Daniel Lee - Designer, Creative Director of Burberry

[Thefrenchy]

Down 147%???????????!

 

[Frederic01]

The company posted a year-over-year loss of 74 million pounds for the period, down 147% from a profit of 158 million pounds for the same period last year. Retail revenue was down 21% for the period, and wholesale was down 30%.

source: fashiondive.com

This is not quite right.
Please see below for further reference.

Burberry might be doing slightly worse than last year, but it still generates more in revenue than Saint Laurent and Bottega Veneta for example.




burberryplc.com/investors/annual-report-23-24/

 

[tourbillions]

only asia probably see burberry as luxury and are willing to buy at the current prices. i wonder if those sales are still because of tisci era merch or lee's.

 

[vetements]

only asia probably see burberry as luxury and are willing to buy at the current prices. i wonder if those sales are still because of tisci era merch or lee's.

Not really, given the number of stores in Asia vs the rest.

side note, I was in the Burberry shop a couple of weeks ago, Lee`s designs are almost enirely on 70% off. Tisci`s are long gone. And ironically, the boring `staples` are all fixed prices.
Again, I stressed that Lee`s designs are not just well-designed, they are also properly made, a short sleeve linen shirt has zig zag sewing on the flip side of the collar (that you wont notice if you dont flip it around), I reckon it is so that it will be heavier and stay down, given its linen nature. I also saw a beautiful unisex cashmere poncho that feels luxe just by the touch.
But yes, they are all very highly priced, so with that mark downs now, it is just about right. And mostly made in Italy, unless the regular items.

I actually feel Lee put in more thoughts into Burberry than even BV, it could be that he feels more closer to home or a revenge from the way he was exited from BV we wont know.

He was just hired at the wrong time, by the wrong people. Wishing him all the best at his next job.

 

[PDFSD]

Omg I thought he already left The new campaign looks like the kind of movement corporate does when they are desperate and with no designer on board. I think it will happen very soon though.

Stocks hit the rock bottom in June (-54%) and since then it kept rising… so weird no? The drop in 1 year it’s only been 6%. I was expecting -30%.

Edit: the Ferragamo idea is great tbh. I can totally see it working.

what do we expect when Burberry Names Jonathan Kiman Chief Marketing Officer ex gucci ancora & versace gay as marketing officer

this is the result of markething ideas he was also part of the ancora switch and jumped ship end of last year to Burberry in September

Most recently he held the same role he’s taking up at Burberry, CMO. Prior to his last tenure at Gucci has was chief brand officer of Versace until 2020.

🤷‍♂️

 

[proseccotabis]

what do we expect when Burberry Names Jonathan Kiman Chief Marketing Officer ex gucci ancora & versace gay as marketing officer

this is the result of markething ideas he was also part of the ancora switch and jumped ship end of last year to Burberry in September

Most recently he held the same role he’s taking up at Burberry, CMO. Prior to his last tenure at Gucci has was chief brand officer of Versace until 2020.

🤷‍♂️

Off topic but who in their right mind would leave Versace for Burberry… both unstable but switching for Burberry is a bit nuts lol

 

[eugenius]

Jim Sander, my favourite fashion brand.

Jil Scissor...

 

[Creative]

Off topic but who in their right mind would leave Versace for Burberry… both unstable but switching for Burberry is a bit nuts lol

Burberry pays much more though. Italian brands are usually much cheaper when it comes to salaries, benefits and stuff, specially if they are not LVMH.

If they are independent… you can’t imagine. 10000 times worse.

 

[Creative]

what do we expect when Burberry Names Jonathan Kiman Chief Marketing Officer ex gucci ancora & versace gay as marketing officer

this is the result of markething ideas he was also part of the ancora switch and jumped ship end of last year to Burberry in September

Most recently he held the same role he’s taking up at Burberry, CMO. Prior to his last tenure at Gucci has was chief brand officer of Versace until 2020.

🤷‍♂️

Crazy! Thank you for letting us know. What are these CEOs thinking? I just don’t get a thing these days.

