Racial Diversity In Modeling

[Joseph26]

I think this is a really important point. In fact, there are a lot of people like Joseph. I think it's OK to accept the status quo, no matter how bad it is ... I think it's OK to have no moral courage. I have to accept that other people have that right. But to actively criticize and try to stifle those who don't accept the status quo, and who do have the moral courage to try to make a difference, to tell them they're being silly, that they should exercise only their economic power and not their freedom of speech ... that, I think, is reeeeeally bad. Perhaps this particular issue isn't a matter of life and death. But the issues you discuss above were. If you don't take a moral view of the small issues, you'll never have the moral muscle you need to deal with the really big ones.

it has nothing to do with moral courage, it's more about to be mature, understand life how it is, there are things that will never change, there are catholic churchs, christian curchs, Jehovah Witnesses churchs, buddhist temples ...... they can't share their traditions, Different Strokes By Different Folks, simply pick what you want.

there are gay bars and heterosexual bars, why? different customes, they can't be be all together and that will never change, and it doesn't have to do with homophobia, it's all about to have a place where everyone can feel identified with others.

there are WC for women and WC for men, why? different habits I guess.

THAT'S HOW LIFE IS, Vogue is not for everybody just like Jehovah Witnesses churchs are not for catholics, why is it so complicated to understand?

 

[Joseph26]

Wow Naomi said this,isn't she the one who at the time were refusing to walk the runway if they were other black models at the same fashion show ???!!!

E-X-A-C-T-L-Y ! she has aways been like a panther defending her place, I have noticed that black women in the entertainment world are jealous and enviuos, just look at Beyonce and all her jealousy toward Rhianna, Jennifer Hudson .... I mean, you can't really help them, if they don't support each other then?

I also know several Naomi fans whose hate toward Tyra is extreme! that's sick!

I agree with what you guys are saying but as a black women I can't take Naomy "I'm full of myself " Campbell 's statement seriously.She's a joke and a hypocrite period.

I agree and I can't believe people here is buying her ideas, it's so funny

 

[kimair]

fashionista-ta...brilliant!

zen...you make a very valid point...
there has been much debate in the black community as what constitutes a "pretty" black woman, and does that mean she is lighter skinned, or are darker skinned blacks somehow inferior...

in vogue's eyes, maybe the women who have lighter skin will be better sellers, because it may be easier for readers to swallow...

it has nothing to do with moral courage, it's more about to be mature, understand life how it is, there are things that will never change, there are catholic churchs, christian curchs, Jehovah Witnesses churchs, buddhist temples ...... they can't share their traditions, Different Strokes By Different Folks, simply pick what you want.

you don't seem to get it...this is NOT about culture, religion, beliefs, etc....
racism is mostly based on the physicial...
if two people walk into a bar, one is black and one is white, why should a bartender ignore the black person and only serve the white person?
no one is asking vogue to print stories about african safaris or hip-hop...
if a model is supposed to be a canvas for the clothes, a white model can do it just as well as a black model...

it has EVERYTHING to do with moral courage...
someone has to stand up for injustices or nothing will change...
yes, there are things that will never change, but this isn't one of them...
harriet tubman escaped slavery and then helped others escape...
two black students sat outside the university of alabama to force the school to admit them...
oprah wanted change, she wanted her own show and she made it happen...

i'm glad all of them did nothing...
i wouldn't have gone to college, or have the opportunities i do as a black woman...

i also see points made about naomi...
yes she did have a reputation in the past for not wanting to work with other black models...
i think she saw it as a competition thing...
there wasn't alot of work period for black models, and she didn't want her work to decrease...
i think naomi has done alot of growing up in recent years...
her arrest, community service, working with nelson mandela, and her appearance on tyra had a lot to do with it...
i really think she is trying to grow up and make amends for the mistakes she made in the past, and try to use her name and stature to do that...

 

[BaroqueRockstar]

^ thanks

[bbc]

I would love to see Alek Wek get a cover while she still looks young and beautiful, but i can't remember an editorial of hers in uk vogue recently so probably 0% chance.

does anyone know the demographics of people who read fashion magazines?

