Madonna scolds America

[chachacha]

^I'm not a fan of Madonna at all, I think she talks a lot of hypocritical shite, but if I forget it's her who made this point, I totally agree with it.

what a ridiculous thing to say.

 

[roppal222]

^ It's ironic humour darling, don't worry yourself about it.....

 

[VainJane]

I can't believe people are still so niave to take Bush's word for everything and not read between the lines.

The same can be said for the American media....I heard somewhere that an independent study was done on the media and it found that the majority of major news organizations (i.e. NY Times, CNN, etc.) and minor ones lean heavily to one political side. I'm sure we can all guess which side that is

Just saying, to anyone reading the newspaper....you gotta take what you read with a grain of salt

 

[Deleted member 49693]

Doing what? Parading around using their bodies for power?? Is that what she wants coz that is what she is!!!

 

[Jane Loves Marc]

how'd ophrah get into all this?

 

[mellowdrama]

how'd ophrah get into all this?

So Madonna, Oprah, and Hillary Clinton walk into a bar, bartender says, "What'll you have?"

They want it all, you know.

 

[Hipkitten]

So Madonna, Oprah, and Hillary Clinton walk into a bar, bartender says, "What'll you have?"

They want it all, you know.

Sexist rhetoric...

 

[mellowdrama]

Sexist rhetoric...

...Since when does a "three (guys; a jew, a catholic, and a protestant; an Irishman, a Frenchman, and a duck, etc.) walk into a bar" joke qualify as "rhetoric"? That's like me posting a little pukey-face sick and calling it a "dialectic".

Madonna, she says some smart things, this ain't one of them. Hillary Clinton gives me the creeps. Oprah, by far, has done so much important work in healing issues and self-esteem for so many people. I wouldn't vote any of these people, women, yes--but people, first--into a politcal office.

 

[mellowdrama]

Now, this is rhetoric.

Madonna believes in a quasi-magical "religion" called the Kabbalah, which is basically "How to be a rich control freak" and call that Happiness. I utterly defend her right to be a rich control freak and call that both her religion and her Happiness. Kabbalah is dancing with surrender, but still pretending you hold the reins. Your Chokmah, Binah, and Tiphareth will not keep your *** from falling off more horses, metaphorical or otherwise, dear. Surrender, now, please.

Oprah is on much the same trip, and you can tell if you've read the magazine or seen the show. What self-comforting, watered-down, Chronicle Book plastic Buddha shite can she sell us next? I grant that self-esteem is important, but it only carries you so far. The James Frey book thing is an embarrassment, and that was all about film rights for friends, money, and movie plugs. Our alcoholism, cancer, recovery, tragic reversals, and outrageous fortune translate as big bucks for the Harpo enterprise. And great wealth equals perfectly controlled world equals Happiness. In her defense, Oprah does give back, big time. AND: I utterly defend her right to trip on people's misery and sell it back to them as inspiration. Big, estrogen tears for us all. But buying the Feng Shui soap set, reading Leo Buscaglia books, it isn't gonna save your ***. Surrender, now, please.

Hillary Clinton believes that through some monumental public-policy force, everyone will be equal, happy, well-fed, content, peace-on-earth, forever and ever, amen. She believes you can Legislate Happiness. I utterly defend her right to believe she can legislate happiness, but as a politician she gets the short end of the stick: people who vote for you tend to blame you more for their unhappiness, moreso than they would Madonna for her last album, or Oprah for her book club. Seeing Hillary's whole "run like a plantation, and you know what I mean" performance just shows me how far she's willing to go to push her "Pie in the Sky: Now Here on Earth" nonsense to anyone she can sell it to.

Male or female, entertainer, politician, celebrity: giving them power will not bring you happiness. "Having it all" will not bring you happiness. Being in absolute control, meditation on the path from Yod to Malkuth, will not bring you happiness; a new senate bill will not save your soul. Changing your face, gender, religion, locale, career, political affiliation, girl scout troop, etecetera is not the way to peace of mind. If you really believe that banding together with others based on your common genitalia, or skin color, or religious beliefs, or favorite fashion designer really amounts to much when you're finally meeting your maker, falling off that Big Horse, well, whatever gets you through it, I guess. But I'm not signing on, sorry.

