Petite and Plus Sized Models
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I will put my two cents in...
I think clothes don't look worse in petite women, just totally different. I have a friend who is the same size as me, but like 5 inches shorter, so she seems much more curvier and clothes on her look sexier. This is great when it comes to appeal men... but for me it seems that designers want non-sexualized models, and for a petite woman to look like this she has to have extreme small measurements. That may be the reason of petite women doing mostly 'sexy' modelling, like FHM or the like. I hope i have explained my mind right...
I think clothes don't look worse in petite women, just totally different. I have a friend who is the same size as me, but like 5 inches shorter, so she seems much more curvier and clothes on her look sexier. This is great when it comes to appeal men... but for me it seems that designers want non-sexualized models, and for a petite woman to look like this she has to have extreme small measurements. That may be the reason of petite women doing mostly 'sexy' modelling, like FHM or the like. I hope i have explained my mind right...
writergal28
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I will put my two cents in...
I think clothes don't look worse in petite women, just totally different. I have a friend who is the same size as me, but like 5 inches shorter, so she seems much more curvier and clothes on her look sexier. This is great when it comes to appeal men... but for me it seems that designers want non-sexualized models, and for a petite woman to look like this she has to have extreme small measurements. That may be the reason of petite women doing mostly 'sexy' modelling, like FHM or the like. I hope i have explained my mind right...
And do you think this is why designers who specialize in petites have difficulty getting media attention? Obviously, petite designers won't want to use 5'10" models if their pants aren't going to be longer than 31" (unless they want to give of a capri effect when they weren't supposed to).
Not sure about that, I don't even know if there are petite brands or designers in my country (Spain), at least I've never heard of them. It is assumed that clothes are made for tall people, so people just buy the clothes that fit in hips and waist... and then adjust the length of the trousers or whatever by sewing them at home lol
writergal28
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That's the problem. A lot of designers want to be edgy, but they do that with their designs and not their sizes (length-wise, anyway). The problem with length is that they don't always fit right, even if they're shortened. Many petite designers have explained that on their website. I think petite denim designer, Allison Izu explains it quite well.
Also, what about tops?
I wish the fashion industry (or at least MAINSTREAM PEOPLE in the fashion industry) isn't so quick to dismiss petites.
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I agree... IMO petite models should have a place in the fashion industry, as well as plus size models do. The problem is that if there are no designers or brands of petite clothing, how on hell will petite models work? (I'm talking about my country all the time, I suposse it's quite different in countries with a well-stablished petite market). And the thing is that there is a good target for petite clothing, specially among Spanish because we are shorter than our European fellows... but, strangely enough, nobody has heard of such a thing and we live happily re-sewing our clothes after buying them 
Joelle-Squared
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^^ Ohh, Diane Hernandez. She was on a cycle of America's Next Top Model. Unlike Whitney Thompson, this chick can actually model.
lilydicker
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zippora seven is a petite model. when she started she was 163 cm. i suppose she has grown a little. The agencys now list her as 170 cm but she is defenatly shorter than that! would guess she is 165 maximum.
TREVOFASHIONISTO
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i noticed how small she was on the Dsquared2 FW 08 runway
yea she is petite compared to others
yea she is petite compared to others
3RingCircus
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This is from a blog entry I wrote on a modeling forum, not specifically about petites but it might explain some things for you:
***
The minimum height requirement for female models of any dress size is generally 5’8”. There’s no point in trying to do a comparison between plus and regular modeling because they follow the same rules. Obviously there are women who have the rules bent for them for one reason or another, and these women are exceptional enough in their looks that they warrant it. In high fashion, models who are under 5’8” are a rarity. The Association of Model Agents (AMA) says that female models should be around 34-24-34 inches (86-61-86 cm) and at least five feet eight inches (1.72 m) tall and 108 pounds on average. Currently, the height required to do fashion shows has increased. During the last fashion shows in Europe, the average height was 1.79 m (5' 10"), the average weight was 50 kg (110 lb), with bust between 85 to 90 cm (33.5 to 35.4 inches), waist under 62 cm (24.4 inches), and hips under 90 cm (35.4 inches), to fit the 34/36 size of Haute Couture samples.*
The best known (because it is so scarce) examples of high fashion models** under 5’8” are Twiggy, Kate Moss and Devon Aoki, who are all 5’6”. Of the major faces from the 80s through to right now, the majority are 5’8” or taller. This is the principle reason why models look so thin – they have similar bust-waist-hip measurements in combination with long limbs, and it lends a giraffe-like ganglyness to their bodies. It is also why even the slightest weight loss becomes immediately visible.
