The Pretension Of Yves Saint Laurent

[Spike413]

Originally posted by softgrey+Mar 18th, 2004 - 1:52 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(softgrey @ Mar 18th, 2004 - 1:52 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by Spike413@Mar 18th, 2004 - 1:49 pm
<!--QuoteBegin-softgrey

@Mar 18th, 2004 - 12:28 pm
dude-he's....YSL....he has a history if mental instability ...he's having a nervous breakdown every other day....he's always had to go away for 'a rest' because of his mental state...he's a tortured soul...the whole thing with ford is just the kind of thing you'd expect from the drama queen himself...this is just the kind of drama that makes fashion fun and exciting....it's all part of the spectacle....let ysl say whatever he wants...it's fun to read...


ooooh-what will happen next....

The tension mounts!
And I gotta say, even though I haven't agreed with you on this topic very much, it would be totally entertainig to see Yves throw a hissy fit cause now he doesn't think Pilati is good enough either. But hey, if you can't be a drama queen in fashion, then where can you be one?

hollywood

tf's new home.... [/b][/quote]
Oh come now, Except mabye for Joan Crawford, Hollywood's mentally instable drama has nothin on fashion!!!! All of the phony people, the divas, Yves.......it's like a giant soap opera, I LOVE IT!

 

[datura001]

I was thinking that maybe none of Tom's collections for the house were exceptional but then again...there's the surrealist collection of S/S 03 that wound up being influential on fashion in many ways. It also featured a nod to YSL's fascination with hearts around the neck, it's something he showed in haute couture necklaces when he was still showing. In looking at the show again, it had this real modern air, almost as if it were modeled after cooly dangerous French women in movies who have no problem being a bit dark (Merci Pour Le Chocolat, The Piano Teacher). You can almost see that Tom worked his hardest on it to advance different ideas that had nothing to do with Gucci. So, I think I'll give him a little more credit than I initially did. Does everyone just hate every single thing he did for the house?

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by datura001@Mar 20th, 2004 - 7:55 pm
I was thinking that maybe none of Tom's collections for the house were exceptional but then again...there's the surrealist collection of S/S 03 that wound up being influential on fashion in many ways. It also featured a nod to YSL's fascination with hearts around the neck, it's something he showed in haute couture necklaces when he was still showing. In looking at the show again, it had this real modern air, almost as if it were modeled after cooly dangerous French women in movies who have no problem being a bit dark (Merci Pour Le Chocolat, The Piano Teacher). You can almost see that Tom worked his hardest on it to advance different ideas that had nothing to do with Gucci. So, I think I'll give him a little more credit than I initially did. Does everyone just hate every single thing he did for the house?

U know, I actually loved that collection. I thought it was so great how he paired these very structured miniature jackets with 40s inspired shoulders over pretty little dresses. But then there was this perversity behind it all, the embroidered body parts, the painted nipples, the heart pendants. There was something mildly YSL about it.......Ironicly, it didn't get great reviews

 

[datura001]

It was the jackets I noticed the most, they had great suppleness but then stopped dead and cold at the waist. The dresses were gathered in great little ways and then there were the cute little lips on shoes and etched hands reaching across the nude colored bathing suits...it just all has this odd charm to it that combines a modern sense of luxury with a lot of humor...and then the makeup, the pale, pale face with the dark smudgy eye...I like it more and more

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by kit@Mar 18th, 2004 - 2:06 pm
I was sitting in a waiting room at the hospital , today , and there was nothing else interesting to read than the March edition of VOGUE UK .

There is a double page on the ' retirement ' of the great TF , one side on the highlights of his collections for GUCCI , and on the other , the ' highlights ' of his collections for YSL .

Needless to say , the second side was marked by the lack of anything really distinctive , apart from the peasant blouse of A/W 02 .

The GUCCI page did have SOME ' glitzy ' character , on the other hand , and I thought that , really , this contrast said it all about what has been discussed in this thread .

