Punk

[SiennaInLondon]

My fav punk band is The Libertines with Pete Doherty, Kate Moss' boyfriend !!!

not THEM again... please let us not confuse the real thing with the wannabe something - anything...

I'm sorry to say this, but Doherty is just a wannabe rock star proving to anyone who will listen how rock n roll he is, believing that by publicly being a junkie he has discovered the wheel, and Moss, is a wannabe groupie who will shug anyone who will hold a microphone for longer than 5 seconds and, please, someone tell me how PUNK is THAT!???

Just to say I think Pete categorises himself as an acoustic rock musician first and foremost not a punk. It's even on the Shambles' Myspace page. As for the rest of it, I suspect you are another one bored by the hype who hasn't listened to the music that he produces but anyway anything I say won't make you change your mind...

Anyway great thread people. Very interesting posts.

 

[cardboardboxed]

of course, but it's a trend in the fashion industry... ...as sad is it may appear to us..... it goes a bit against the "rules" of punk, i can't help but agree with you.... but the fashion industry takes inspiration from everywhere, like from the streets, so it's no surprise that a style as specific as punk is making it big.... (skinny pants, edgy black hair, distressed clothing, accessories...)

I totally agree. Though punk as soley a style does go against the origins of punk, high fashion gets influences from everywhere, old and new fashions, street kids or high couture. I don't really see a problem with it, unless someone who obviously isn't into the lifestyle and muic goes around proclaiming they are punk. Then that's just annoying. Oops, a little off topic...

This is such a great thread! ^^

 

[tangerine]

Richard Hell photographed by Roberta Bayley

I was sayin' let me out of here
before I was even born, it's such a gamble when you get a face
It's fascinating to observe what the mirror does,
but when I dine it's for the wall that I set a place

I belong to the blank generation
and I can take it or leave it each time
I belong to the ______ generation
but I can take it or leave it each time

Malcolm McLaren was obsessed with Richard Hell and wanted Hell or Syl Sylvain to front the band that would become known as the Sex Pistols. He took Hell's style as the jumping off point for the clothing designs that Vivienne Westwood would later popularize.

Please Kill Me, by Legs McNeil and Gillian McCain, is a great book about the history of "punk".

 

[skinny_boho]

I've always been a great fan os Vivienne Westwood and the Sex Pistols, even before knowing they were linked ninja: sssh don't comment, I was young!) and some season ago I went a little punk on my own. Now I wonder: is it a contraddiction to me to keep loving the Pistols, Vivienne, the Dolls, the Television and that scene and wearing like a... "Chelsea girl" (I've read that thread just a few minutes ago ) or a boho chick?
I will love some punk parts to death, they're just me

 

[Kimkhuu]

^ Like I said earlier in this thread, punk ideology has NOTHING to do with the style. Just don't force it.

 

[skinny_boho]

^ So your response, my oracle?
Can I sleep pacify tonight?

 

[vy88]

Great pic Travolta..... ...but I doubt a real punk would be able to afford V Westwood stuff...... It's so ironic to have such a big name doing punk inspired clothing....

actually Vivienne wasn't really well known or popular in the early 70's...she and McLaren started out in the ghetto part of King's Road...McLaren just so happened to be the manager of Sex Pistols...with McLaren's ideas of how he wanted the clothes to look and Vivienne's ability make clothes and to deconstruct and rebuild a different garment...the clothes didn't catch on until the Sex Pistols wore the clothes on their first gig....the clothes did appeal to the fans and caught on....after she and McLaren went on their seperate ways, then she made a name for herself and was named Designer of the Year twice in row...

 

[skinny_boho]

^ Right!
It's kinda funny to think that, in the end, the Pistols were like models for the Sex.
But I them

 

[RobbertJan]

I like original punk music a lot to, iggy pop&stooges, ramones, sex pistols, richard hell and the voidoids, the clash. back then i think it was a political statement, going against everything that was accepted in that society and trying to get attention for the bad situation in particular in London, which was basically still the same post WO 2 city with bomb sites still throughout the city and huge unemployment. I think the style of the punks then was also a big anti statement against hippies with long hair and flared trousers as was there music which used a lot of simple guitar riffs in contradiction to the very technical art-rock that was big at the time. i disagree with the people saying the velvet underground where the founders of punk. i think velvet was a very influential band for all of rock music, but i think they must be regarded as an art-rock band. I think Iggy Pop and the Stooges really started it and the Ramones perfected it. Sex Pistols, Clash, Damned, pretty much every band that was later going to be a big punk band, they were all fans of the Ramones and heavily influenced by them. It's unfortunate that Ramones only got the real appreciation they deserved when most of the group had already past away.