And now, for another little pukey-face, which says so much & would've eliminated the need for Aristotle, if they'd only had it in his day: .

Adieu.

 

[Deleted member 49693]

^ Her religion kinda reminds me of that Eddie Murphy movie. "Bark like a dog." "woof woof woof woof!"

 

[mellowdrama]

^ Her religion kinda reminds me of that Eddie Murphy movie. "Bark like a dog." "woof woof woof woof!"

No, really, you can have it all, but like Steven Wright said, "but where would you put it?" I don't doubt Kabbalah works. Can't really criticize the desire to be happy, whatever your material/socioeconomic means. However, I prefer my old testament/Torah lessons more like the Book of Job: Surrender, even when your covered in sores sitting in a dungheap. Don't need to visualize the dungheap as something it's not. No need to enlighten or transform anything. Abide with it.

But Madonna's path, very clearly, is not my path, so I don't want to knock her or it too harshly. We all deserve happiness. What it takes for some people to be happy, though, might differ from others.

As for this so-called Kabbalah, It's just the knowing-what's-best -for-everyone, this is "Happiness" that's gets to me, and all the merchandising of little t*t-bits that comes with it. Like, "you could have more and be happier", when I'm quite content, enormously grateful, and happy with the meager existence I eke out. "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."--this from the book of Hebrews. This is something to live by. And you don't have to purchase some magic chit, or endorse a candidate, or have 100% positive self-esteem to get there. Happy on a dungheap without my soulmate, I abide.

Here's some idea what "Kabbalah" has become:
From www.nightingale.com:


[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]About The 72 Names of God[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Thousands of years ago, an astonishing gift was delivered to humankind: the tools to control and transform very specific life challenges. These tools came in the form of 72 individual combinations of an ancient group of sacred letters.

Because of their Divine source and the superhuman power contained in them, these three-letter combinations came to be known as the Names of God.

But these aren't "names" in the ordinary, earthly sense of the term. They're actually energy fields, visual mantras that are activated spiritually rather than vocally. In other words, you don't have to know how to pronounce them. And you don't need to understand exactly how or why they work.

All you have to do is look at them. Incredibly, mysteriously, in that simple act, enormous power is unleashed.

In The 72 Names of God: Technology for the Soul, you'll discover all 72 of these ancient and amazingly potent Names, and the unique practical purpose of each one. You'll also learn precisely how to read them - thereby empowering yourself to consciously control their power and direct it toward the issues in your life that cry out for transformation, improvement, or Divine intervention.

In The 72 Names of God, you'll find a remedy for just about every challenge that's likely to come up in the course of a lifetime. Simply by properly meditating on the appropriate Name, you will be able to:
[/FONT]

• [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
  [*]Bring more money into your life whenever you need it.
  [*]Ignite sexual energy and passion unlike anything you've experienced before.
  [*]Eliminate guilt forever and undo the damage it has caused you.
  [*]Recharge physical energy and heal illnesses - your own, and others'.
  [*]Radiate beauty to everyone who sees you.
  [*]Stop attracting the wrong people into your life.
  [*]Meet your true soul mate.
  [*]And so much more![/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
All in all, you'll discover dozens of specific spiritual tools - 72 of them, to be exact! - that will enable you to confront and defeat every conceivable obstacle to your happiness and bring into being all the specific things you want and need in life.

The 72 Names are a part of the ancient spiritual tradition known as Kabbalah. For thousands of years, the wisdom of Kabbalah was considered far too powerful for "ordinary" people. It was known and studied by only a few select scholars, theologians, and great thinkers, such as Plato, Shakespeare, and Isaac Newton.

But thanks to a widespread resurgence of interest in Kabbalah in the 20th century and the dedication of a new generation of Kabbalistic instructors, the remarkable wisdom, sacred truths, and powerful insights of this tradition are becoming accessible to everyone.

