Alexander Wang S/S 11 New York

in general,

alexander wang dresses his generation therefore it has to be accessible, cool, and stamped with approval with a wang tag.

Dont expect the best fabrics and to be comparable to established older houses because its not the same league.

What Wang succeeds in is maintaining his creativity but still being able to produce the pieces and sell them. The business aspect of it is genius. As he continues to grow he will have more room to take risks but for now he edits and allows his business to nourish. He's in for the long haul and one day his creativity will match his business sense.


I can't say much for a business that has built itself on shoddy construction, but yes, he has built a massive empire in a very short time. Will it last? Not so sure.

But since when did we evaluate clothes on how well they are marketed and sold? When did we let the status quo and marketing hype take priority over quality and ingenuity? On second thought, don't answer that question.

If Wang isn't in the same league (and he certainly is not) then he should not pretend to be. He can do a good legging and t-shirt, but the comme des garcons/martin margiela/helmut lang impersonations aren't fooling anyone.

Designers like this receive hype and attention and then we wonder why our old crafts are dying out. Please.
 
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i think everyone is entitled to their opinion and i do see how some may think he is overhyped.

but for me there is an admiration for brand building for a young individual and be so creative that he is comparable (deserved or not) to established brands.

he is the next generation like it or not and i want to support that. He's dressing for his age bracket and he's not caught in the hype. i really believe that hes in for the long haul and looks at sustaining his company. Its the continuous balance of art and business which i take he recognizes.

To call him completely illegitimate as a designer would be farce.

But again to each his own.
 
i think everyone is entitled to their opinion and i do see how some may think he is overhyped.

but for me there is an admiration for brand building for a young individual and be so creative that he is comparable (deserved or not) to established brands.

he is the next generation like it or not and i want to support that. He's dressing for his age bracket and he's not caught in the hype. i really believe that hes in for the long haul and looks at sustaining his company. Its the continuous balance of art and business which i take he recognizes.

To call him completely illegitimate as a designer would be farce.

But again to each his own.

If he had started out in a tiny studio with only his friends and favors and then had made his line into what is then maybe I'd agree, you know, that's how Yves St. Laurent got his start after he was fired at Dior. But no, the brand has been built overnight with his family's money, his company is ran by his sister and his parents. He is hardly an upstart.

.
 
If he had started out in a tiny studio with only his friends and favors and then had made his line into what is then maybe I'd agree, you know, that's how Yves St. Laurent got his start after he was fired at Dior. But no, the brand has been built overnight with his family's money, his company is ran by his sister and his parents. He is hardly an upstart.

.

While I agree that everyone rather supports a humble rags-to-riches- success story, I don't think it would be fair to put a blame on him for the fortunate fact that he was born into the money. Susan Dell has had it and I didn't mind it when she was establishing Phi. Then again, that operation didn't take off with as much hype as Alexander Wang did, partially due to the decidedly high pricing and much more sophisticated point of view, which made their aesthetic more niche than Alexander Wang, who's goal seems to reach for a much larger audience anyway. It's maybe been a refreshing sight to see especially a very young designer with such a decidedly realistic, business-savvy point of view surfacing during a recession period when everyone else seemed to be doing rather poorly, but it also makes him lack a certain depth in artistry and sense of purpose as per why he designs the way he does.

Nonetheless, I find the similarities that have been drawn with people like Helmut Lang to be quite absurd. While you cannot deny that the business behind Alexander Wang is doing strong and there has been a awareness of his style established in such a short time, one must admit there is more depth in attitude and design integrity with people like Helmut, with Margiela or Ann Demeulemeester involved, which their customers understand and that ultimately made them faithful for much longer then when their collections were enjoying a certain momentum in the 90ies. Alexander Wang's design relies too much on the overall styling impact for the design of the separate pieces to have any recognizable signatures such as the way Hedi Slimane would cut a shirt/jacket collar, a Rick Owens jacket would have the front zip running asymmetrically up or the way a McQueen dress is fitted on the body. You simply wouldn't find someone like Zazie, who has made a very insightful post on the Theyskens' Theory thread, make such a sharp observation on the cutting of an Alexander Wang garment.