Tom Ford - a great showman , but NOT anybody with the calibre as a designer of the ' great ' Yves Saint Laurent , himself .

KIT

i agree with kit... that peasant blouse and one dress from this season are really the only two things that stand out from tf's time at ysl...

i actually have a version of that blouse...surprise!!... ...i actually own some YSL...but no gucci...while the early days at gucci were fun and exciting and new...it just became redundant and went steadily downhill...

tom's a one trick pony...

he may be able to make one good movie...but i bet that's it...and maybe design one good house or one good book...but he's not a genius with ideas just pouring out of himself...he's more of a businessman...and a showman...

edited -freudian slip....

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by datura001@Mar 21st, 2004 - 10:30 am
It was the jackets I noticed the most, they had great suppleness but then stopped dead and cold at the waist. The dresses were gathered in great little ways and then there were the cute little lips on shoes and etched hands reaching across the nude colored bathing suits...it just all has this odd charm to it that combines a modern sense of luxury with a lot of humor...and then the makeup, the pale, pale face with the dark smudgy eye...I like it more and more

Oh I know, the shoes with those enamel lips were great. And I loved the soft, pretty little dresses with the seams to imitate a body part like the butt or the breast....but then there was a silk flower in the decolletage. So contradictory, I loved it.

 

[Deleted member 1957]

see i told you......this argument can never end. There are people who are still gonna hate tf and others who arent~~

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by eguana@Mar 21st, 2004 - 2:41 pm
see i told you......this argument can never end. There are people who are still gonna hate tf and others who arent~~

it's not an argument...it's a discussion and if people didn't have an opposing view, there'd be nothing to discuss...what's the problem?

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by softgrey+Mar 21st, 2004 - 2:49 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(softgrey @ Mar 21st, 2004 - 2:49 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-eguana@Mar 21st, 2004 - 2:41 pm
see i told you......this argument can never end. There are people who are still gonna hate tf and others who arent~~

it's not an argument...it's a discussion and if people didn't have an opposing view, there'd be nothing to discuss...what's the problem? [/b][/quote]
Oh I know, my debate teacher should give me credit for all of the disscussions I've been involved in.

 

[softgrey]

it's important to be able to back up your opinions if you want to be taken seriously in life...i think it's an excellent excercise...very healthy...

 

[LadyIllusion]

WOW! There is just so much history here. I never thought id be remotely interested to read the full thread, but i can tell you it certainly made interesting reading. I must say i have learned something new. Thanx

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by OriginalGucciGirl@Mar 21st, 2004 - 4:36 pm
WOW! There is just so much history here. I never thought id be remotely interested to read the full thread, but i can tell you it certainly made interesting reading. I must say i have learned something new. Thanx

 

[Lena]

Originally posted by softgrey+Mar 21st, 2004 - 10:53 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(softgrey @ Mar 21st, 2004 - 10:53 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-OriginalGucciGirl@Mar 21st, 2004 - 4:36 pm
WOW! There is just so much history here. I never thought id be remotely interested to read the full thread, but i can tell you it certainly made interesting reading. I must say i have learned something new. Thanx

[/b][/quote]

 

[Spike413]

Originally posted by Lena+Mar 21st, 2004 - 4:56 pm--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lena @ Mar 21st, 2004 - 4:56 pm)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by softgrey@Mar 21st, 2004 - 10:53 pm
<!--QuoteBegin-OriginalGucciGirl

@Mar 21st, 2004 - 4:36 pm
WOW! There is just so much history here. I never thought id be remotely interested to read the full thread, but i can tell you it certainly made interesting reading.   I must say i have learned something new. Thanx

[/b][/quote]
Oh yeah, this is way more fun and entertaining then any political debate. I love TFS!