Once you have The 72 Names of God, you will possess the keys to an amazing God-given power: the power to proactively confront and rapidly transform almost any circumstance in your life: physical, emotional, material, and spiritual. This is truly technology for the soul - amazing spiritual power that no one is meant to live without![/FONT]

 

[Madhuri]

He seems much more kind hearted and less full of himself. I used to love Oprah but in recent years EVERYTHING IS ABOUT HER. She used to let her guests talk and would ask insightful questions, and empathize with them in a genuine way, because you knew where she was coming from.

Oprah is doing more single-handly to help the poor and disenfranchised in the U.S. and abroad than any other celebrity-- that includes Brangelina. Do a google search to see the extent of her efforts and how she has used her own money and organized her viewers to raise funds for a number of causes affecting the poor. What exactly has Ryan Seacrest done?

 

[mellowdrama]

Maybe we should make an Oprah thread!

Oprah does good works, indeed. I think we need an Oprah thread. Wouldn't know where to put it, is it gossip, really? Some righteous female with power can merge this elswhere, I'm sure. Here's fuel for the fire. Up with people!



Upcoming Shows from the www2.oprah.com site:
Has A p*rn ADDICTION Affected You or Your Family?
YOUNG WOMEN: were you a BAD INFLUENCE on GIRLS?
Are You a Woman Who Objectified Herself?
Is your DAUGHTER trying to be like YOUNG HOLLYWOOD
Is Your Teen DAUGHTER ADDICTED TO RAP videos?
Does Your Teen Want To Be Hollywood Fabulous?
Is Your Teen Daughter Desperate to be Popular?
Chicagoland ONLY: Mothers with Teen Daughters
Is your TEENAGE DAUGHTER SHOPPING too much?
Does your TEEN DAUGHTER dress TOO SEXY?
ATTN: Teen Girls 14 & Up
What do you think of PINK's "STUPID GIRLS" video?
Do You Have A Confession?
Let Yourself Go - What's Missing In My Life?
MOTHERS: Does your daughter have LOW SELF-ESTEEM?
TEENS -Are you unhappy with your looks?
MOMS: Are you PASSING ON your LOW SELF-ESTEEM?
MOMS: Do you wish your TEEN would LOSE WEIGHT?
PROUD Moments: What have you done to help someone?
Does Social Class Matter in Your Country?
Are You a Woman who Puts Herself LAST?
Did You See Our Show Have You Let Yourself Go?

 

[Hipkitten]

...Since when does a "three (guys; a jew, a catholic, and a protestant; an Irishman, a Frenchman, and a duck, etc.) walk into a bar" joke qualify as "rhetoric"? That's like me posting a little pukey-face sick and calling it a "dialectic".

Madonna, she says some smart things, this ain't one of them. Hillary Clinton gives me the creeps. Oprah, by far, has done so much important work in healing issues and self-esteem for so many people. I wouldn't vote any of these people, women, yes--but people, first--into a politcal office.

Nice straw man, but you missed my point entirely. First, I do not take issue with the format of the "joke." I take issue with the punch line: They want it all, you know. Often in our society, powerful and/or successful women are depicted as selfish b*tches who just don't know their place (i.e. women who "want it all.") Powerful men are just that - powerful. Powerful women on the other hand just "want it all." Second, this has nothing to do with Madonna or her chosen religion. It's about women being underrepresented in our government. Period. Lastly, I don't think anyone said that putting women in charge would solve the world's problems. However, I'm of the opinion that the government should represent the people - and the majority of Americans aren't rich old white men.

 

[Fashion_diva]

The same can be said for the American media....I heard somewhere that an independent study was done on the media and it found that the majority of major news organizations (i.e. NY Times, CNN, etc.) and minor ones lean heavily to one political side. I'm sure we can all guess which side that is

Just saying, to anyone reading the newspaper....you gotta take what you read with a grain of salt

if you are going to listen to the media as your main source of info then u are an idiot!!!!

THE MEDIA IS ALWAYS BIASED!!

Most reporters are democrates. I live in canada and I took a US Politics (my teacher was american) and showed us a poll ....

Of people who watch news channels and the accuracy of each persons knowledge depending on the channel they watch....

well it will come to no shock that the worst informed people were people who watched only FOX NEWS - a total joke.... and PBS or something was the best....

