The Pretension Of Yves Saint Laurent

[Orochian]

I find certain people's instant assumption that Tom Ford is making all this stuff up to be rather amusing. If YSL really was as "carefree" as some would like to believe, he (and Berge) wouldn't be spreading venom to every single major publication ever since the Gucci group took over his label. The two of them have always come across as complete A-holes, for the lack of a better term, and sound as if they were forced to sell the house with guns held next to their heads.

I'm sorry, but unless he happened to be another one of his "fragile" states (and whatever that means) the very moment he signed the papers, it was a mutual and completely willing decision on behalf of him.

Now, on to the newest bout of conflicts between him and Ford, I don't think the prospect of Tom Ford using these alleged letters against the old master would be in anyway a deterrent for YSL not to write them in the first place. For the record he's said countless blatantly biased, vicious comments to the press. If he could say such things in public, imagine what he'd spit out in private. However, it appears for some individuals, "throwing dirt" is completely harmless if it was done by YSL, but outright unacceptable if Tom Ford was doing it. At least whenever Ford tosses out a criticism of any kind, it's most often supported by facts and logic, which is more than can be said about a certain disturbed, elderly, "fragile" figure.

And as far as I'm concerned, Ford certainly doesn't have to, and shouldn't, make the actual letters public. It'd be unprofessional and immoral to do so, as these matters are strictly personal matters between him and YSL.

As I've always said, I respect the hugely differences of opinion here regarding Tom Ford, but to display such an apparent bias against him, in whatever he does or says, is just downright silly.

I will say no more.

 

[tott]

Originally posted by Orochian@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 10:41 pm
And as far as I'm concerned, Ford certainly doesn't have to, and shouldn't, make the actual letters public. It'd be unprofessional and immoral to do so, as these matters are strictly personal matters between him and YSL.

Ah, but why should he mention them at all, in that case? He's already made it public.

 

[Orochian]

He mentioned those letters as part of his unpleasant experience at the house of YSL - the main focus of his interview isn't "the ugly, bitchy side of Monsieur YSL". He certainly doesn't have to publicize every single document to which he made casual reference in his interviews.

People complain about receiving hatemails all the time - the actual details of the messages are more often than not kept private for personal reasons. Same thing.

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by tott+Mar 22nd, 2004 - 4:47 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tott @ Mar 22nd, 2004 - 4:47 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-Orochian@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 10:41 pm
And as far as I'm concerned, Ford certainly doesn't have to, and shouldn't, make the actual letters public. It'd be unprofessional and immoral to do so, as these matters are strictly personal matters between him and YSL.

Ah, but why should he mention them at all, in that case? He's already made it public. [/b][/quote]
Why shouldn't he? He no longer has a responsibility to Gucci Group to remain civil and quiet about the way YSL has treated him. Think about it, he kept his personal feelings aside for four years, can you blame him for wanting to let people know what he had to tolerate? Also, if he just said "Yves said some very mean things to me" would anybody take him seriously? At least he has a reason for feeling the way he does, Yves on the other hand made no attempt to be civil when discussing Ford, but always hid his personal feelings behind the whole "wasn't true to the spirit of the house" routine.

 

[Lena]

dont you have a feeling this discussion is recycling itself?

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by Spike413+Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:10 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Spike413 @ Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:10 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by tott@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 4:47 pm
<!--QuoteBegin-Orochian

@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 10:41 pm
And as far as I'm concerned, Ford certainly doesn't have to, and shouldn't, make the actual letters public.  It'd be unprofessional and immoral to do so, as these matters are strictly personal matters between him and YSL.

Ah, but why should he mention them at all, in that case? He's already made it public.

Why shouldn't he? He no longer has a responsibility to Gucci Group to remain civil and quiet about the way YSL has treated him. Think about it, he kept his personal feelings aside for four years, can you blame him for wanting to let people know what he had to tolerate? Also, if he just said "Yves said some very mean things to me" would anybody take him seriously? At least he has a reason for feeling the way he does, Yves on the other hand made no attempt to be civil when discussing Ford, but always hid his personal feelings behind the whole "wasn't true to the spirit of the house" routine. [/b][/quote]
well...actually spike the agreement ends on apr 1st i believe and that article is dated march 14th, i think...so tom should really shut up for two more weeks...well...less now...you do the math...

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by Lena@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:19 pm
dont you have a feeling this discussion is recycling itself?

Good point. As much as I have enjoyed debating this topic (believe me I have!) where has it gotten us? I think the only conclusions we've come to are:

Not everybody Likes Tom Ford, but that no longer matters much being that he is finished designing at YSL.

Yves is obviously in need of some form of therapy and comes off as an arrogant prick despite his talent.

And finally, we can't agree on this topic no matter what. But hey, that's the beauty of it!

Have I forgotten anything?


P.S., I know his agreement ends, but hey, he's done his last two collections, at this point, he probably doesn't give a crap what PPR has to say. Can't say I blame him, but I see what u mean.

 

[Nemova]

Originally posted by Spike413@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 8:25 pm
Good point. As much as I have enjoyed debating this topic (believe me I have!) where has it gotten us? I think the only conclusions we've come to are:

That's exactly what I was thinking


Nemova

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by Spike413+Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:25 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Spike413 @ Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:25 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-Lena@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:19 pm
dont you have a feeling this discussion is recycling itself? 

Good point. As much as I have enjoyed debating this topic (believe me I have!) where has it gotten us? I think the only conclusions we've come to are:

Not everybody Likes Tom Ford, but that no longer matters much being that he is finished designing at YSL.

Yves is obviously in need of some form of therapy and comes off as an arrogant prick despite his talent.

And finally, we can't agree on this topic no matter what. But hey, that's the beauty of it!

Have I forgotten anything?


P.S., I know his agreement ends, but hey, he's done his last two collections, at this point, he probably doesn't give a crap what PPR has to say. Can't say I blame him, but I see what u mean. [/b][/quote]
i think that just about covers it spike...thanks for the wrap up

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by softgrey+Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:41 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(softgrey @ Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:41 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by Spike413@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:25 pm
<!--QuoteBegin-Lena

@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 5:19 pm
dont you have a feeling this discussion is recycling itself? 

Good point. As much as I have enjoyed debating this topic (believe me I have!) where has it gotten us? I think the only conclusions we've come to are:

Not everybody Likes Tom Ford, but that no longer matters much being that he is finished designing at YSL.

Yves is obviously in need of some form of therapy and comes off as an arrogant prick despite his talent.

And finally, we can't agree on this topic no matter what. But hey, that's the beauty of it!

Have I forgotten anything?


P.S., I know his agreement ends, but hey, he's done his last two collections, at this point, he probably doesn't give a crap what PPR has to say. Can't say I blame him, but I see what u mean.

i think that just about covers it spike...thanks for the wrap up [/b][/quote]
Not at all my fellow fashion entheusiast

 

[Lena]

 

[Mutterlein]

not to dig up any worms, but I've been reading the biography by Alicia Drake about Yves Saint Laurent and Karl Lagerfeld's rivalry during the 70's. So far it has been pretty exceptional. I have a couple of more chapters left.

It's very very telling, Drake did her research. I suggest you all read it, "The Beautiful Fall".