 

[Joseph26]

it has EVERYTHING to do with moral courage...
someone has to stand up for injustices or nothing will change...
yes, there are things that will never change, but this isn't one of them...
harriet tubman escaped slavery and then helped others escape...
two black students sat outside the university of alabama to force the school to admit them...
oprah wanted change, she wanted her own show and she made it happen...

i'm glad all of them did nothing...
i wouldn't have gone to college, or have the opportunities i do as a black woman...

Education is a primary, basic necessity, it should be a right for every human being, just don't compare education with fashion, fashion is a frivolous thing, insted of spending money buying Vogue expecting to see black women and complaining about wanting black women looking "chic" in fashion magazines, isn't a better idea to pay attention to all those women in Darfur? what have we done for them? that would be real moral courage!

i think naomi has done alot of growing up in recent years...
her arrest, community service, working with nelson mandela, and her appearance on tyra had a lot to do with it...

i really think she is trying to grow up and make amends for the mistakes she made in the past, and try to use her name and stature to do that...

did you really pay attention what she said?

"Only white models, some of whom are not as prominent as I am, are put on the front pages"

excuse me but that woman is everything except humble.

1 - her arrest was a consequence of her wild and rude behaviour.


2 - her community service was an obligation, not an act of maturity,she was even childish trying to make fun of that in W magazine.


she's a fake to me and a lot of others that I know.

 

[kimair]

Education is a primary, basic necessity, it should be a right for every human being, just don't compare education with fashion, fashion is a frivolous thing, insted of spending money buying Vogue expecting to see black women and complaining about wanting black women looking "chic" in fashion magazines, isn't a better idea to pay attention to all those women in Darfur? what have we done for them? that would be real moral courage!

it should be, but it isn't...
equality is a right for everyone, no matter if we're talking about fashion or education....
again you did not see my point...
my point was that those people stood up for change, and change happened...

and if you get right down to it, this isn't really about vogue...
it's about more representation for minority models in this industry...
it is a business like any other...
fashion can mean anything from vogue to k-mart...
if i were a waitress or a doctor and a they weren't hiring minorities, i would have the same opinion...

finally you do not have any idea about my personal beliefs regarding darfur or anything else, or what i am doing in that regard, so please do not challenge them...
i am only speaking here about fashion...
i was using those examples to illustrate a point...

 

[softgrey]

joseph-
everything you say is wrong...

period...
you are wrong ...
or you live in a place that is very backwards and narrow-minded...
or are too young to know how different things actually ARE from what they have been...
you maybe be simply ignorant...
but in any case..you are still completely wrong...

i invite you to please join us in the year 2007...


*regarding who is on the cover of magazines...
esp british vogue...the sales figures and advertisers determine this...nothing else...
it's not even models anymore...it's all celebs...
and it def has gone down...

i remember when there used to be a LOT more black models in eds and on covers...
especially ELLE magazine was known for this...
and it was the best selling magazine at the time!....
it's not all about vogue...
there ARE other magazines in the world...

 

[Joseph26]

isn't really about vogue...
it's about more representation for minority models in this industry...
it is a business like any other...
fashion can mean anything from vogue to k-mart...

the modeling world just like fashion is all about trends, what is IN right now tomorrow will be OUT, the same happens with models, in the 80's were the blonde ones, in the late 80's - early 90's the ethnic ones like Yasmeen and Nadege, mid 90's were anti-glamazons, late 90's were British Ones like Stella, Honor, Karen and Erin, the early 00's were for the brazilian ones, now there's a trend of European girls, what's wrong? that's how the modelling world works, maybe in a future there will be a trend of black models, or latinas, or asian ones who knows? let's wait!

 

[Joseph26]

joseph-
everything you say is wrong...

you're entitled to your opinion , well, everyone.

it's not all about vogue...
there ARE other magazines in the world...

I agree! leave Vogue alone

 

[Joseph26]

i remember when there used to be a LOT more black models in eds and on covers... it's not even models anymore...it's all celebs...
and it def has gone down...

welcome to 2007 u2!

