How do I start my own magazine?
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Bette (or anyone else with a comment) - noticed you're in LA. I've been in NY for over a decade now, but play around with the idea of moving to LA... are you able to find good models/stylists/photographers out there or do you end up having to fly elsewhere or get your team on a plane over to you?
Some context, I'm discussing teaming up with some folks to develop a magazine, and office space etc is so expensive here we're considering other locations...
thank you
Some context, I'm discussing teaming up with some folks to develop a magazine, and office space etc is so expensive here we're considering other locations...
thank you
BetteT
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I am a stylist ... so I don't have a team ... I'm part of someone else's team, for the most part.
However, there is a lot of talent here and not enough paying work ... so if you are paying (most magazines don't or at least don't pay our real rates) ... you'll have a lot to choose from. However ... we don't work with top fashion photographers ... they are all pretty much in NY ... and so are their teams. Most of us end up doing commercial stuff ... catalogs, advertising, lookbooks, etc.
However, there is a lot of talent here and not enough paying work ... so if you are paying (most magazines don't or at least don't pay our real rates) ... you'll have a lot to choose from. However ... we don't work with top fashion photographers ... they are all pretty much in NY ... and so are their teams. Most of us end up doing commercial stuff ... catalogs, advertising, lookbooks, etc.
So if we book the girl a hotel and give her $50 for gas will that cover the expenses?
We're in a very small market and I'm looking for TWO girls with a specific look (high fashion look) for our magazine cover, and I'm getting frusterated because the magazine owner doesn't want to pay for girls to come from LA (which is 1.5 hours away). All of the girls here are cheesy commercial "pretty" or overprocessed blonde types. If it only costs us $100-$200 I would think it would be worth it...
We're in a very small market and I'm looking for TWO girls with a specific look (high fashion look) for our magazine cover, and I'm getting frusterated because the magazine owner doesn't want to pay for girls to come from LA (which is 1.5 hours away). All of the girls here are cheesy commercial "pretty" or overprocessed blonde types. If it only costs us $100-$200 I would think it would be worth it...
I think it would depend on the girls and the agencies, but considering it is a cover try, that is very good exposure for a model, so if you are covering their basic expenses like that and make a fuss over them with a great team, snacks and good times on set, I don't see it being a negative experience for them at all in the end. Good luck!
BetteT
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I've worked on several photoshoots (for small niche magazines, not their first issue, because the agencies want to see the magaine in production and also need to see the quality of the photogtrapher's work, before they release models for shoots like this), where the models were unpaid, and they had to travel up to 2 hours each way to the location (often, way out in the desert, at the beach or in the mountains) and they were able to get them from L.A. agencies ... without paying expenses.
But, usually the crew and models meet in a central place and caravaned to the location which was way out there. So some of the transportation was provided for the models ... they just had to drive to the central meeting place. Photographers, Stylists, and Makeup artists usually have at least a good sized SUV or a van because they all carry their own equipment. They will usually transport a model or two, if needed.
And lunch and snacks must be provided and lots of water ... that's a given on any shoot ... for the entire crew. It's all brought out to the location, usually by whoever is in charge of the shoot. Even if it's in a studio ... food and water must be provided ... or you will loose your crew and get less done, because they'll stop and go for lunch somewhere ... and will still expect the magazine to pay.
I've found that the models will drive a long way, if their agency wants them to get the pictures and the credits. So it comes down to quality of the photographer's work, the quality and circulation of the magazine.
Magazine shoots are not known for paying much, if anything ... so agencies are used to this. Editorial shoots are an investment in her marketing matierials.
So the criteria is not pay ... its the following: will this shoot help their portfolio, will the shots be astounding and something that will work for her market, will the tear sheet (or cover) be worth her time, is the publication a quality one, how well known is the magazine? All you have to do is to proove to the agent that this is going to be great so they want to have their girls on that cover and you will be able to select from some decent fashion girls and they will find a way to get where you need them.
Plus ... just because an agency is in L.A. ... it doesn't mean their girls all live in L.A. You will find girls from Redlands, San Diego, Santa Barbara. If they are newer models and not well known, then already have been told that they will have to drive to where the shoots are and where the clients need them to be and that is one of the costs of doing business. (Models actually are self employed, their agencies work for them.) Anything within a couple hours drive from the agency can be considered "local", in my experience... and an overnight stay would not be warranted for models, who don't have to set up and prep in advance. You should be able to get a cover shoot and up to about 4 pages of editorial shots done within 8 hours ... maybe faster if it's planned out carefully in advance.