A sensitive customer surely wishes to establish a certain kind of understanding with the aesthetic universe a designer is projecting for him or her to become empathic with the design... and whereas people like Olivier Theyskens have previously faced difficulties to make their clothes accessible to a wider public, his overall aesthetic was accessible and appreciated to a wider public.
 
actually if you rea her interview in The Harper's Bazaar Runway Report
it will seem a lot clearer of why she says the things the way she does

bah! no matter what she says in interviews, we all know she does it because eventually dirty talking is what all of us look for in a saucy NYT article :wink:
(kidding)

about the interview... did you read it online? i'd love to read it, but i just can't find it anywhere :flower:
 
While I agree that everyone rather supports a humble rags-to-riches- success story, I don't think it would be fair to put a blame on him for the fortunate fact that he was born into the money. Susan Dell has had it and I didn't mind it when she was establishing Phi. Then again, that operation didn't take off with as much hype as Alexander Wang did, partially due to the decidedly high pricing and much more sophisticated point of view, which made their aesthetic more niche than Alexander Wang, who's goal seems to reach for a much larger audience anyway. It's maybe been a refreshing sight to see especially a very young designer with such a decidedly realistic, business-savvy point of view surfacing during a recession period when everyone else seemed to be doing rather poorly, but it also makes him lack a certain depth in artistry and sense of purpose as per why he designs the way he does.

Nonetheless, I find the similarities that have been drawn with people like Helmut Lang to be quite absurd. While you cannot deny that the business behind Alexander Wang is doing strong and there has been a awareness of his style established in such a short time, one must admit there is more depth in attitude and design integrity with people like Helmut, with Margiela or Ann Demeulemeester involved, which their customers understand and that ultimately made them faithful for much longer then when their collections were enjoying a certain momentum in the 90ies. Alexander Wang's design relies too much on the overall styling impact for the design of the separate pieces to have any recognizable signatures such as the way Hedi Slimane would cut a shirt/jacket collar, a Rick Owens jacket would have the front zip running asymmetrically up or the way a McQueen dress is fitted on the body. You simply wouldn't find someone like Zazie, who has made a very insightful post on the Theyskens' Theory thread, make such a sharp observation on the cutting of an Alexander Wang garment.

A sensitive customer surely wishes to establish a certain kind of understanding with the aesthetic universe a designer is projecting for him or her to become empathic with the design... and whereas people like Olivier Theyskens have previously faced difficulties to make their clothes accessible to a wider public, his overall aesthetic was accessible and appreciated to a wider public.

while i can find some things in your argument i agree with (it's a very good argument), do you honestly believe that alexander wang set out to become another ann demuelemeester, martin margiela, hedi slimane, or alexander mcqueen? i don't see the utility in comparing lines like alexander wang to lines like ann demuelemeester: they're entirely different beasts. it's like comparing house of holland to chanel.

now, when one actually gets into the weeds with respect to the offerings of martin margiela, hedi slimane by way of dior homme, alexander mcqueen, and helmut lang, one realizes that much of their appeal to the mass market lacked the artistic integrity one calls for out of alexander wang. yes, hedi slimane proposed a devastatingly modern new way of dressing for men, but he also lorded over logoed handbags, distressed designer denim, and high-priced sneakers. helmut lang, lest we all forget, finds himself partially responsible for the idea of designer denim and his offerings while more intellectually novel, appealed to much of the same fashion-concerned demographic (albeit of the last generation) that this collection does.
 
