.

 

[Grets]

JWA fashion is too art-world-pretentious-chic that appears to be above most consumers BUT the LVMH propaganda machine will generate enough smoke and mirrors for consumers to want to buy into his world. Even if it lacks substance or they don't understand the post-irony-post-modern-surrealism discourse🙄. They get to buy into the culture in the form of a logo bag or sunglasses. And with JWA doing a collection almost every 2 weeks, he will continue to be in the media.

Blazy I think puts more thought and depth. Again, ultra pretentious (ie the leather paper bag, the leather denim🥱) but that idea was beaten over our heads. I wonder if Blazy will be able to keep up with JWA or will his strength be in well-thought-out, well-executed ideas, repeated and re-worked enough to create icons. Currently, Chanel despite the luxury decline, remains one of the most coveted luxury brands after Hermes. Dior is iconic, but it doesn't have the same luxury cache that Chanel has and this is even obvious to most consumers. But it will be on JWA to position Dior as if it is in the same league both in fashion and finance as Chanel.

 

[Lola701]

JWA fashion is too art-world-pretentious-chic that appears to be above most consumers BUT the LVMH propaganda machine will generate enough smoke and mirrors for consumers to want to buy into his world. Even if it lacks substance or they don't understand the post-irony-post-modern-surrealism discourse🙄. They get to buy into the culture in the form of a logo bag or sunglasses. And with JWA doing a collection almost every 2 weeks, he will continue to be in the media.

Blazy I think puts more thought and depth. Again, ultra pretentious (ie the leather paper bag, the leather denim🥱) but that idea was beaten over our heads. I wonder if Blazy will be able to keep up with JWA or will his strength be in well-thought-out, well-executed ideas, repeated and re-worked enough to create icons. Currently, Chanel despite the luxury decline, remains one of the most coveted luxury brands after Hermes. Dior is iconic, but it doesn't have the same luxury cache that Chanel has and this is even obvious to most consumers. But it will be on JWA to position Dior as if it is in the same league both in fashion and finance as Chanel.

I don’t think clients have to « understand » intellectualism. Those are conversations for fashion obsessed or industry people.
For the average consumer, it’s just « creative ».
I don’t think consumers understood one bit of the Galliano era. But it was provocative, creative and therefore, it was cool.

The problem in fashion is when it becomes a formula that doesn’t have an update.
How do you find ways to update it? Through new stimulus.
Chanel and Dior will have the initial boost of the new. It’s new, it’s fresh and people will go for it. Then after 5 years, customers will be able to see a clear language and appropriate some products and then it will evolve.

The downfall of MGC is the lack of evolution. Yes her collections were beautiful and wearable but she basically gave all her hits in her first 2 collections.

I’m not sure that Louis Vuitton by NG or even by Pharrell is attracting new clients anymore. But in NG case, every 2/3 seasons, he introduce a new bag, a new pair of boots or re-introduce things he did in the past and it create a new stimulus.

And @PDFSD said it well, brands cannot afford to be to common. The profile of designers chosen and the moment they are chosen is telling. Those brands aren’t afraid to appear more elitist because it’s actually what is the ultimate goal.
There’s nothing more common than a booktote or oblique logos all over today. And while Chanel is a little bit less accessible than Dior, the collections and communication have been more on the Mass lately than the elite in terms of perception.

 

[chalayan]

disaster pending!

 

[carla56]

disaster pending!

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Love! And love that is a hunk and not a twink ahahah hope the cast will be like this

 

[Thefrenchy]

Loving this !!!

 

[Monsieur Cristobal]

Love! And love that is a hunk and not a twink ahahah hope the cast will be like this

HHH



Hunks Have Hair 😘

 

[Kimihiro]

I’m actually loving the art direction so far. Going a bit vintage packaging vibes, and the complete obliteration of the Dior Homme archetype.

 

[Olaffo]

Told you! There will be Dior jockstraps !! 🤪

 

[kasper!]

Prada was the worst!
I know the New York and Milan stores had cool stuff but the Montaigne store in Paris? For years I was so frustrated. Ok, the precollections were always produced but the runway collections!? Sometimes they told me they had 1 size for 1 coat!
And Prada between 2006 and 2015 was practically hits after hits. Some collections were fairly produced, then others, nothing!
But at the same time, they produced the accessories.

They slightly changed it when they had troubles. It seems like since RAF came, the stuff is produced but since I don’t really check for Prada anymore, I can’t really tell.

But I’m sure it’s still 80% black nylon in stores.

I remember a girl from Prada told me (it was 2016) that the new arrival was very inconsistent. Sometimes 2 times a month, then next new arrival was after 3 months. I believe Prada was suffering big production disorder then...

OK back to topic, I think we can all neglect his 2 collections for Uniqlo every year. It is mostly about polos and socks...

 

[Nimsay]

The lack of actual clothing is pretty glaring. Swim shorts?

 

[oioioi]

Looking forward to it! It's just a teaser of a mood.
The real show and campaign is where we can get all the clothes.

 

[Kimihiro]

I remember the first teaser for SAINT LAURENT (PARIS) it was a naked body too. I’m hopeful because it seems far from what he did at Loewe.