 

[Fashion_diva]

and if we are going to talk about a change in US Presidents.... I can name a few things...

1. A female.

2. downgrading to religious aspect of getting elected.... come on do you really think a president should be elected on the basis of his religious belief. Should every president be Presbyterian? What about Catholics, Jews etc. Or what about people that just dont believe, but have strong values? And that is not a small percentage many people do not go to church anymore.

However, I would not base my vote only on these things. People should vote for the most competent leader... the BEST!!! The most skills, etc. This is the most important thing... Gender, religion, sexuality, race etc should not be the deciding vote.

Just what I believe.

 

[mellowdrama]

Nice straw man, but you missed my point entirely. First, I do not take issue with the format of the "joke." I take issue with the punch line: They want it all, you know. Often in our society, powerful and/or successful women are depicted as selfish b*tches who just don't know their place (i.e. women who "want it all.") Powerful men are just that - powerful. Powerful women on the other hand just "want it all." Second, this has nothing to do with Madonna or her chosen religion. It's about women being underrepresented in our government. Period. Lastly, I don't think anyone said that putting women in charge would solve the world's problems. However, I'm of the opinion that the government should represent the people - and the majority of Americans aren't rich old white men.

I never said women who want it all are "selfish b*tches who just don't know their place." Those are your words, not mine. Also, the title of this thread is "Madonna disses America", so it is about Madonna, or the image of Madonna, or the stupid things Madonna says. I must insist, however, that Madonna, Hillary, and Oprah do convey the image of "wanting it all." I find no fault with that, and we're free to pursue our desires. I do have a problem with the commodification of dissatisfaction---wanting & having it all is ultimately neither desirable nor possible. Life has inherent limits, sacrifices, and dissatisfaction. You can suffer terrible losses in life, go through great trials, and not lose your essential happiness.

The game of "wanting it all" is the marketing of unfulfillable desires, of politicians promising you happiness, of Oprah asking "Have You Let Yourself Go?" (Yes, Oprah, I have.) It's about me envying you because you must have more than I do, because you are a powerful man, or you're rich and famous, or balance a fabulous career and loving family, when I have none of those attributes. It's saying you can't be happy if you're fat, or old, or divorced, or never known love, or have a chronic illness, or work a crappy job, or are in debt. It's living your life like you're always under someone's thumb. I'm most of these things, and I'm still happy. I've learned there are limits. Like that other Clinton, George, said, "Freedom is free of the need to be free. Free your mind and your *** will follow, the kingdom of heaven is within."

I won't go on Oprah, I won't look to Madonna, Kabbalah or Christ or Hillary for answers, I don't need them! I don't think that voting in a woman president is really going to amount to much difference in the status quo. There will be a woman president someday, I'm sure of it. There' s just no need for the hullaballoo.

I do not deny that women have not been given much opportunity to exercise obvious political power until recently. Think, we only won the right to vote in 1920! But complaining about the fact that we are under-represented will not change the level of representation. Axe-grinding and crying victim, like any slavery-consciousness, robs one of power. Who would vote for anyone with a laundry list of complaints about how they (or those sharing their gender) have been mistreated? "Give me power 'cos we women don't have any?" Oh, yeah, that's a good strategy.

Demonstrable competence, even-headedness, intelligence, education, erudition, listening skills, a sense of what's plausible, real, and fair--those are qualities that voters want in a candidate. When Madonna says something like "American men are afraid of women", and that's the reason there's no woman president, well, that's not very competent...plausible, real, or fair.

Madonna saying "American men are afraid of women" is like an old roommate of mine who once said to me, "You don't like me. I know it." I mean, what do you say to that? "Oh, yes, yes, yes I like you really I do"...apparently, it's not something you can respond to. It's someone tripping on you, and why play that? Just as any old white man wouldn't respond to charges of being the reason for all the greed and evil in the world.

Anyway, "be careful what you wish for, you may get it" as they say.

I hope I haven't created any more misunderstanding, because I can't keep writing these essays here. Cheers!