But, usually the crew and models meet in a central place and caravaned to the location which was way out there. So some of the transportation was provided for the models ... they just had to drive to the central meeting place. Photographers, Stylists, and Makeup artists usually have at least a good sized SUV or a van because they all carry their own equipment. They will usually transport a model or two, if needed.
And lunch and snacks must be provided and lots of water ... that's a given on any shoot ... for the entire crew. It's all brought out to the location, usually by whoever is in charge of the shoot. Even if it's in a studio ... food and water must be provided ... or you will loose your crew and get less done, because they'll stop and go for lunch somewhere ... and will still expect the magazine to pay.
I've found that the models will drive a long way, if their agency wants them to get the pictures and the credits. So it comes down to quality of the photographer's work, the quality and circulation of the magazine.
Magazine shoots are not known for paying much, if anything ... so agencies are used to this. Editorial shoots are an investment in her marketing matierials.
So the criteria is not pay ... its the following: will this shoot help their portfolio, will the shots be astounding and something that will work for her market, will the tear sheet (or cover) be worth her time, is the publication a quality one, how well known is the magazine? All you have to do is to proove to the agent that this is going to be great so they want to have their girls on that cover and you will be able to select from some decent fashion girls and they will find a way to get where you need them.
Plus ... just because an agency is in L.A. ... it doesn't mean their girls all live in L.A. You will find girls from Redlands, San Diego, Santa Barbara. If they are newer models and not well known, then already have been told that they will have to drive to where the shoots are and where the clients need them to be and that is one of the costs of doing business. (Models actually are self employed, their agencies work for them.) Anything within a couple hours drive from the agency can be considered "local", in my experience... and an overnight stay would not be warranted for models, who don't have to set up and prep in advance. You should be able to get a cover shoot and up to about 4 pages of editorial shots done within 8 hours ... maybe faster if it's planned out carefully in advance.
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^Thanks guys for your input, very enlightening as always! I'm still really intimidated by the LA agencies though lol, espcially since we're not even in SD or SB....we're in bakers field :s and our town does not have a good rep in general.
"You should be able to get a cover shoot and up to about 4 pages of editorial shots done within 8 hours"
Okay, good to know, because I was going to try and get the whole thing done in one day lol.
"You should be able to get a cover shoot and up to about 4 pages of editorial shots done within 8 hours"
Okay, good to know, because I was going to try and get the whole thing done in one day lol.
imagensfashions
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This thread is amazing!! I learn so many great things here, who helped grow my knowledge!! Thanks everyone!!
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If you ask a photographer (or anyone, at that matter) to contribute to your magazine, is it generally expected that the photoshoot will absolutely be published in the magazine? Or is it understood that it's still up to the editor to make the final decision?
BetteT
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It depends on how you arrange it.
If you ask for "submissions" then there is no guarantee. That means that any photographer is welcome to send in editorials that are already completed and you will pick only those that interest you. But that also ties the hands of the photographer somewhat, because he probably won't be able to get good clothes/fashions for the shoot and may not get good agency models either, because he doesn't have a guarantee that you will even use his editorial at all.
However if you "commission" a photographer ... you pretty much guarantee you'll run something for that particular photograher in a particular issue. You, as editor, will still get to pick the shots that will be used and order specific photoshopping. You will also provide the photographer with a "pull letter" in advance which states that you will credit the designer if shots of their clothes are used and that you will be financially responsible for any loss or damage. Then the stylist can shop around and see which designers would be interested in lending clothes for your magazine's editorial. She'll be able to get something on loan ... probably from several designers.
If you ask for "submissions" then there is no guarantee. That means that any photographer is welcome to send in editorials that are already completed and you will pick only those that interest you. But that also ties the hands of the photographer somewhat, because he probably won't be able to get good clothes/fashions for the shoot and may not get good agency models either, because he doesn't have a guarantee that you will even use his editorial at all.
However if you "commission" a photographer ... you pretty much guarantee you'll run something for that particular photograher in a particular issue. You, as editor, will still get to pick the shots that will be used and order specific photoshopping. You will also provide the photographer with a "pull letter" in advance which states that you will credit the designer if shots of their clothes are used and that you will be financially responsible for any loss or damage. Then the stylist can shop around and see which designers would be interested in lending clothes for your magazine's editorial. She'll be able to get something on loan ... probably from several designers.
^Oh ok, so that's all that a commission means, giving them a pull letter for clothes? I thought it meant the magazine would cover expenses as well.
Our situation is kind of weird, because we're shooting our own editorials and beauty stories, but the owner/editor told me she won't publish the shoots if she doesn't like it. And she rejected the last shoot we did, yet she won't tell me what it is she wants, beyond which models to use, or even show me an example or come to the shoot. Is this normal?? I can see her side, but I also don't feel comfortable asking people to work with us when everything seems so up in the air -- especially since these are people I work with on my own tests.