 

[MissMagAddict]

I read & skimmed...


Thought: Naomi should open a school in Kenya not a modeling agency

Thought: Yes, we are citizens of the world...but if you think everyone has the same rights (even in the US) then I challenge you to think again.

Fact: Puffy Daddy (as he was known then) covered the Couture & was featured in the main editorial for US Vogue October 1999. This is the closest you're going to get to a Hip-Hop Vogue.

Fact: Armani doesn't advertise in US Vogue.

Fact: I've been known to use the Men's WC when the line for the Women's WC was too long & I had to go really really badly

 

[JeanAvril]

Fact: Puffy Daddy (as he was known then)

Puff Daddy. I'm sorry, I just had to say it.

 

[MissMagAddict]

Puff Daddy. I'm sorry, I just had to say it.

Yeah whatever...it was a typo...

ever made one

 

[JeanAvril]

Yeah whatever...it was a typo...

ever made one

Too many times.......

 

[mint condish]

It doesn't matter to me who buys Vogue.
It doesn't matter to me what race the editors and writers of Vogue are.
It doesn't matter to me what advertisers want.
Yes, this might matter to "Vogue", but to me, all that matters is racial equality and Vogue should join the modern world instead of trying desperately to perpetuate the past. It doesn't matter to me that European girls are in now. Things can change, anything can change. Change to me is way more exciting than stagnation. Acceptance and diversity is way more interesting to me than sameness.

 

[eternitygoddess]

Maybe 'white' is just 'in' nowadays.

Weren't Brazilians in a while ago?

 

[JeanAvril]

Maybe 'white' is just 'in' nowadays.

Apparently. Vogue was more diverse in 2004 than it is now.

 

[Joseph26]

Thought: Naomi should open a school in Kenya not a modeling agency

Great thought! and maybe Naomi should be the first one to go that school

Fact: Puffy Daddy (as he was known then) covered the Couture & was featured in the main editorial for US Vogue October 1999. This is the closest you're going to get to a Hip-Hop Vogue.

yeah the Hip Hop Issue, and what about the Bling Bling Issue? Kelis, 50 cent, Jay Z and Pharrel showing the latest couture collections.

Fact: Armani doesn't advertise in US Vogue..

do you know the reason? I have seen some ads in 1990 magazines.

Fact: I've been known to use the Men's WC when the line for the Women's WC was too long & I had to go really really badly.

and I used the women's WC for the same reason!

 

[kimair]

does anyone know the demographics of people who read fashion magazines?

here are the statistics i was able to find about just the u.s:

8 out of 10 black women are magazine readers (85%)
they read 11.9 issues per month, compared to 9.1 issues for all u.s. adults
nearly 3 out of 4 (72%) who read magazines are between the ages of 18 and 49 compared to the percentage for all u.s. adults (64%)
the spending power for blacks rose 127% in 14 years (to $723 billion) and is expected to reach $965 billion by 2009

i checked the conde nast site, and they don't have race demographics in their media kits...

 

[fashionista-ta]

One of the magazines I subscribe to is targeted to the audience I mentioned above, English-literate American women, has a black woman on the cover every month, and seems to be doing rather well--O Magazine. I would also venture to say that people are buying it for the unique content rather than the cover girl, lovely though she is.

I keep going back in my mind to the information kimair cited about the poor-selling Dunst/Antoinette cover, etc. I am starting to believe it's not about the money ... that that's just a red herring, an excuse. I'm starting to believe it's about a lack of imagination

As far as Naomi herself, my own view is that anyone who is that angry has deeper issues that need to be worked through with a professional, pronto. It looks like from the stats someone (iluvjeisa?) was kind enough to post that she was getting an annual cover from UK Vogue for many years, up until about 2002. What happened around 2002-2003 in or around the Vogue offices, Naomi? Either that, or they just decided she was no longer au courant. But that particular item does not look like a race issue to me. Modeling and professional sports are not known for their long shelf life ...