Zhang Ziyi In Memoirs Of A Geisha

[Sephora_Socialite]

haha...yeah, but its the closest thing to explaining to people...sadly

 

[tiffany]

Originally posted by purplelucrezia@Nov 16 2004, 12:06 AM
I think that having that flexibility makes us rethink our perceptions and helps to break down a lot of racial boundaries.

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I agree completely
If a person can act well enough to make you believe they are the character they're trying to portray, then I can't see a problem with having someone in a role who isn't of the same background as their character - hence, I bow to the Ethiopian actress who played Queen Victoria, it was astoundingly convincing, she made you look beyond her ethnicity and just see a great portrayal of a character

well, that's my opinion anyway those pics are stunning, thanks so much - I love her style

 

[onehotgrrl]

I agree with you Tiffany- but some people will NEVER be able to look past another person's ethnicity.

 

[tiffany]

Originally posted by onehotgrrl@Nov 16 2004, 02:07 AM
I agree with you Tiffany- but some people will NEVER be able to look past another person's ethnicity.

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I know, and it's such a pity, but here's to hoping

 

[breathe0xygen]

Originally posted by tiffany@Nov 16 2004, 03:34 PM
I agree completely
If a person can act well enough to make you believe they are the character they're trying to portray, then I can't see a problem with having someone in a role who isn't of the same background as their character - hence, I bow to the Ethiopian actress who played Queen Victoria, it was astoundingly convincing, she made you look beyond her ethnicity and just see a great portrayal of a character

well, that's my opinion anyway those pics are stunning, thanks so much - I love her style

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I must agree... she's supposedly a very good actress. She's beautiful, talented with great style, but it kind of dissapoints me that they didn't choose a Japanese actress... She really doesn't look Japanese in my opinion, which kind of ruins it for me.

I saw a television program where they had auditions for this role. Many Japanese ladies had auditioned but it struck me that their english wasn't good enough...

 

[mishahoi]

Originally posted by breathe0xygen@Nov 16 2004, 03:21 AM
I must agree... she's supposedly a very good actress. She's beautiful, talented with great style, but it kind of dissapoints me that they didn't choose a Japanese actress... She really doesn't look Japanese in my opinion, which kind of ruins it for me.

I saw a television program where they had auditions for this role. Many Japanese ladies had auditioned but it struck me that their english wasn't good enough...

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really? and last i heard zi yi speak she wasn't so hot either ?

they could have picked koyuki who played opposite tom cruise in the last samurai. at least she's slightly recognizable, and she's a great actress:

 

[breathe0xygen]

Originally posted by mishahoi@Nov 16 2004, 05:28 PM
really? and last i heard zi yi speak she wasn't so hot either ?

they could have picked koyuki who played opposite tom cruise in the last samurai. at least she's slightly recognizable, and she's a great actress:

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Koyuki would have been a great choice. too bad...

 

[tiffany]

Originally posted by mishahoi@Nov 16 2004, 03:28 AM
koyuki who played opposite tom cruise in the last samurai. at least she's slightly recognizable, and she's a great actress:

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she was lovely in The Last Samurai

 

[meowmix]

koyuki...
zhang ziyi is most likely still not very good at english...she didn't want to learn english before and that was why she spoke chinese in rush hour, but then picked it up later..
i wonder how they'll work with her chinese accent because its highly unlikely that it won't be noticeable... like it was kind of painful for me to sit through crouching tiger with chow yun fat or whatever his name is...

rr speaking of casting ppl of diff ethnicities/nationalities...i just remembered... pretty much the entire cast of dragon seed

but i still love katharine hepburn

and yul brynner in the king and i

i guess we all have our biases and i just remembered mine...

 

[breathe0xygen]

Originally posted by meowmix@Nov 16 2004, 05:48 PM
koyuki...
zhang ziyi is most likely still not very good at english...she didn't want to learn english before and that was why she spoke chinese in rush hour, but then picked it up later..
i wonder how they'll work with her chinese accent because its highly unlikely that it won't be noticeable... like it was kind of painful for me to sit through crouching tiger with chow yun fat or whatever his name is...

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Ah very very true. I wonder about that too. Chinese accents and Japanese accents are different... very good point Meowmix!

 

[oceanharlot]

It's not surprising that this film (from which the book it is derived from was written by a white man btw) has hired an actress of the incorrect nationality to portray the lead. I think it's disgusting how people lump together all nationalities into groups. White, black, Asian, Hispanic... When a film is set in a certain time period in a definite place with a specific subject matter, it is the producer's and director's repsonsibility to correctly portray it correctly. There is a difference between portraying a British woman when you are American (which btw, they still get flack for their accents and mannerisms. Just go to a cinema in London when Bridget Jones comes out.)

Here in Hawaii, I am forever hearing about how "The Last Samurai", "Kill Bill", and others in that same genre that are currently "cool" are shams on their drawn on cultures. One of my professors is so incredibly angry about the Samurai films made by white men that he won't even go to the free showing at the Student Center. To see your culture misrepresented and skewed so far from the truth is like the ultimate slap in the face he says.