i'll skip the whole post-punk scene for now, i wanted to comment on some modern day '' punk''. ofcourse the real punk aesthetic doesn't exist with most bands any more, it's not the right time. but in my opinion green day, who are sell-outs indeed and look really bad, have made an album that does come close to a real punk album: Amercian Idiot. In my opinion the whole concept of going against the bush administration could be considered a bit punk. it afterall is a protest album. Avril lavigne and that sort of sad wannabe's aren't worth discussing i think.

about the people being tired of pete doherty and insulting him for being a fake idiot: pete's not a punk and he doesn't want to be one. i admit i'm a fan but i think his whole drug addiction and relationship with kate moss is stupid and lately turning him into a bit of an rock-star parody. i think the media are greatly responsible for this image, as they are portraying him as a fraud constantly. but i think if you are to judge him you should do so after having listened to both libertines albums thoroughly and listened to some babyshambles songs and the acoustic shaking and withdrawm session. i think pete is one of the greatest talents in contemporary music and his lyric have a great poetry in them and should be valued very highly, in the last decade no band has come close to writing songs like this. so please don't judge him and call him a wannabe without listening to his music and just copy what you've read in the sun.

anyways just my views, feel free to argue !! Great threadB)

 

[skinny_boho]

iggy pop&stooges, ramones, sex pistols, richard hell and the voidoids, the clash.

And don't forget X-ray spex! And Generation X even if the turned to pop and the whole billy idol thing...
and the clash turned into pop too IMO

 

[Jadee]

the clash turned into pop too IMO

No they didn't. They were always inspired by other music genres like reggae (because they were from west London.) ska or rockabilly and by the emerging New York rap/hip hop scene in the 80's but they never turned into pop. They were all about street cultures IMHO.

 

[skinny_boho]

MMMMH... i still prefer the Pistols!

 

[Jadee]

MMMMH... i still prefer the Pistols!

I've never liked them , sorry. They were all image (but what an image though!) and had nothing interesting to say on a political level nor had any musical talent IMO. I can understand the fascination though but to me The Clash are the one who made Punk meaningful.

 

[skinny_boho]

I'm not as expert as you are so

 

[Jadee]

I'm not as expert as you are so

The Clash are my favourite band.








from clashphotorockers.free.fr

 

[skinny_boho]

Actually I just know their most famous songs, starting from London calling which I just love

 

[kus]

punk. well, forever then.
where is this thread?
how i get here?

 

[verb]

the clothes didn't catch on until the Sex Pistols wore the clothes on their first gig....the clothes did appeal to the fans and caught on....after she and McLaren went on their seperate ways, then she made a name for herself and was named Designer of the Year twice in row...

Actually, according to John Lydon's autobiography, the Sex shop was selling well before the pistols wore any of their clothes, and for rather ludicrous prices then as well! He talks about skipping meals just to be able to pay for a shirt or a sweater, even. Funny that Viv wouldn't even give them many free clothes despite being the sole reason for propelling her brand globally.

Also, saying that the Sex Pistols didn't have a political agenda or talent is slightly misguided in my opinion. Look at all of the tracks on their debut, you have to admit that the style is genius, the lyrical work and vocal patterns are well ahead of their time, and the overall image of the band (thanks to Mclaren) was a hit as well! Don't get me wrong, I love The Clash as much as anyone else and they are by far my favorite band (especially their s/t album), but I don't think it's fair to dismiss the pistols!

 

[skinny_boho]

^

 

[julien sorel]

as hinted at before the legitimacy of these alot of these PUNK bands is often questioned:
it is often argued that Mclaren and the Sex Pistols and a bunch of those other bands simply used 'anarchy' and 'anti-capitalism' 'etc etc' politcal agendas to SELL RECORDS! a marketing stratedgy that is often endured in the music industry where angry little mall rats jump at the chance to drop a few bucks to piss off their parents.