The Film Lovers Thread!

[xtine888]

i saw a couple movies recently that i feel the need to rant/discuss a little bit...

first, house of flying daggers - in house of flying daggers it just felt like i was unaware of the plot and didn't know whose side i was supposed to be on.. even at the end the whole thing felt somewhat unresolved for me and i felt that i didn't know what there was to resolve because there was no real plot for me...
the fight scenes are beautiful to watch so it wasn't a waste of time..

^ I'm with you two on "House of Flying Daggers." It's probably the most pretentious movie I've ever seen and a good example of style over substance. It was like a cheesy impersonation of an art film! The twists and turns got more and more outrageous by the minute.

Poor Andy Lau, who I think can be a very convincing and terrific actor given the strength of the script and director, really got the short stick for this role. His character is lifeless and not written well, and he gets reduced to a laughingstock. (It is a shame that most western audiences were introduced to Lau in this movie. He's done much better movies; I'd recommend "Running Out of Time", "Infernal Affairs", and "Needing You.")

And the ending was the most ridiculous thing ever --- I even started to laugh. The way Zhang Ziyi just pops up from the grass in the middle of the boys screaming, fighting, and trying to kill each other is so wtf.

No one comes close to Zhang Yimou in terms of movie cinematography (amaaaazing here), but cinematography can't make a movie. Not having a plot or fleshed-out characters will break one.

 

[ChrissyM]

^Agreed.. that fight scene at the end was ridiculous.. I just kept thinking "how are they not dead yet" even though clearly i had already suspended my hold on reality by watching the theatrics of the fight scene in the first place

the other thing i just remembered was how incredibly AWKWARD the "love scenes" were
looked like 2 groping adolescents, or pre-schoolers imitating what they thought adults did in private... it just looked like they could use some kissing lessons or something
so not sexy

do you guys think they film those scenes so awkwardly on purpose?
i took an asian cinema course in college last year and i think a fellow student was thinking of writing about love scenes in asian movies and how they seem to be so universally awkward/unsexy.. maybe it's a cultural thing? not sure how to explain what i mean by that but i know that censorship played a big role in the past...

 

[Lauren-W]

Glad I discovered this thread as I love movies. Has anybody seen the French film Hidden? Could someone please explain the ending for me? I was attentively watching up untill the man's throat gets slit (sorry if I'm ruining anything) which totally threw me and I was baffled as to an ending. I ended up coming to a sort of conclusion but I'm positive it's not right.

 

[Kawari]

Nope sorry, Lauren-W I haven't seen it, though my foriegn film list is quite short.
House of Flying Daggers is one of those movies you either hate when you first see it, then grow to like or vice versa. I knew the plot itself was quite simple, and some things were quite out of there, but I thought that was the appeal. What I didn't like was the lack of depth the characters seemed to have. Sure, there was love but the minor, even major, characters left much to be desired. I loved the cinematography and clothes though, and I enjoyed the "art" of fighting, it reminded me of dancing, of the film even though the fights did seem unrealistic.
I was quite surprised to hear though, that the snow falling down in the fight scene at the end was actually quite natural and unplanned.

 

[visconti]

Glad I discovered this thread as I love movies. Has anybody seen the French film Hidden? Could someone please explain the ending for me? I was attentively watching up untill the man's throat gets slit (sorry if I'm ruining anything) which totally threw me and I was baffled as to an ending. I ended up coming to a sort of conclusion but I'm positive it's not right.

There's a discussion of the ending here-
http://leftbehinds.blogspot.com/2005/12/update-cachs-meaning.html

I was puzzled by the ending as well and I think this helps. Obviously anyone who hasn't seen the movie SHOULD NOT CLICK.