I was really trying to follow your argumentation but unfortunately missed on any points as per why you believe Alexander Wang inherited Helmut Lang's clientele or a younger equivalent - With him, it was really all about the entire package, from the unusual advertising/presentation formats (him being the first designer to show his collection on the internet), to the artist collaborations with Louise Bourgeois and Jenny Holzer to the Richard Gluckmann store architecture etc. that was speaking to a very specific, sensitive audience, one that was not necessarily drawn to the world of fashion, but the link to artistry and substantial, continuous style that Helmut himself was seeking for in his collections (part of the reason why wearing a piece of vintage Helmut Lang, well older than 10 years of time, hardly feels any more dated today than his last few collections shown in Paris). Those customers, most of which comprise of architects, artists, museum curators and other cerebral creatives, would then only buy from other designers of such kind - Martin Margiela, Yohji Yamamoto, Ann Demeulemeester.

From all of these designers, Helmut Lang was probably the designer with the most decided control over the image of his fashion business, largely accounting to the reason why his label had it's inimitable cool (and maybe an audience so definable that it was a rather small, not-so-deep-pocketed cliente as Prada was hoping to grow a business out of). I don't want to discredit your sense of argumentation, but from my understanding and observation on the sales floor, selling Helmut Lang and other of the afore mentioned designers for many years, I can only observe that this customer is almost not shopping high fashion for the simple reason that clothes as Helmut's are hardly being offered today; instead, they will continue to wear their vintage Lang with pride and care, despite the fact that fashion is again turning towards a neo-90ies minimalism championed by people such as Alexander Wang or Phoebe Philo most recently. It also seems as if we were thinking of Helmut's moleskin Chesterfield coats, parkas and shearlings, now that everyone is talking of investment outerwear, no?

But back to the Helmut customer again. Some of them, would they continue to find a liking in luxury clothing, were likely picking up Hedi Slimane's more minimalist, existential designs for Dior Homme - The perfectly-cut and manufactured tuxedo suit for men and women, the dark wash jeans (often seen as an update in terms of fit and fabrication to those Prada was producing in recent years before the Theory-acquisition), the crisp shirting, all of which were items that could be seen as an update on Helmut Lang staples. So in a way, yes, you could say that Dior Homme under Hedi was definitely taking away some of Helmut's market, be it due to the compromise in quality during the Prada days or because of the fact that the market was ready for a more luxe iteration of Helmut's vision. Interesting enough, Hedi's credibility among his most loyal fans slowly came to an end after SS'04, when his interest shifted towards a more indie rock-inspired aesthetic. The cycle eventually completes itself for when you enter a Dior Homme store today: Albeit the fact that Kris van Assche is at the artistic helms for several years now, it seem to be the afore mentioned staple pieces introduced during the Hedi days that are turning the profit.

I guess I have extended this argumentation far ahead from where we were originating from, but to me it seems clear that with Alexander Wang, you have a young designer in his mid-twenties aiming to design mostly for customers in his age tier that have a much less brain-y, careless approach to consumerism than with Helmut Lang... it's a bit the way Miu Miu is the younger, cheekier (and by now, not necessarily less expensive) sibling to Prada or the way a Marc by Marc Jacobs collection should be, compared to the mainline and their sky-high prices.

Here is also an interesting article written by Eric Wilson that was issued shortly after Helmut's departure. I took the liberty to highlight some points that I thought would underline my assumptions...

May 26, 2005
Decline and Fall of Helmut Lang
By ERIC WILSON

ABOUT Helmut Lang's major influence over the fashion of the last 15 years there is little doubt. Consumers can thank him for flat-front pants, the number of buttons on men's suits - first three, more recently two - and the spiraling prices of designer jeans and T-shirts. An entire culture of prestige denim was born from Mr. Lang's low-rise jeans with intricate washes, for which he dared to charge close to $200 in the 1990's.

So powerful was his creative leadership that when he said he would show his collections in Manhattan ahead of European rivals, most American designers followed suit, and New York Fashion Week was permanently rescheduled.

Yet this designer, who was once a driving force of minimalism, who was profiled in The New Yorker and who advertised his name in thick black letters on the top of taxicabs, has found himself in a state of free fall, with his empire being dismantled piece by piece.

