Fashion/sex/politics

[travolta]

i don't think galliano designs for this reasons. although his aesthetic is vastly different from most designers i like...his insanely brillant runway creations are not for women to buy. i think he has a pretty good take on the whole thing...fashion is absurd to a degree, i don't think it's a male/ female thing. i think it is like satire...i think his s/s 2005 collection was particuarly feel good and empowering.

 

[fireatwill]

Why do I pick the clothes I wear? It's certainly not to be objectified. I choose the clothes I choose because I want it to show outwardly what I am inwardly. I want it to be an extension of myself. I don't want it to be an awkward inconvenience. Fashion should be natural to a person, not forced.

I can't explain it any other way.

<3 Me.

 

[softgrey]

travolta...
sorry to say that galliano actually 'said' that this is the motivation behind his designs...it was this quote of his in another thread that was the motivation for helena to start this thread......

it seems galliano has a very narrow view of what women want...

 

[surfermegz]

I'm really happy someone started a thread like this. First of all John Galliano is simply a male pig, if you will, just acting like an ***. That is degrading to women and just perceives women as mens sex slaves and just a lustful object for the more significant male to conquer. Women are not conquered. It should not be that way. Although, we all know the women who do dress to make men want to do exactly what Galliano said.... ughhh.

It just makes me feel like women have pushed so hard for equal rights, and still are seen as sex object. FYI I am by no means some women- loveing male hating feminist!

I simply wear what I feel comfortable in from day to day, but sometimes I do want to get all dressed up, and of course, getting some looks isn't the worst thing in this world...

 

[ThisHollywoodLfe]

First I want to say that being a guy I can't really put relative input on the Galliano comment on designing clothes for woman to apeal to men. But a few months I used some YSL photos for posters and someone got mad at me saying that I shouldn't put people who are so glamourous on them becasue it turns people away from the show. However, I feel that fashion is sexy in its nature, Galliano went a bit too far in saying that he designs for that reason specifically, but the sexual undertones are everywhere in fashion. Another important factor is knowing what to wear and how wear it, just becasue you wear Galliano dosen't make you sexy.

 

[harivain]

I'm really happy someone started a thread like this. First of all John Galliano is simply a male pig, if you will, just acting like an ***. That is degrading to women and just perceives women as mens sex slaves and just a lustful object for the more significant male to conquer. Women are not conquered. It should not be that way. Although, we all know the women who do dress to make men want to do exactly what Galliano said.... ughhh.

It just makes me feel like women have pushed so hard for equal rights, and still are seen as sex object. FYI I am by no means some women- loveing male hating feminist!

I simply wear what I feel comfortable in from day to day, but sometimes I do want to get all dressed up, and of course, getting some looks isn't the worst thing in this world...

Okie Surfermegz let me ask you something...What do you see so degrading, to women, in Galliano's motivation to his designs???...It is just a drive, a sort of goal he wants 2 achieve when he designs all those fabulous creations...Just because of the fact that his muse is a little outrageous doesn't mean that is all he is...He only wants women to be able arouse men when the latter sees his creation on flesh...He is trying to epitomise the power of seduction in his own works of art...And besides, i don't see why people tend to see sex as such a taboo when it is one influential aspect of fashion...

Surfermegz, no offence, but don't you think you are being a chauvinist when you say that women are still struggling to achieve equal rights...Take r*pe as an example...I am sure that the bottom line is, only when you put yourself in danger that you are on the chopping block...Doesn't it mean that liberty for women is the power to be able to do things they like to do...And with that power comes great risks as well...Facing and coping with all that will just be part and parcel of being liberated...

Seriously,.. i am not being insensitive(for starters being gay solidifies the fact that i am not insensitive)...rather just judgemental...IT IS TRUE THAT FASHION IS NOT ALL ABOUT SEX...BUT SEX PLAYS A GREAT ROLE IN FASHION...

 

[cosmocat]

Surfermegz, no offence, but don't you think you are being a chauvinist when you say that women are still struggling to achieve equal rights...Take r*pe as an example...I am sure that the bottom line is, only when you put yourself in danger that you are on the chopping block...Doesn't it mean that liberty for women is the power to be able to do things they like to do...And with that power comes great risks as well...Facing and coping with all that will just be part and parcel of being liberated..