 

[xtine888]

the other thing i just remembered was how incredibly AWKWARD the "love scenes" were
looked like 2 groping adolescents, or pre-schoolers imitating what they thought adults did in private... it just looked like they could use some kissing lessons or something
so not sexy

do you guys think they film those scenes so awkwardly on purpose?
i took an asian cinema course in college last year and i think a fellow student was thinking of writing about love scenes in asian movies and how they seem to be so universally awkward/unsexy.. maybe it's a cultural thing? not sure how to explain what i mean by that but i know that censorship played a big role in the past...

LOL, I know what you mean! Verrrry awkward love scenes....I think you're right that it is a cultural thing and a possible issue with censorship. China is very big on censorship (which is why since 1997, a lot of HK films are getting a lot tamer). I last visited HK in 2001, but I seem to remember that love scenes were apparently a lot more controversial and frowned upon than really violent scenes.

 

[cutxpaste]

[*]Hate/Haine, la/France/Kassovitz/1995: Another great film about racism, this one has a B&W documentary feel and some natural acting that makes it a pleasure to watch

I saw this recently at school as part of a course on films about moral issues. It was intense to say the least

 

[bleuFunk]

Does anyone here use Netflix? I'm thinking of signing up for it and am curious what the consensus is.

 

[Fuuma]

Glad I discovered this thread as I love movies. Has anybody seen the French film Hidden? Could someone please explain the ending for me? I was attentively watching up untill the man's throat gets slit (sorry if I'm ruining anything) which totally threw me and I was baffled as to an ending. I ended up coming to a sort of conclusion but I'm positive it's not right.

A few thoughts about the movie (highlight to read as they contain spoilers)

· The most satisfying explanation is that nobody is sending the tapes; the whole movie is a metaphor for French colonialism so nothing should be taken in a literal sense. The tapes represent the invisible and forgotten undercurrent of guilt, the hidden shame inherent to post colonialism boiling to the surface. As Kundera had one of his characters say: “Yes, suddenly I saw it all clearly: most people willingly deceive themselves with a doubly false faith; they believe in eternal memory (of men, things, deeds, peoples) and in rectification (of deeds, errors, sins, injustice). Both are sham. The truth lies at the opposite end of the scale: everything will be forgotten and nothing will be rectified. All rectification (both vengeance and forgiveness) will be taken over by oblivion. No one will rectify wrongs; all wrongs will be forgotten.”
· At the end, what you see is the main protagonist’s son going away with the orphan’s own child. This can be interpreted in many ways, from a malicious conspiracy to a chance encounter; I prefer to see it as hope that the younger generations will not sweep the past under a rug and are willing to embrace alterity as a positive force for change. Interestingly enough I seem to remember (it’s been awhile) that the last shot is set up in the same, neutral, observant manner as those of the main protagonist’s house, even though he’s clearly the observer in that scene.

 

[visconti]

bleuFunk- I've been a netflix member since around 2002 and have been, for the most part, satisfied. The ease of getting and returning the movies depends in part on how close you are to a distribution center. I assume there's one in Detroit. That should be OK. I live ~40 minutes from Cleveland and can usually count on getting the movies that ship today tomorrow. The same goes for returns. If I put something in the mail today, they should get it tomorrow and I should have a new movie on Wednesday.

I'm satisfied with their selection because they get most of the week's new releases out right away. Sometimes they won't stock new editions of movies they already carried (like the recent Sanjuro/Yojimbo re-issues). There are also a few movies I want to see (and I know are out) that never get stocked. Satantango is an example of this. If you're just interested in relatively mainstream movies, this'll never be a problem, but I have found that they're sometimes slow to make big Hollywood hits available to me. I don't know if this is because they track my rentals and figure I won't mind waiting a few weeks to see stuff like Flags of Our Fathers as long as they send me the new Kino stuff.

As far as lost or damaged discs, I rarely have a problem. I've had a few arrive cracked (maybe 1 every 6-9 months with the 7 at a time plan), but they never complain or try to blame me.