Our situation is kind of weird, because we're shooting our own editorials and beauty stories, but the owner/editor told me she won't publish the shoots if she doesn't like it. And she rejected the last shoot we did, yet she won't tell me what it is she wants, beyond which models to use, or even show me an example or come to the shoot. Is this normal?? I can see her side, but I also don't feel comfortable asking people to work with us when everything seems so up in the air -- especially since these are people I work with on my own tests.
Hey, this isn't really normal, it actually sounds pretty unreasonable.
If you are putting the whole thing together and asking favours of your team with only the hope that it will be published, the least the editor can do is give you a mood-board or some kind of instruction of the visuals he/she likes- soft, moody, strong, dynamic, textured, clean... you aren't a mind-reader or a work-horse!
Of course you are in a position where you want to have your work published and I don't know the full situation but in these circumstances what usually happens is there is a pitch and a collaborative discussion between the editor or director and the team working on the story.
Maybe just ask for a simple mood-board, or even send him/her a mood-board of your own that you have for the story you want to create, and see where that gets you?
Good luck
PS your mood-board could be as simple as three or four inspiration pics that give a good idea of the lighting, style or mood of what you want to shoot (ie if it is studio or outdoors, natural or stylized, etc)
If you are putting the whole thing together and asking favours of your team with only the hope that it will be published, the least the editor can do is give you a mood-board or some kind of instruction of the visuals he/she likes- soft, moody, strong, dynamic, textured, clean... you aren't a mind-reader or a work-horse!
Of course you are in a position where you want to have your work published and I don't know the full situation but in these circumstances what usually happens is there is a pitch and a collaborative discussion between the editor or director and the team working on the story.
Maybe just ask for a simple mood-board, or even send him/her a mood-board of your own that you have for the story you want to create, and see where that gets you?
Good luck
PS your mood-board could be as simple as three or four inspiration pics that give a good idea of the lighting, style or mood of what you want to shoot (ie if it is studio or outdoors, natural or stylized, etc)
BetteT
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Good idea ... she will probably want to see your ideas before you shoot them. Would certainly save your team a lot of time ... I don't see why she would not respond to that.
But also ... consider the published editorials in her magazine as her mood board ... so you can get an idea about what she likes. Each magazine has a look and a style that you can disect.
If you look at any Vogue editiorial and any Nylon editorial ... you will notice a vast difference between them. Vogue is often high end couture clothes, runway models, with fancy studio shots or exotic location shots, lot's of fancy lighting ... making the models look beautiful and rich. Whereas Nylon uses younger looking, edgy models, funky, weird combinations of clothes, and the locations are more akin to street scenes, run down apartments, garages, alleys, the lighting is often only one sharp point with deep shadows ... it all speaks to countercoulture, rebellion, rock 'n roll and youth.
So analyze her "style" for her magazine and try to emulate that.
But also ... consider the published editorials in her magazine as her mood board ... so you can get an idea about what she likes. Each magazine has a look and a style that you can disect.
If you look at any Vogue editiorial and any Nylon editorial ... you will notice a vast difference between them. Vogue is often high end couture clothes, runway models, with fancy studio shots or exotic location shots, lot's of fancy lighting ... making the models look beautiful and rich. Whereas Nylon uses younger looking, edgy models, funky, weird combinations of clothes, and the locations are more akin to street scenes, run down apartments, garages, alleys, the lighting is often only one sharp point with deep shadows ... it all speaks to countercoulture, rebellion, rock 'n roll and youth.
So analyze her "style" for her magazine and try to emulate that.
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BetteT
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That's not all "commisioned" means .. it can certainly mean they are covering expseses (or not) or paying the crew (or not). But if you are commissioned to do a shoot, that means that she basically has hired your team to do a specific shoot for a specific edition ... under contract. So, they are willing, at that point, to issue a pull letter.
You are just submitting stories ... and that is a long shot, when you do that ... as I see you have already found out. Magazines that accept submissions accept them from everybody (usually) so they don't take time to explain what they want. They just use the best that come in ... so it's a competition between all the teams that are submitting.
@Fiancee I work for the magazine; I'm their "fashion director" (I put together all the content but the owner has the final say on everything). That's what I'll probably do is create a mood board or just show her example pictures of what I'm planning, but last time I showed examples and explained what I was doing, yet no one expressed problems they had with the model/etc., until after the shoot was already done.