To say "Oh, she's so pretty, who cares what nationality she is?" Is so beyond ignorant, I can't even believe it. Who cares if a white man slaps on some black face paints and slaps his knees portraying a black man? Who cares if a white woman draws a line on the outside of her eye and act "like a japanese"? Its the exact same thing for a Chinese actor to portray a character that is so inherrently Japanese, doing a sacred, culturally specific act...

Yeah it isn't hurting anyone.

 

[meowmix]

very well put, ocean...although i am admittedly biased to a certain extent, i absolutely agree...and that was along the lines of wat i'd hoped to get across before

 

[tiffany]

Originally posted by oceanharlot@Nov 16 2004, 05:07 AM
To say "Oh, she's so pretty, who cares what nationality she is?" Is so beyond ignorant, I can't even believe it. Who cares if a white man slaps on some black face paints and slaps his knees portraying a black man? Who cares if a white woman draws a line on the outside of her eye and act "like a japanese"? Its the exact same thing for a Chinese actor to portray a character that is so inherrently Japanese, doing a sacred, culturally specific act...

Yeah it isn't hurting anyone.

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I understand what you're saying, and I agree - and it's especially pertinent because this is a completely culturally specific film to Japan. I'm not trying to defend the misrepresentation of cultures - I just think that it isn't necessary for an actor to be of the same background as their character, as long as they act well and make you believe that they are the character, without of course being in any way disrespectful to who they are portraying.

The example of "black face" is a bit extreme, because as far as I know it was intended to be derogatory towards africans - which is completely inexcusable. I don't think casting Ziyi as a Japanese character is supposed to be derogatory - not intentionally anyway, although some people may be offended by it

I really don't mean to offend anyone, btw - I'm very sorry if I have

 

[purplelucrezia]

I agree with tiffany, I think that that was done during a different time period. Also, from what I've read about Al Jolson (and if anyone's actually bothered to watch the Jazz Singer), it wasn't meant as a racist act on his part. As strange and offensive as it is to our contemporary eyes, putting on that makeup helped to get him into character. I find it especially fascinating that this Jewish man would do that, because he's also from a historically acted against group. As much as I don't like it, it's always important to look at things from the perspective of it being a very different time. We always need to remember that when we're looking at any type of media from the past...
In terms of the present though, it is a very sad thing that Hollywood still hasn't advanced a huge amount from that particular mind set. I would love if there were more actors of various ethnic backgrounds out there, getting major attention by the media. It does seem as if they can put one major player out there (say, Halle Berry) it'll be alright to cover everyone else and make them seem more accepting. It would have been fantastic to see a Japanese actress in the title role here, although I'm not sure Koyuki would have been my first choice personally. That being said though, they aren't quite up to that level yet in Hollywood and casting choices like this are still being made. I think that at least we can take some consolation from the fact that at least the individual actress they chose was a good one.

 

[purplelucrezia]

I just remembered this movie, which I saw once in grade two...
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...580727?v=glance

 

[softgrey]

my ex boyfriend is korean...and everyone thinks he looks japanese...he once sent me a website that endeavored to prove that you can't judge a book by its cover...

it had all different asian people's pics and you were to try to guess what their ethnic background was...

absolutely no one we know who did it got it all right...and at least half of them were asian themselves...most people got 50% or less...

the point is...that you really can't tell just by looking at someone what their background is...that in and of itself is a sterotype...judging people by the way they look is always dangerous...

just my 2 cents...

 

[tiffany]

Originally posted by purplelucrezia@Nov 16 2004, 10:46 AM
I agree with tiffany, I think that that was done during a different time period. Also, from what I've read about Al Jolson (and if anyone's actually bothered to watch the Jazz Singer), it wasn't meant as a racist act on his part. As strange and offensive as it is to our contemporary eyes, putting on that makeup helped to get him into character. I find it especially fascinating that this Jewish man would do that, because he's also from a historically acted against group. As much as I don't like it, it's always important to look at things from the perspective of it being a very different time. We always need to remember that when we're looking at any type of media from the past...
In terms of the present though, it is a very sad thing that Hollywood still hasn't advanced a huge amount from that particular mind set. I would love if there were more actors of various ethnic backgrounds out there, getting major attention by the media. It does seem as if they can put one major player out there (say, Halle Berry) it'll be alright to cover everyone else and make them seem more accepting. It would have been fantastic to see a Japanese actress in the title role here, although I'm not sure Koyuki would have been my first choice personally. That being said though, they aren't quite up to that level yet in Hollywood and casting choices like this are still being made. I think that at least we can take some consolation from the fact that at least the individual actress they chose was a good one.

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very well said

 

[Kimkhuu]

Originally posted by tiffany@Nov 16 2004, 01:34 AM
If a person can act well enough to make you believe they are the character they're trying to portray, then I can't see a problem with having someone in a role who isn't of the same background as their character - hence, I bow to the

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Ditto.

 

[lunabella]

Originally posted by Kimkhuu@Nov 16 2004, 12:37 PM
Ditto.

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hmm, i find it would be hard to act japanese when you are really chinese, but i guess i'm just a bad actress. or i'm not japanese.

 

[purplelucrezia]

Originally posted by lunabella@Nov 16 2004, 06:39 PM
hmm, i find it would be hard to act japanese when you are really chinese, but i guess i'm just a bad actress. or i'm not japanese.

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That's the thing, though, it's more about the character themselves than their family tree.