Four months ago Mr. Lang left the company that bears his name after long-running discontent with the Prada Group, which owns it. In early May, Prada began talks to sell off the business, describing it as unprofitable. This week Prada told managers at the designer's stores in New York and Paris they would be shuttered in July.

Mr. Lang, 49, has been able to hold on to the oceanfront mansion in East Hampton, N.Y., he bought for $15.5 million after first selling Prada a stake in his business. (He outbid Jerry Seinfeld for the property.) But as he weighs his future, he has told friends, he may never return to fashion. "I don't think he will ever take up the form again," said Elfie Semotan, a photographer who has known him since he began designing in Vienna in the 1980's.

When asked of his plans at a recent benefit in Manhattan for the International Center of Photography, Mr. Lang smiled in his typically opaque way and said only one word, "Patience."

In a sense his ejection from fashion's high table is a familiar story: designers have long sold control of their labels for cash to grow, then clashed with the new bosses and had to leave. Hervé Léger was fired from Hervé Léger. Joseph Abboud quit Joseph Abboud. Jil Sander quit Jil Sander, twice.

But unlike some others, according to executives who worked with Mr. Lang, he was given broad latitude to run his design studio and to decide how to develop his brand, including unconventional marketing like advertisements in National Geographic. Success, however, did not follow. Sales fell 60 percent over five years, Prada reported, from more than $100 million in 1999, when it bought the company, to $37 million in 2003.

Publicly, Prada executives attributed the slide to declining tourism related to fear of terrorism and severe acute respiratory syndrome and to the strong euro, but not to what some retailers now acknowledge, that Mr. Lang's dedication to minimalism was absolute even as consumer tastes evolved.

"Look at Dolce & Gabbana, Cavalli, Dior and Chloé," said Carla Sozzani, the owner of 10 Corso Como, an influential store in Milan, where Prada is based. "That has nothing to do with Helmut Lang. The whole concept of minimalism was very good in the early 90's, but then for the past several years people were not interested in that look."

Another reason for the decline in sales was Prada's cancellation of a license to an outside company to make Helmut Lang jeans, which were responsible for more than half of the brand's revenues. In their trademark dark blue or black, the jeans were sold at more than 700 stores around the world. The decision to cut back production was in line with the dominant philosophy of building a designer label through expensive leather handbags and shoes and opening chic retail stores.

Mr. Lang said at the time the move would protect the exclusivity of his name. That was the mantra of the luxury industry circa 2000, as intoned by LVMH Moët Hennessy Louis Vuitton and other companies.

But in reducing the production of Helmut Lang denim, Prada was in a sense killing the goose that laid the golden eggs. "This may have been good for the image, but maybe not good for the business," Ms. Sozzani said. "The entire business was based on the jeans."

Matters were not helped by Mr. Lang's failure to create an "it" handbag. A Helmut Lang fragrance introduced in 2000 was also a disappointment. In the end, friends of Mr. Lang contend, Prada did not invest enough in the brand or fulfill its promise of opening Helmut Lang retail stores. They described how the designer would discuss plans with Prada's chief executive, Patrizio Bertelli, and then not hear anything for months. Prada executives faulted Mr. Lang's exacting control and said it hindered their ability to do business.

"Personally I think that what happened is not the problem of Helmut Lang or Prada," said Franco Pene, the chairman of Gibo, which produced Mr. Lang's runway collections when the label was sold to Prada. "Everyone did the same mistake then, whether it was Prada or Gucci or LVMH. Everyone thought they had such a good formula to develop designer businesses. They thought it was possible to replicate a successful business model with new acquisitions. But it did not happen."

For much of the association of Mr. Lang and Mr. Bertelli their forceful personalities were evenly matched. When Jil Sander resigned from her company the first time, in a spat with Mr. Bertelli over the products he expected her to design, Mr. Lang said publicly he had "no problem" with Mr. Bertelli.