@BetteT This is our very first issue, and none of us really have any experience at it, and I'm the only one who has taken time to research -- for example, I had to explain what a masthead is, and the difference between advertisements and editorial content. And generally when I explain how things work (mostly what I've learned here) they don't believe me and want to try to cut corners, like asking designers to pay shipping for gowns both ways.
She has shown me what magazines she likes though, so I do have that detail to work off of.
Oh and for this project I'm not submitting to the magazine, I'm on staff. I am planning to submit to magazines on my own time though, which is why I asked about commissioning
But, say if I do get a pull slip from a magazine, do they normally cover any shipping costs involved with getting garments in?
Thanks for both of your help and input, as always!
@BetteT This is our very first issue, and none of us really have any experience at it, and I'm the only one who has taken time to research -- for example, I had to explain what a masthead is, and the difference between advertisements and editorial content. And generally when I explain how things work (mostly what I've learned here) they don't believe me and want to try to cut corners, like asking designers to pay shipping for gowns both ways.
She has shown me what magazines she likes though, so I do have that detail to work off of.
Oh and for this project I'm not submitting to the magazine, I'm on staff. I am planning to submit to magazines on my own time though, which is why I asked about commissioning
But, say if I do get a pull slip from a magazine, do they normally cover any shipping costs involved with getting garments in?Thanks for both of your help and input, as always!
Oh OK now I see better the situation. I think it is a sign of the owner not really knowing what she wants or lacking a bit of experience (which is normal if you are all starting out) but it's not really fair to you. It's pretty frustrating actually!
As BetteT said, a good way to get an idea of what she likes is to see previous issues of her magazine, but if this is a first issue it makes it hard. I really do recommend mood-boards! Even if it is a Tumblr, which is what I've used in the past, or now there is http://pinterest.com/ which is like a virtual pin-board.
Communicating direction and ideas ahead of time is really the best way to avoid bumps in the road later on. Maybe having her on-set is good too, to ensure that if she sees something she doesnt like she can step in right away and get rid of it, rather than waiting til it is all finished and chopping the entire series.
As for shipping costs, in my experience it is split, the designer or rep for the brand will pay to have it sent to you, and the stylist or fashion director will arrange for it to be sent back (retain your receipts and claim these from the owner). The basic costs should always fall on the owner, it is her operation and ultimately if this magazine makes it big and she is raking in money, you can be sure it is going to her pocket first. That's the good and bad part of being an owner
Hope this helps
Side note- if your budget is tight (and it's a first issue so I'm guessing it is!) then consider trying to borrow garments as locally as possible. Shipping is expensive! If you can pick up and drop off what you borrow easily you are saving yourself lots of money in the long-run!
As BetteT said, a good way to get an idea of what she likes is to see previous issues of her magazine, but if this is a first issue it makes it hard. I really do recommend mood-boards! Even if it is a Tumblr, which is what I've used in the past, or now there is http://pinterest.com/ which is like a virtual pin-board.
Communicating direction and ideas ahead of time is really the best way to avoid bumps in the road later on. Maybe having her on-set is good too, to ensure that if she sees something she doesnt like she can step in right away and get rid of it, rather than waiting til it is all finished and chopping the entire series.
As for shipping costs, in my experience it is split, the designer or rep for the brand will pay to have it sent to you, and the stylist or fashion director will arrange for it to be sent back (retain your receipts and claim these from the owner). The basic costs should always fall on the owner, it is her operation and ultimately if this magazine makes it big and she is raking in money, you can be sure it is going to her pocket first. That's the good and bad part of being an owner
Hope this helps
Side note- if your budget is tight (and it's a first issue so I'm guessing it is!) then consider trying to borrow garments as locally as possible. Shipping is expensive! If you can pick up and drop off what you borrow easily you are saving yourself lots of money in the long-run!
BetteT
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Ah ... as a staff member ... she definitely should be colaborating with you and the photographer in advance so that you both have direction about what she wants to do and what she expects from both of you. But, as a staffer, it's your job to figure it out too ... and deliver what she wants. If you are not on the same page then it won't work.
It's very frustrating! Because they want me to produce this ultra luxury publication for them on a budget of $0.
@Fiancee - borrowing locally is what we're planning to do for the most part, but again it's tough because of the market we're in. There are only two main bridal stores and none of the big names are here, plus all the photographers locally borrow the same dresses all the time from these shops for their promos etc.
You guys both have great input, as always, thank you!
@Fiancee - borrowing locally is what we're planning to do for the most part, but again it's tough because of the market we're in. There are only two main bridal stores and none of the big names are here, plus all the photographers locally borrow the same dresses all the time from these shops for their promos etc.
You guys both have great input, as always, thank you!
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