I for sure thought he was out because that campaign is 0 “designer”. It’s like pure corporate. Can’t get a thing about fashion these days.

 

[Creative]

Not really, given the number of stores in Asia vs the rest.

side note, I was in the Burberry shop a couple of weeks ago, Lee`s designs are almost enirely on 70% off. Tisci`s are long gone. And ironically, the boring `staples` are all fixed prices.
Again, I stressed that Lee`s designs are not just well-designed, they are also properly made, a short sleeve linen shirt has zig zag sewing on the flip side of the collar (that you wont notice if you dont flip it around), I reckon it is so that it will be heavier and stay down, given its linen nature. I also saw a beautiful unisex cashmere poncho that feels luxe just by the touch.
But yes, they are all very highly priced, so with that mark downs now, it is just about right. And mostly made in Italy, unless the regular items.

I actually feel Lee put in more thoughts into Burberry than even BV, it could be that he feels more closer to home or a revenge from the way he was exited from BV we wont know.

He was just hired at the wrong time, by the wrong people. Wishing him all the best at his next job.

Hmm, I think his collections for Burberry were quite blurry, non-directional, lacking emotion and fashion… prices were crazy for what it was, campaigns felt gloomy…

I didn’t like his tenure at all.

 

[PDFSD]

I liked when Marc at LV or even Tom at Gucci both had first shows that missed the mark, they completely got the assignment in the next shows and turned the faith of both brand around for the better and the rest is history.

CD´s forget that fashion is also about reacting to our times/feedback of the clients or fans etc.

Mr Lee was too stubborn when he still had the freedom to course direct the brand with more solid base of classic modern burberry with less jarring design & styling choices.

just too much over design and prints.

 

[Creative]

^Absolutely. I blame Burberry’s flop to Daniel 100%. He just didn’t have it there. All the creative decisions were wrong.

He could’ve done something much more chic, light, less pretentious… but he didn’t. His shows were hard to watch and you can’t stop thinking: what’s wrong with this guy? He has lots of freedom yet all he does is… this?

I don’t know. It seems like no one will make Burberry great again. Big names, but after CB everyone flops.

Also, I feel they need to think longterm. Someone like Kim Jones will bring them hype for a few seasons, will burn the brand with logos and then the void (like Valentino said).

 

[Wombat]

^Yep, it is interesting that some think Burberry's problem was just the price rises done by Jonathan Akeroyd... it really wasn't.

If it was just the price rises that made Burberry flop, we'd have a very small bunch of well-off people walking around with Lee's Burberry designs.

Instead, 2 years after his appointment I have not seen one person firsthand, in the whole of Australia, wearing his designs. The only Burberry items worn on the streets here are still classic Burberry items (like the coat and scarf). Lee's Burberry was simply not desirable to the traditional Burberry customer - yes, the price rises did not help at all but when a product is desirable enough (e.g. the Birkin), consumers will pay to obtain it.

As much as other members love to paint it as though Lee's Burberry was creative and full of innovation/would've been perfect at a lower price point, I strongly disagree. If that was the case, the following would have occurred:

1) A very small number of well-off people would've loved and worn Lee's Burberry designs, finding it worth the money
2) The majority of fashion lovers would've talked more about it and it would've been "coveted", similar to Miu Miu's relatively recent rise in popularity in the younger consumers
3) Products in Burberry's mid-season sales would've sold quickly due to the desirability being there and the price now relatively affordable

Instead, Burberry has largely slipped off the radar, no one is talking about it unless they already loved the brand beforehand, and a large majority of Lee's Burberry is now on sale in SSENSE for over 50% off - and it is not selling at over 50% off either.

The majority of the products were simply not desirable enough to the target market.

We are talking about the luxury goods market, one of the few segments where consumers are the least price sensitive. Yes, Burberry did not have the brand image to support such price rises but that also suggests that Lee's Burberry was not that desirable to begin with, if no one was buying it.

 

[j02215]

I liked when Marc at LV or even Tom at Gucci both had first shows that missed the mark, they completely got the assignment in the next shows and turned the faith of both brand around for the better and the rest is history.