That may have been because Mr. Lang, who is described by friends as extremely loyal, divided his responsibilities and Mr. Bertelli's between business and design, making no complaints if he disagreed with the executive's strategies. Mr. Bertelli has been painted in profiles as prone to spontaneous decisions and to turning his all-consuming attention from project to project, whether it is the opening of a huge Prada store or an America's Cup campaign. He declined to comment on his strategy running Helmut Lang or to say if the label was for sale.

Jason Jacobs, a Prada spokesman, said the company had been in touch with parties that have expressed interest in the business. "Our objective for Helmut Lang is to position it for the long-term success of the brand and to generate positive returns from a business perspective," Mr. Jacobs said.

Much as Mr. Lang rarely submitted to interviews or attended fashion world parties when he was most in demand - he did not show up at the Council of Fashion Designers of America awards ceremony in 2000, when he was nominated in three categories - he has remained silent about Prada since his departure. He has cultivated the position of an outsider since his early days in Vienna, more interested in D.J.'s and artists like Jenny Holzer and Louise Bourgeois than the fashion world. The austere clothes he designed conveyed a message of icy superiority to match his behavior and mystique.

"He loves fashion, and in a weird way he loves that world, but he's not the most social person on the earth," said Kate Betts, the editor of the Style & Design supplements of Time magazine. "I don't think he cares for that part of fashion."

When Mr. Lang showed his first collection in Paris in 1986, his spare structured designs ushered in a new wave of minimalism, which made him an instant star. His influence only grew after he moved to New York in 1998 and announced he would show his collection in early September, ahead of the European runway shows and those of American designers, who had traditionally followed Milan and Paris.

Almost immediately other American designers followed, and New York Fashion Week was moved up six weeks.

Four years later, when Mr. Lang decamped from the New York shows to return to showing in Paris, he left a creative void. But his influence was already waning as a new establishment of talent came to the fore in Paris, designers like Alber Elbaz, Nicolas Ghesquiere and Olivier Theyskens.

Today, after so many high-profile departures by fashion designers - Ms. Sander, Tom Ford, even Wolfgang Joop - retailers and consumers seem to have grown weary. There is not much evidence of mourning over Mr. Lang's disappearance from the business. There seems to be no run on his white rope dresses and seersucker jackets currently in stores, the last Helmut Lang collection designed by Mr. Lang.

"The general consensus on the floor with the staff and customers is that they are not buying frantically Helmut's things, but just want to know what he is doing," said Julie Gilhart, the fashion director of Barneys New York. "We're being trained that these kinds of shifting around of designers just sort of happens."

Because Mr. Lang cultivated the image of a fashion designer whose success was based on appearing to be above fashion some of his admirers believe his place in fashion history will be similar to that of a rock star, more of a legend than a failure.

"Helmut made me think that to be a fashion designer was the worst thing in the world," said Ms. Semotan, the photographer. She described him as an attentive friend whose public persona of chilliness has little to do with the real man. When Ms. Semotan's husband, Kurt Kocherscheidt, an artist, died of a heart attack, Mr. Lang became a father figure to their young son, and he helped Ms. Semotan regain her confidence, casting her in his runway shows along with an assortment of characters of unconventional beauty.

She said she was not surprised when Mr. Lang, whom she described as more serious since he sold to Prada, said he would quit.

"When I looked at him working like that, it was really tiring," she said. "I knew he loved his work, that he would go on doing it, but at the same time I knew he did not want to sacrifice himself completely. He did not want to be owned by the fashion world."
 