I really don't follow what you are saying. Are you saying that women are only raped if they are irresponsible? I only wish this was true as it would certainly lower the number of rapes. I feel very strongly that women still have not received equal rights. How can this be when women still feel worried walking the street at night? How can it be when the majority of childcare is still done by women? There is still such a long way to go to achieve equality.

 

[Johnny]

Surfermegz, no offence, but don't you think you are being a chauvinist when you say that women are still struggling to achieve equal rights...Take r*pe as an example...I am sure that the bottom line is, only when you put yourself in danger that you are on the chopping block...Doesn't it mean that liberty for women is the power to be able to do things they like to do...And with that power comes great risks as well...Facing and coping with all that will just be part and parcel of being liberated...

Seriously,.. i am not being insensitive(for starters being gay solidifies the fact that i am not insensitive)...rather just judgemental...IT IS TRUE THAT FASHION IS NOT ALL ABOUT SEX...BUT SEX PLAYS A GREAT ROLE IN FASHION...

My oh my. I'm not sure what's more absurd - for you to sugest that only women who put themselves in danger get raped or that you can't be insensitive if you're gay! The latter is simply amusing while the former is simply seriously offensive. Is that what you really think?

 

[surfermegz]

Harivain- First off, where are you going with the r*pe deal? I'm lost and in totally accord with what cosmocat said. It's not men who are worried about walking home alone at night is it? If you even were implying that women put themselves in the situation to be raped... umm... I don't want to have to go there.

Secondly, I never said his work is not amazing. Never. I merely stated that I did not agree with his choice of wording and it was giving women off to be weak and sex symbols and that is all. Just because a woman wants to dress sexy, doesn't mean a man has to think she will want him to f*** her.

What is your point about being gay... whats that have to do with being or not being insensitive??

 

[Vlad]

I am sure that the bottom line is, only when you put yourself in danger that you are on the chopping block...

Pardon me, what did you just say? Are you implying that women provoke to be raped? You honestly must be kidding or perhaps you're just a complete idiot losing a sense for reality.

 

[softgrey]

oh dear...
let's keep it cool everyone...
please do not resort to name-calling...and eyerolling...
we can disagree in a civilized manner...

regarding harivain's post-
i will not quote it as i don't think we have to keep re-reading such offensive tripe...
i think johnny put it best...
being gay does not preclude one from being insensitive...that doesn't even make sense...but being a man in general might make it more difficult to understand what women go through...

the idea that someone could think that 'women are asking for it'...it such an old and outdated way of thinking...and just proves that women have not acheived equal status...if a child is raped...does anyone assume that it was their own fault for being so damn cute?!?!...or for getting in the car with the stranger??...absurd right?!?!....so harivain actually proved for himself just how flawed and incorrect his statement is...

the fact that we could even be having this discussion is exactly why statements like the one made by john galliano are so dangerous...after all these decades and all the accomplishments that women have achieved...men still want to reduce them to 'sex objects' and nothing more...being sexy is fantastic...sure...why not?!?...but it is such a small part of who we are...

**anyway...there's another insensitive gay guy for ya right there!!...boo galliano!!!...

 

[surfermegz]

oh dear...
let's keep it cool everyone...
please do not resort to name-calling...and eyerolling...
we can disagree in a civilized manner...

regarding harivain's post-
i will not quote it as i don't think we have to keep re-reading such offensive tripe...
i think johnny put it best...
being gay does not preclude one from being insensitive...that doesn't even make sense...but being a man in general might make it more difficult to understand what women go through...

the idea that someone could think that 'women are asking for it'...it such an old and outdated way of thinking...and just proves that women have not acheived equal status...if a child is raped...does anyone assume that it was their own fault for being so damn cute?!?!...or for getting in the car with the stranger??...absurd right?!?!....so harivain actually proved for himself just how flawed and incorrect his statement is...

the fact that we could even be having this discussion is exactly why statements like the one made by john galliano are so dangerous...after all these decades and all the accomplishments that women have achieved...men still want to reduce them to 'sex objects' and nothing more...being sexy is fantastic...sure...why not?!?...but it is such a small part of who we are...