Adriana Lima ~ 5’10”
Agnyss Dean ~ 5’9”
Amber Valletta ~ 5’9”
Carmen Kass ~ 5’10”
Carolyn Murphy ~ 5’8”
Christie Brinkley ~ 5’9”
Christy Turlington ~ 5’10”
Cindy Crawford ~ 5’9.5”
Claudia Schiffer ~ 5’11”
Coco Rocha ~ 5’10”
Doutzen Kroes ~ 5’10”
Elle MacPherson ~ 6’
Gemma Ward ~ 5’9.5”
Gia Carangi ~ 5’7”
Giselle Bündchen ~ 5’10.5”
Heather Marks ~ 5’10”
Heidi Klum ~ 5’9”
Iman ~ 5’8.5”
Karen Elson ~ 5’10”
Karolina Kurkova ~ 5’11”
Lily Cole ~ 5’10"
Linda Evangelista ~ 5'’9.5”
Nadia Auermann ~ 5’10.5”
Naomi Campbell ~ 5’9.5”
Natalia Vodianova ~ 5’9”
Natasha Poly ~ 5’10”
Omahyra Mota ~ 5’9”
Shalom Harlow ~ 5’11”
Stephanie Seymour ~ 5’10”
Tyra Banks ~ 5’10”
At the other end of the scales, models who are a size 12 and 5’8” look curvy rather than ‘fat’, but they still possess those little rolls which for the most part are usually airbrushed out. But make no mistake, they are not models only because they happen to be the right size. They are models because they have the whole model package: face, height, a good shape and talent.
Models, by their very job definition, are creatures of fantasy. Models are not meant to look like ‘everywoman’. They present ideals of lifestyle and attitude, and images often show them in circumstances that are obviously completely contrived and unnatural. They are not commonplace, ordinary, or generic. This is why getting repped by a major player agency is really a big deal, and why so many people want to be a model. Because if anyone could be a model, what would be the point of that? If models were to become more ordinary or average-looking through representing more variety of the actual bodies of the population, then they would lose their specialness or cache, and frankly it would be impossible to sell a Dior handbag or a $500 pair of pants on a model that looks like 50 women you saw at the mall on the weekend! Fantasy is the model’s realm – and the modeling industry does not exist and has never existed to ensure that all groups of the female population feel adequately represented in this framework.
Crystal Renn is an ideal example of what it takes to be a plus size model these days, and the bar has been set higher since she appeared on the scene. Many people would be surprised to learn she is 5’9” and a US size 10-12, because she is so curvy and round-looking that she could pass for shorter or bigger, depending on what she is wearing. This is a major part of her appeal. Clients can make her look thinner or rounder by changing the proportions of her clothing, and her height aids this ability. However, it is very difficult to make a 5’6” model look taller or thinner at the same dress size, because the length of the limbs shortens overall proportions and hampers various camera perspectives, as well as wardrobe possibilities in the first place. Any models that are under 5’8” either have clothing made specifically for them or altered to fit properly, or are very limited in who they can work for. The shift in body proportions over those 2 little inches in height difference is dramatic through the camera lens.
But I hear that petite models do find work....?
Maybe in fit work for designers, but not in photography. When there are only a few companies spending consistent and real money on advertising fashions in petite sizing then agencies have no need to hire models that are shorter than the norm. Where there is no demand, there is no supply - especially when there is no money to be made. If a woman happens to have some kind of other status that makes them desirable to represent, i.e. they are the children of famous people, or are famous for other pursuits, such as acting – then they may be the exception to the 5’8” rule. But there is simply no need for agencies to stretch their boundaries and cater those consumers who want to see smaller women because there is no work and therefore no money in it for them to do so. That doesn't mean that you can't work for certain companies that use petite models because they choose to - it just means that you won't be repped by an agency, with the possibility of a career like the taller girls.
What happens if I'm REALLY tall?
For those women who are over 6' tall, unfortunately opportunities for you are limited too. As you have longer arms and legs than the usual cut of samples (fit models are generally around 5'8" height), you could only reasonably expect to do lingerie, swimwear and summer clothing (tank tops, tshirts, shorts, skirts) because the length isn't a major issue there. But what's your shoe size? Chances are it's 11/42 or higher, and clients often do not want to go to the trouble of finding shoes for you to wear on their shoots - especially when it HAS to be their own product and they don't make it in your size, and they really don't want to have to cut the backs of the shoes out if they bought them at a store and want to return after they have done shooting. Either the model has to have the inclincation and money to buy tons of shoes every season, or she doesn't work. That's how it goes for a lot of size 11 shoe wearers as it is - if a client has to narrow a selection of similar-looking models, they will do it using simple criteria such as shoe size.