If you have other concerns I can try to address them, but it's definitely worth taking a look at. They have a lot of things that you probably can't just get randomly at the local stores. I've never used Blockbuster's rental progam. I had a few friends who claimed they prefered it because they could get a few in-store rentals for free when the mail was slow, but I'm uncertain of their overall selection.



in re: La Haine- It's finally coming out on US DVD in April. I've been waiting to see it for a while, but never felt like buying an EU disc or looking for a VHS. Hopefully this'll give others the option to see it as well.

Also, it may excite someone to hear that Fassbinder's Berlin Alexanderplatz is FINALLY coming out in remastered form later this year. I guess there's a Deutsch set already due, but there'll be a US release shortly. Maybe May or June. Now I can see it in a form that has readable subtitles...

 

[Fuuma]

I'm satisfied with their selection because they get most of the week's new releases out right away. Sometimes they won't stock new editions of movies they already carried (like the recent Sanjuro/Yojimbo re-issues). There are also a few movies I want to see (and I know are out) that never get stocked. Satantango is an example of this. If you're just interested in relatively mainstream movies, this'll never be a problem, but I have found that they're sometimes slow to make big Hollywood hits available to me. I don't know if this is because they track my rentals and figure I won't mind waiting a few weeks to see stuff like Flags of Our Fathers as long as they send me the new Kino stuff.

Part of the strategy of online rental services like Netflix is to stock a lower amount of recent/popular titles (which have a lower profit margin because of the acquisition costs) to encourage you to explore the less popular/recent titles (read less expensive to acquire).

in re: La Haine- It's finally coming out on US DVD in April. I've been waiting to see it for a while, but never felt like buying an EU disc or looking for a VHS. Hopefully this'll give others the option to see it as well.

Who’s releasing La Haine? Interestingly enough my DVD (French) has English subtitles. The movie is so full of slang I can image how translating it would be a daunting task, on the level of trying to convey Cockney rhyming in another language.

Also, it may excite someone to hear that Fassbinder's Berlin Alexanderplatz is FINALLY coming out in remastered form later this year. I guess there's a Deutsch set already due, but there'll be a US release shortly. Maybe May or June. Now I can see it in a form that has readable subtitles...

Yay!</SPAN>

 

[visconti]

^

Thanks for the information of their buying strategies. It makes sense- especially since the demand for a brand new release is sure to drop off within a few weeks or months of release.

Fortunately La Haine is a Criterion release (as is Alexanderplatz)! It was restored in HD by a company called Bavaria Film. You can see a trailer with a hideous voice-over here. If you've never seen it, I'd skip the trailer because there are some spoiler shots. It looks like it'll be at least up the quality of all of those DVDs that the Fassbinder Foundation put out a few years back.

Here are the features for La Haine. It looks like they got someone to give the translation another go.

SPECIAL EDITION DOUBLE-DISC SET FEATURES:

New, restored high-definition digital transfer, supervised by director Mathieu Kassovitz

New English-language audio commentary by Kassovitz

Video introduction by Jodie Foster

Optional Dolby Digital 5.1 track

Ten Years of "La haine," a new documentary that brings together key cast and crew a decade after the film’s landmark release

New video featurette on the film’s banlieue setting, including interviews with sociologists Sophie Body-Gendrot, Jeffrey Fagan, and William Kornblum

Behind-the-scenes footage shot during the film’s production

Deleted and extended scenes, each featuring a new video afterword by Kassovitz

Stills gallery of behind-the-scenes photos

Theatrical trailers

New and improved English subtitle translation

PLUS: A new essay by film scholar Ginette Vincendeau and an appreciation by acclaimed filmmaker Costa-Gavras

 

[Lauren-W]

A few thoughts about the movie (highlight to read as they contain spoilers)