**anyway...there's another insensitive gay guy for ya right there!!...boo galliano!!!...

Agreed. I was keeping cool... but a bit annoyed.... but im good now!

 

[softgrey]

way to go surfermegz...

 

[Ella]

I can't believe what I'm reading, people can't seriously think that way. Do you think that someone actually wants to get raped? Actually I'm not even mad but just laughing at what you said because it's so backward and just ridiculous! None of my guy friends are like that at all, maybe here in Finland it's different. The only reason men want to see women as sex objects is so they won't be intimidated by them. That's why they pay for women if they go to the movies or for dinner- so they can feel like the providers.
But the bottom line is that I think women have the right to be sexy and dress sexy if they want to. I think there are lots of other designers who feels the same way as Galliano, just Galliano phrased it in such a way which alerted people. Other designers would just say that they design for women who want to look sexy or use some other euphemism so that it wouldn't sound as harsh... Take Dsquared for example- what do their fashion shows say about how they feel about women...

 

[Vlad]

please do not resort to name-calling...and eyerolling...

It's quite challenging to stay civilized after the preceeding statement about r*pe. I'll try harder next time

 

[PrinceOfCats]

Whoah, I missed this party

Interestingly, it's estimated that almost as many male rapes might in prison as women are raped outside of prison. Either we live in a culture which thinks a man can't be raped or we live in one which thinks that prisoners deserve it. Peculiar.

Take Dsquared for example- what do their fashion shows say about how they feel about women...

I haven't studied Dsquared but the impression that I get from past Gucci collections is that Tom Ford is petrified of breasts.

 

[softgrey]

thanks vlad...

good points ellah...there are definitely a certain 'group' of designers who share this attitude towards women...galliano is certainly not the only one...tom ford was also like this...thankfully...we got rid of him...!!...

it does seem like some designers have begun to move away from this...
ie-alber elbaz for lanvin or consuelo castiglioni for marni and phoebe philo for chloe...
and judging by their popularity....it seems like there are many women who are tired of being squeezed into sexy little tube dresses ...haha!!...

because that's the real power...if women don't buy those types of clothes...the demand goes down...and things begin to change...
witness alexander mcqueen...and how his designs have loosened up in order to sell more...

the days of 'drag queen style' are over...!!...
there's definitley a trend towards a more natural and subtle sexuality happening on the streets...

 

[travolta]

sex being shoved in our faces will come around again in a new form...and it won't seem as literal as what happened in the 90s. i don't know..maybe we'll be walking around in transparent mumus?? you can look but you can't touch all the while being ulta comfortable...kinda like haltson without the glimmering pant suits. fashion will still be selling sex...just not as obviously

 

[fireatwill]

I agreed with haregaiv [?] on how Galliano may not be a pig, his muse may be just different. Everyone has a certain motivation, and his is clearly different from most peoples view on this board. He isn't designing collectsion made out of pieces of string and genital parts hanging out. Perhaps he just didn't explain his idea clearly enough. I find his clothes beautiful and sexual at the same time.

IF you think about it, maybe he's just helping women who don't know how to flaunt their sexual side through his clothing.

But I did find the r*pe thing insensitive. A guy friend once told me that girls are raped because they provoked someone to do so. I was furious. A woman should be allowed to dress as she pleases without men harassing her. We didn't walk 2 steps forward only to be pushed 5 steps back to dress conservatively only so we won't get raped. We should be allowed to dress as we please and still be respected.

<3 Me.

 

[harivain]

First of all let me apologise if 'MY' point of view offended anyone...
Second of all sorry to say that i DON'T AT ALL agree with the notion that women get raped because they ALLOW themselves to be...(did not expect to be ridiculed when i expressed my thoughts). Maybe i should have rephrased my sentences...
Now, what I felt was that the number of r*pe nowadays seem to be increasing because women are more free know and mostly the unnsuspecting, naive ones who apparently do not know how to use this liberty properly are those who are usually pinned down...And yes, maybe women have not yet reached full equal rights from men as yet...So insensitive of me to say that they already have (oh yea gays are not necessarily sensitive...but I was-at least that was what I thought.)
Yes, also, i am not a woman and never will be one, so i don't know how it is like being one...
Thank you all for your timely critism...