It has been hard enough to have plus-size models viewed favourably by the fashion industry in general, even when they meet height requirements, and the battle there is still ongoing. Witness the resistance to using larger than size 0 models that continues despite government ‘bans’ and mandated health requirements - plus-size models have a long road ahead still. Trying to add more diverse body shapes to an industry that hasn’t traditionally accepted them, via a division they would prefer didn’t exist in the first place, is just bashing your head on a brick wall.
I’m just the messenger here - you can try to buck for change all you want but ultimately I think anyone under 5’8” without that whole model package is on a fool’s errand to believe they will be the one to overturn a whole industry’s attitude to height. You can have all the sass and confidence you want, but you need to have the face and all the rest of it to make them even look at you in the first place.
* Wikipedia, Fashion Model
** stats sourced from Wikipedia and FashionModelDirectory.com listings.
Anyone wanting to see what plus-size models are doing in the realm of high fashion should check out runwayrevolution.com - I think you'll be very surprised and how many images you've seen and not even realized the model was over a size 10.
***
The minimum height requirement for female models of any dress size is generally 5’8”. There’s no point in trying to do a comparison between plus and regular modeling because they follow the same rules. Obviously there are women who have the rules bent for them for one reason or another, and these women are exceptional enough in their looks that they warrant it. In high fashion, models who are under 5’8” are a rarity. The Association of Model Agents (AMA) says that female models should be around 34-24-34 inches (86-61-86 cm) and at least five feet eight inches (1.72 m) tall and 108 pounds on average. Currently, the height required to do fashion shows has increased. During the last fashion shows in Europe, the average height was 1.79 m (5' 10"), the average weight was 50 kg (110 lb), with bust between 85 to 90 cm (33.5 to 35.4 inches), waist under 62 cm (24.4 inches), and hips under 90 cm (35.4 inches), to fit the 34/36 size of Haute Couture samples.*
The best known (because it is so scarce) examples of high fashion models** under 5’8” are Twiggy, Kate Moss and Devon Aoki, who are all 5’6”. Of the major faces from the 80s through to right now, the majority are 5’8” or taller. This is the principle reason why models look so thin – they have similar bust-waist-hip measurements in combination with long limbs, and it lends a giraffe-like ganglyness to their bodies. It is also why even the slightest weight loss becomes immediately visible.
Adriana Lima ~ 5’10”
Agnyss Dean ~ 5’9”
Amber Valletta ~ 5’9”
Carmen Kass ~ 5’10”
Carolyn Murphy ~ 5’8”
Christie Brinkley ~ 5’9”
Christy Turlington ~ 5’10”
Cindy Crawford ~ 5’9.5”
Claudia Schiffer ~ 5’11”
Coco Rocha ~ 5’10”
Doutzen Kroes ~ 5’10”
Elle MacPherson ~ 6’
Gemma Ward ~ 5’9.5”
Gia Carangi ~ 5’7”
Giselle Bündchen ~ 5’10.5”
Heather Marks ~ 5’10”
Heidi Klum ~ 5’9”
Iman ~ 5’8.5”
Karen Elson ~ 5’10”
Karolina Kurkova ~ 5’11”
Lily Cole ~ 5’10"
Linda Evangelista ~ 5'’9.5”
Nadia Auermann ~ 5’10.5”
Naomi Campbell ~ 5’9.5”
Natalia Vodianova ~ 5’9”
Natasha Poly ~ 5’10”
Omahyra Mota ~ 5’9”
Shalom Harlow ~ 5’11”
Stephanie Seymour ~ 5’10”
Tyra Banks ~ 5’10”
At the other end of the scales, models who are a size 12 and 5’8” look curvy rather than ‘fat’, but they still possess those little rolls which for the most part are usually airbrushed out. But make no mistake, they are not models only because they happen to be the right size. They are models because they have the whole model package: face, height, a good shape and talent.
Models, by their very job definition, are creatures of fantasy. Models are not meant to look like ‘everywoman’. They present ideals of lifestyle and attitude, and images often show them in circumstances that are obviously completely contrived and unnatural. They are not commonplace, ordinary, or generic. This is why getting repped by a major player agency is really a big deal, and why so many people want to be a model. Because if anyone could be a model, what would be the point of that? If models were to become more ordinary or average-looking through representing more variety of the actual bodies of the population, then they would lose their specialness or cache, and frankly it would be impossible to sell a Dior handbag or a $500 pair of pants on a model that looks like 50 women you saw at the mall on the weekend! Fantasy is the model’s realm – and the modeling industry does not exist and has never existed to ensure that all groups of the female population feel adequately represented in this framework.