· The most satisfying explanation is that nobody is sending the tapes; the whole movie is a metaphor for French colonialism so nothing should be taken in a literal sense. The tapes represent the invisible and forgotten undercurrent of guilt, the hidden shame inherent to post colonialism boiling to the surface. As Kundera had one of his characters say: “Yes, suddenly I saw it all clearly: most people willingly deceive themselves with a doubly false faith; they believe in eternal memory (of men, things, deeds, peoples) and in rectification (of deeds, errors, sins, injustice). Both are sham. The truth lies at the opposite end of the scale: everything will be forgotten and nothing will be rectified. All rectification (both vengeance and forgiveness) will be taken over by oblivion. No one will rectify wrongs; all wrongs will be forgotten.”
· At the end, what you see is the main protagonist’s son going away with the orphan’s own child. This can be interpreted in many ways, from a malicious conspiracy to a chance encounter; I prefer to see it as hope that the younger generations will not sweep the past under a rug and are willing to embrace alterity as a positive force for change. Interestingly enough I seem to remember (it’s been awhile) that the last shot is set up in the same, neutral, observant manner as those of the main protagonist’s house, even though he’s clearly the observer in that scene.

Hmm I'm understanding a bit better now. I think I might buy the DVD so I can watch it over and over to get a better sense of the film and pick up on clues myself. Thanks

 

[DP_woman]

There are two french films Im going to see this weekend, they are touting as two of the "best films ever made". One is Two or Three Things I Know About Her and the other is Rules Of The Game. Very Excited!!!!

 

[ChrissyM]

thanks for the info on la haine... i've seen it 3 or 4 times already but it seems like it would be worth checking out for the extra features and improved translation...

especially considering last year's media coverage of troubles in France with the racial minorities etc... seems very relevant--i rewatched this film around that time...

 

[TheKiwi]

I'm really sick, and want to curl up in my bed today with hot tea and watch some films! Could someone please recommend me some good ones? I love classic and foreign films especially. But I don't want them to be too dark or violent or anything. I'm looking for some pick-me-ups! Thanks!

 

[bleuFunk]

Watch "Roman Holiday" if you haven't seen it! I saw that for the first time a couple weeks ago and loved it.

 

[Whitelinen]

Has anyone here seen David Lynch's new film, Inland Empire? What is it like? I'm a huge fan of Lynch's work, what do you think of his films? Pretentious or beautiful? Favourites?

 

[visconti]

I saw Inland Empire a few weeks ago. Although I'm very sketchy on the narrative/over all structure, I enjoyed it quite a bit. I think he did a great job of carrying forward with some of the themes/motifs from his earlier films and creating one of his most consistently atmospheric and involving films. If you haven't seen it, it warrants comparision with Mullholland Dr., Lost Highway and his other "hard" films, but where as I felt like I could sift through those after a couple of viewings, I'm unsure of whether I'll be able to come up with a cohesive theory on the new one. I skimmed through postings on the official message boards right after seeing it, and, again, unlike my experiences with the earlier films, no one seems to be in agreement on much. Regardless, I it's an excellent re-creating of a dream state and although this may be the cop out answer, I don't think understanding everything is necessary because it succeeds on a strictly emotional level. I'm sure that some of the layers of film within film will be clearer the next time I see it, but I'm not too concerned with plotting everything out or doing something crazily academic to "understand it".

Have you been able to see it? If anyone has the chance, I think it's definitely worth seeing with an audience. Plus, being on the large screen the frequent closeups are more unsettling than they'd be at home.

 

[Whitelinen]

No, it has not premiered here yet. But I will see it when it comes... maybe in the premiere night already.

Sounds like it's a perfect Lynch film for me. That's how I like them, understood on an emotional level. Do you have favourites of his other films?

Lynch is the only filmmaker who's films I enjoy anymore. I used to be a film fanatic, seeing tons of films per week and making lists about what I should see next, but recently films (old and new) have started to seem boring. I think I prefer theatre to films, as in films everything seems to perfect and staged... and I want spontanity, I want something other than perfection. That's why I have abandoned my interest in films lately, apart from Lynch. Maybe I could get my love for films back somehow?