 

[lucky star]

Ah! GucciGirl totally beat me to it. I was also going to comment on the this thread, it has been more than worth it to read the whole thing. I was so interested in the history of YSL and the love/hate relationship that everyone has with Tom Ford. I wonder if that means he is doing something right... or not, as far as from a business aspect. Personally I am not a big fan of most of his collectiones at YSL, but I did enjoy some of his stuff at Gucci. I really also just wanted to offer my thanks for a lively lesson in fashion.

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by luckystar413@Mar 21st, 2004 - 8:44 pm
Ah! GucciGirl totally beat me to it. I was also going to comment on the this thread, it has been more than worth it to read the whole thing. I was so interested in the history of YSL and the love/hate relationship that everyone has with Tom Ford. I wonder if that means he is doing something right... or not, as far as from a business aspect. Personally I am not a big fan of most of his collectiones at YSL, but I did enjoy some of his stuff at Gucci. I really also just wanted to offer my thanks for a lively lesson in fashion.

 

[Nemova]

I have to disagree with you, softgrey, but I hate every outfit Alber Elbaz designed for YSL. I think neither him or TF captured the so-called "spirit" of the maison, but at least TF presented us with some sexy looks. As for the chicness, sophistication and innovation of the YSL brand, TF lacked the talent to pair the big boss. I think YSL was a fashion artist in the true sense of it, and Ford takes the cake when it comes to creating more commercial looks. They are both talented in their own way, one being a crafter and the other a succesful businessman. The first couldn't manage to modernize the brand, the last made it vulgar to an extreme point.

Nemova

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by Nemova@Mar 21st, 2004 - 10:16 pm
I have to disagree with you, softgrey, but I hate every outfit Alber Elbaz designed for YSL. I think neither him or TF captured the so-called "spirit" of the maison, but at least TF presented us with some sexy looks. As for the chicness, sophistication and innovation of the YSL brand, TF lacked the talent to pair the big boss. I think YSL was a fashion artist in the true sense of it, and Ford takes the cake when it comes to creating more commercial looks. They are both talented in their own way, one being a crafter and the other a succesful businessman. The first couldn't manage to modernize the brand, the last made it vulgar to an extreme point.

Nemova

i don't think alber was at ysl long enough to really know what it would have developed into...i think the last collection...esp the looks i posted ...were amazing and timeless...he wasn't fortunate enough to have the financial support or the marketing machine that tom had at his disposal...but it's clear that he elbaz is a great talent..

there are different kinds of sexy...it doesn't always have to be overt...one can be completely sexy while showing no skin...the tie at the neck here and the fact that it's leather ...this is sexy to me...it's such a prim and proper ladylike outfit...except the blouse is totally bondage..i love this kind of subtlety...it's classic with a twist...wha's not to love?....

totally sexy secretary...

 

[Erzébeth]

apparently tom ford tried to be friendly with YSL but he blew him off:

"It was difficult from the start. I made a real effort with YSL himself at the beginning. I had a foolish idea that we would get along... and that he would be happy. I included him in the beginning, but very quickly, he turned on me. I received nasty letters from him, and they were pretty constant. They were sort of vicious."

-tom ford

 

[softgrey]

Originally posted by Erzébeth@Mar 22nd, 2004 - 2:02 am
apparently tom ford tried to be friendly with YSL but he blew him off:

"It was difficult from the start. I made a real effort with YSL himself at the beginning. I had a foolish idea that we would get along... and that he would be happy. I included him in the beginning, but very quickly, he turned on me. I received nasty letters from him, and they were pretty constant. They were sort of vicious."

-tom ford

ha ha...that's pretty funny...where's that quote from...i can totally imagine ysl staying up all night composing venomous notes to tf...i'm sure he was absolutely hysterical over what was going on with the collections...(and i'm sure there's more to the story that tom's not saying...like what ysl was upset about)...

omg...the poor guy...he's really from a different time... the business has changed so much...i can completely understand why he would freak out...ah well... c'est la vie...