Crystal Renn is an ideal example of what it takes to be a plus size model these days, and the bar has been set higher since she appeared on the scene. Many people would be surprised to learn she is 5’9” and a US size 10-12, because she is so curvy and round-looking that she could pass for shorter or bigger, depending on what she is wearing. This is a major part of her appeal. Clients can make her look thinner or rounder by changing the proportions of her clothing, and her height aids this ability. However, it is very difficult to make a 5’6” model look taller or thinner at the same dress size, because the length of the limbs shortens overall proportions and hampers various camera perspectives, as well as wardrobe possibilities in the first place. Any models that are under 5’8” either have clothing made specifically for them or altered to fit properly, or are very limited in who they can work for. The shift in body proportions over those 2 little inches in height difference is dramatic through the camera lens.
But I hear that petite models do find work....?
Maybe in fit work for designers, but not in photography. When there are only a few companies spending consistent and real money on advertising fashions in petite sizing then agencies have no need to hire models that are shorter than the norm. Where there is no demand, there is no supply - especially when there is no money to be made. If a woman happens to have some kind of other status that makes them desirable to represent, i.e. they are the children of famous people, or are famous for other pursuits, such as acting – then they may be the exception to the 5’8” rule. But there is simply no need for agencies to stretch their boundaries and cater those consumers who want to see smaller women because there is no work and therefore no money in it for them to do so. That doesn't mean that you can't work for certain companies that use petite models because they choose to - it just means that you won't be repped by an agency, with the possibility of a career like the taller girls.
What happens if I'm REALLY tall?
For those women who are over 6' tall, unfortunately opportunities for you are limited too. As you have longer arms and legs than the usual cut of samples (fit models are generally around 5'8" height), you could only reasonably expect to do lingerie, swimwear and summer clothing (tank tops, tshirts, shorts, skirts) because the length isn't a major issue there. But what's your shoe size? Chances are it's 11/42 or higher, and clients often do not want to go to the trouble of finding shoes for you to wear on their shoots - especially when it HAS to be their own product and they don't make it in your size, and they really don't want to have to cut the backs of the shoes out if they bought them at a store and want to return after they have done shooting. Either the model has to have the inclincation and money to buy tons of shoes every season, or she doesn't work. That's how it goes for a lot of size 11 shoe wearers as it is - if a client has to narrow a selection of similar-looking models, they will do it using simple criteria such as shoe size.
It has been hard enough to have plus-size models viewed favourably by the fashion industry in general, even when they meet height requirements, and the battle there is still ongoing. Witness the resistance to using larger than size 0 models that continues despite government ‘bans’ and mandated health requirements - plus-size models have a long road ahead still. Trying to add more diverse body shapes to an industry that hasn’t traditionally accepted them, via a division they would prefer didn’t exist in the first place, is just bashing your head on a brick wall.
I’m just the messenger here - you can try to buck for change all you want but ultimately I think anyone under 5’8” without that whole model package is on a fool’s errand to believe they will be the one to overturn a whole industry’s attitude to height. You can have all the sass and confidence you want, but you need to have the face and all the rest of it to make them even look at you in the first place.
* Wikipedia, Fashion Model
** stats sourced from Wikipedia and FashionModelDirectory.com listings.
Anyone wanting to see what plus-size models are doing in the realm of high fashion should check out runwayrevolution.com - I think you'll be very surprised and how many images you've seen and not even realized the model was over a size 10.
writergal28
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But what if a petite-focused designer becomes big? It's very unlikely that this designer will want anyone over 5'6" for the line. Likely, it'll be 5'3" for fit and 5'5"-5'6" for runway. What do people think of that?
I've asked this question before, but I really don't think anyone has even considered this SERIOUS. Sad, I think.
I've asked this question before, but I really don't think anyone has even considered this SERIOUS. Sad, I think.
3RingCircus
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is there a list of plus sized models? i realized i don't know more than two plus sized models.
This is an international listing of past & present career plus-size models; however the names relate only to whether there are images of the models or not on the website. But it is growing in number, so check back from time to time.
Mind you, it only starts at a size 10 so images of say, Carre Otis, will only show her above a 10, same with Crystal Renn.
If you can't be bothered clicking, I'd say that the major girls who are working at least 20 out of 30 days per month are (no particular order)
Crystal Renn
Kate Dillon
Amy Lemons
Candice Huffine
Abby Valdes
Danielle Redman
Inga Eiriksdottir
Krissy Woodard
Robyn Lawley
Louise MacCallum
Tonya Pittman
Laura Catterall
Camilla Hansen
Danielle von Grondelle
Johanna Dray
---and many more