CD´s forget that fashion is also about reacting to our times/feedback of the clients or fans etc.

Mr Lee was too stubborn when he still had the freedom to course direct the brand with more solid base of classic modern burberry with less jarring design & styling choices.

just too much over design and prints.

This is such a good analysis. Other CDs with the similar attitude include: AM, SDS, PPP, and Demna…and I agree with all their firings (or hopefully firing eventually).

In contrast, even Hedi responded to the times and feedbacks at Celine (looking at his initial shows vs pandemic era), JG did so at margiela, and Jonathan Anderson’s initial Loewe collections targeted a much more mature audience vs now. There are ways to maintain your creative integrity while being responsive to the customers and times.

The danger and lasting legacy of DL, AM, SDS, PPP and Demna is that it has created the narrative and legitimized (falsely) the trends that the CEOs need to step in and control creative direction/brand images…it really does not bode well for creativity in the coming years.

 

[Thefrenchy]

I just think he's the kind of creative director that you don't put at a "commercial" house. In the end, he was the wrong pick. People are quick to forget that CDs get hired by doing a project for the brand they're in process with. Burberry knew where they were going when they signed him. They thought that "edgier" approach would work by rising prices to create a smoke screen to pretend they were playing now in a different league. Their plan failed miserably because potential clients didn't see the point of buying Burberry at that price tag, and their existing customers were not happy about the product nor the price increase either.

What I'm told from people directly linked to the matter is that, allegedly, everyone's being cut off from having meetings with him. Only a very limited amount of people get access to him (per suits decisions), and that he has very little involvement in all the new imagery that's getting released. Everything gets signed off by the Marketing department, not by him. People who followed him from Bottega to Burberry are said to be really pissed off about the whole thing.

I don't blame Daniel Lee for wanting to stick to what he believes in, and what his signature is. I do hope he learns his lesson though, and that wherever he goes next he realises that he can only make it work at a very specific type of houses where a strong creative approach is valued and necessary for the brand's appeal. Loewe could have worked, alas it's too BV adjacent for him.

 

[proseccotabis]

Instead, Burberry has largely slipped off the radar, no one is talking about it unless they already loved the brand beforehand, and a large majority of Lee's Burberry is now on sale in SSENSE for over 50% off - and it is not selling at over 50% off either.

If it was just the price rises that made Burberry flop, we'd have a very small bunch of well-off people walking around with Lee's Burberry designs.

good points. This was something I didn't want to admit to myself. lol

What I'm told from people directly linked to the matter is that, allegedly, everyone's being cut off from having meetings with him.

Everything gets signed off by the Marketing department, not by him.

This was the case in Bottega too, I hear.

 

[Thefrenchy]

This was the case in Bottega too, I hear.

Re: everything getting signed off by Marketing, from what I was told, it was the opposite at Bottega actually. Allegedly, he decided of every single thing happening, which led to him having a very very strained relationship with the execs who I assume felt excluded from decision making.

 

[proseccotabis]

Re: everything getting signed off by Marketing, from what I was told, it was the opposite at Bottega actually. Allegedly, he decided of every single thing happening, which led to him having a very very strained relationship with the execs who I assume felt excluded from decision making.

Maybe our sources were in the company at different times perhaps. but the part that execs could not stand his attitude at one point was when it all started falling apart, yes

 

[Thefrenchy]

the part that execs could not stand his attitude at one point was when it all started falling apart, yes

Yeah that's a big part of what triggered the whole very quick exit... People love to think there is a scandal that justifies his exit, but from what I'm told it's all an internal war of egos and he lost.

In the end, it played out well for MB who was able to witness what *not* to do in order to get and keep the job...

 

[proseccotabis]

Yeah that's a big part of what triggered the whole very quick exit... People love to think there is a scandal that justifies his exit, but from what I'm told it's all an internal war of egos and he lost.

In the end, it played out well for MB who was able to witness what *not* to do in order to get and keep the job...

Exactly
The whole thing that Louis Pisano was circulating on twitter isn't true

You probably know MB was ecstatic when DL was booted out