thank you for posting that article. i've never read it and it's very insightful into the workings of the helmut lang brand as the world transitioned from one fashion epoch to the next. one of the most compelling facts mentioned in the article came in the admission that "another reason for the decline in sales was Prada's cancellation of a license to an outside company to make Helmut Lang jeans, which were responsible for more than half of the brand's revenues." while designers like helmut lang and hedi slimane laid groundwork in this arena, no modern day designer can overlook this mass market aspect to their business. yes, brands can flirt with "it" bags and "it" shoes, but there exist brands cognizant of the power of having a regular stream of income from fashionable basics. in that way, again, i draw corollaries between brands like helmut lang and dior homme and brands like alexander wang. while we can agree to disagree all day about the bonafides of the artistic core of this designer, he appeals to that same new york crowd that kept helmut lang afloat for the time it did. and while today it isn't designer denim so much as funky t-shirt inspired mini-dresses and separates, the spirit is exactly the same. he's charted a similar course with eyes wide open about the type of business he wants to build. there will never be another helmut lang. but there will be those, like alexander wang, who will occupy the space he once did in the market. and this collection spoke to that openly and honestly.
 
I have the utmost respect for him as a designer given what he has created in the past, but as much as I hate to say it, this season's collection didn't do much for me. I know a lot of designers are feeling the pinch of the economy and it has to somehow influence their creativity if they are worried about maintaining sales in a tricky environment, so I hope this is a temporary influence and not a new (commercial) direction he is heading towards. Ditto for Rodarte, but that's a different thread!
 
does anyone know where i can download the runway soundtrack?
 
While I agree that everyone rather supports a humble rags-to-riches- success story, I don't think it would be fair to put a blame on him for the fortunate fact that he was born into the money. Susan Dell has had it and I didn't mind it when she was establishing Phi. Then again, that operation didn't take off with as much hype as Alexander Wang did, partially due to the decidedly high pricing and much more sophisticated point of view, which made their aesthetic more niche than Alexander Wang, who's goal seems to reach for a much larger audience anyway. It's maybe been a refreshing sight to see especially a very young designer with such a decidedly realistic, business-savvy point of view surfacing during a recession period when everyone else seemed to be doing rather poorly, but it also makes him lack a certain depth in artistry and sense of purpose as per why he designs the way he does.

Nonetheless, I find the similarities that have been drawn with people like Helmut Lang to be quite absurd. While you cannot deny that the business behind Alexander Wang is doing strong and there has been a awareness of his style established in such a short time, one must admit there is more depth in attitude and design integrity with people like Helmut, with Margiela or Ann Demeulemeester involved, which their customers understand and that ultimately made them faithful for much longer then when their collections were enjoying a certain momentum in the 90ies. Alexander Wang's design relies too much on the overall styling impact for the design of the separate pieces to have any recognizable signatures such as the way Hedi Slimane would cut a shirt/jacket collar, a Rick Owens jacket would have the front zip running asymmetrically up or the way a McQueen dress is fitted on the body. You simply wouldn't find someone like Zazie, who has made a very insightful post on the Theyskens' Theory thread, make such a sharp observation on the cutting of an Alexander Wang garment.

A sensitive customer surely wishes to establish a certain kind of understanding with the aesthetic universe a designer is projecting for him or her to become empathic with the design... and whereas people like Olivier Theyskens have previously faced difficulties to make their clothes accessible to a wider public, his overall aesthetic was accessible and appreciated to a wider public.

My comparison to Lang is only in style and not substance. Not that he carries his spirit, but that he is doing miserable and shameful copies. Considering he has done direct knock offs of Issey Miyake and Vivienne Westwood, it would not surprise me if he had some of Lang's pieces on his pattern table with rub offs taken from them. Clearly Wang is pining for a Helmut Lang sensibility (or rather his hired creative consultant is). And of course he is executing it rather poorly. Please do not think I was ever suggesting they are equals.

As for Wang's business, it was crafted and strategized from the very beginning, more so than any small designer I can think of, backed with his parent's deep pockets. There is nothing inherently wrong with this, but it makes it all the more confounding when you see what derivative clothes and poor quality come from it. As you mentioned with Phi, she knew well enough to hire a talented design team to make an innovative product. I cannot say the same for Wang.
 
does anyone have hq backstage photos of the models' close ups from the show? i just want to see them in "no makeup" especially freja.
 
I like this collection but most of all I think he's a brilliant businessman.
 

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