Hedi Slimane Portrays Doherty as Poet and Outstanding Performer

[SiennaInLondon]

Sounds interesting. Sure Slimane appears a bit too much obsessed with Doherty, but i think modern culture hasnt seen a figure like him for a while. Its fascinating to see how people react to him today, although he seems to have read the romantic rock'n'roll stereotype bible. Personally i find him refreshing in so many ways, and whilst his life may appear to be "wasting" away its his to live.

I know! It is a thin line between refreshing and cliched for him but he walks the right side of it due to his sheer talent and charisma. Nothing more or less.

 

[SiennaInLondon]

Hear hear!

Hedi should stick to designing and photographing hehe.

I don't see how this could possibly inspire a generation?

http://nw.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=76612


He gets publicity because he always kisses and tells about his relationship with Kate. She is so private, which makes him all the more interesting. Somewhat fame-whorish if you ask me

Fame whorish -yes maybe. It and talent aren't mutually exclusive though. As for that photo... I don't see how these could inspire a generation but they did didn't they?

....Plus come on he is HOT! I can't understand how everyone doesn't see it

 

[brian]

My god! I thought Hedi Slimane was a man of good taste!

...why?

 

[Fixyfantastica]

Do you really doubt then, that people wouldn't have said the same thing about the Pistols once upon a time?

I do suggest that. Doherty is not doing anything groundbreaking. The pistols revolutionised the punk scene, they created a phenomenon.

There is nothing clever about drugs full stop but one aspect of someone's life does not always affect all other aspects. Behind stupid when it comes to drugs does not make him musically incompetant. I really can't see the link

It makes him musically incompetant when he cannot sing properly becuase he is close to collapse on the stage or even worse when he cannot turn up to do the job that his label pay him to do. I know Doherty's manager and therefore know how frustrating it is for all concerned when the circus literally cannot come to town.

I'm afraid that when i see Doherty perform I am not struck by his 'charm'. I think that as a fan you are trying to see something in him that you can admire. I understand music perfectly well as well and work in the industry as a promotor and A&R. The reason that Doherty has managed to carve a living out of music is namely due to the tabloids. His latest album is rushed and sloppy throughout the majority. It is thoughtless and shows that Doherty is now basing his career on the influence of his relationships and 'infamous' persona. We do not live in a culture any longer where drugs are taken by the glorious few in the music industry who can afford the coke at 100 quid a pop. We live in a society whereby it should not be okay to be able to perform obviously off your head. I would not dream of allowing a band to play to 14 year olds at my club if the lead singer was in the state that Doherty is, and as a result i would not even think about putting on BS.

 

[tastes_like_chic]

Fame whorish -yes maybe. It and talent aren't mutually exclusive though. As for that photo... I don't see how these could inspire a generation but they did didn't they?


....Plus come on he is HOT! I can't understand how everyone doesn't see it

Yeah I see your point, but each of thos three has something about them.

Mick Jagger - he has charisma, regardless of his skinny-ness and large mouth... not to mention he is dynamite on stage (back in the day).

Sid - he helped start a rebellion with music and fashion... I guess to many around the world, the Sex Pistols were nothing that they'd ever seen before - they were a curiosity.

Janis Joplin - drank like a man, lived like a man. She was a definitive part of feminism I believe. She's very liberated.

But Pete Doherty... I just will never see it

 

[oanadobre]

Sienna, please credit the pictures.

 

[RobbertJan]

Yeah I see your point, but each of thos three has something about them.

Mick Jagger - he has charisma, regardless of his skinny-ness and large mouth... not to mention he is dynamite on stage (back in the day).

Sid - he helped start a rebellion with music and fashion... I guess to many around the world, the Sex Pistols were nothing that they'd ever seen before - they were a curiosity.

Janis Joplin - drank like a man, lived like a man. She was a definitive part of feminism I believe. She's very liberated.

But Pete Doherty... I just will never see it

i'm sorry for reviving this thread but i just had to comment when i read this cause i can't believe how you can possibly be positive about sid vicious and sort of flame pete doherty, it's just so incredibly ignorant......

sid vicious was a stupid idiot who couln't even play an instrument. he was a pathetic loser and did all the '' outrageous'' stuff mclaren told him to do, so it was easier to turn the pistols into a huge hype. sid then got so stoned in his hotelroom that is girlfriend ended up dead, so i think the world is really a better place without him.
there only ever was one sex pistol, john lydon. he proved he had a musical vision and didn't care about the hype and mclaren with Pil's metal box.

pete doherty is an extremely talented songwriter and responsible for some of the best songs of the last decade. together with carl barat he revived the uk guitar rock scene and every band that's become populair since are in his debt. he was the ultimate libertine. he cared about his fans with the impromptu gigs in the albion rooms and the brilliant live performances.

for all those reasons it is very, very sad that he turned into a junkie. it is nowadays a suprise when he does turn up for a gig, and when he does they usually suck. although a lot of stuff that is written about him in the tabloids is not true or exagerrated he still needs help. the little signs of his brilliance that are shown every once in a while only emphasise what he could do with his music. those signs in my opinion are f*ck forever and a little less but still albion and killamangiro on the further bad babyshambles record.

but to conclude, even if he'll never make a great album he will leave the world with 2 of the best albums of all time + some additional brilliant songs, a major influence on the music scene of the 21 century and a true libertine (2002-2004).

ps about the american who said that he/she had never heard of pete: that says a lot more about you then about pete........

 

[Bella Plum]

Lately Pete has become a cartoon character that the tabloids have created, but they never write about the brilliance of his music, Albion, or everyone he has inspired, because that won't sell very many papers. I'm glad that Hedi sees that side of Pete.

RobbertJam you're right the Sex Pistols really could not back up their behavior with their music unlike Pete can.

 

[SiennaInLondon]

But then again I have NEVER heard anybody, tabloids or whomever, doubt that he is a brilliant brilliant songwriter. And it says a lot about your talent when even your most ardent critics avoid condemning it.

In response to Robbert, I am reaching the stage where if you offered me Dirty Pretty Things, Babyshambles, The Libertines and Yeti, I would pick Babyshambles. Shocking I know but in terms of the released material, the Libertines sound was more commercial than Babyshambles. The Shambles take what the Libertines did best and made it purer. If you add the bands up, you basically get the Libertines. Carl and Gary have the rock element, Yeti has that distinctive bass and Babyshambles... they sound like a bunch of eighteenth century troubadours, going from town to town and earning their crust (modern day version: drug money) with their talent honed on the streets of London. I have seen them live a few times and they (I say they, I mean him) have that spark still. A spark that Carl, much as I love him, doesn't. He looks tired and I worry about him more than I worry about Peter because as the one with the alcohol problem and the smashing-face-againt-sink problem -he is one with the depression. I just don't know...

Lets not pretend that Shambles is Peter's drug band. Yes it is his denial band but he was seriously off his face whilst making Up The Bracket and that is the dream we bought into.

And yes there is A LOT of ignorance about Sid Vicious. Let us not forget that the Sex Pistols, as fun as they are, were a MANUFACTURED BAND. No more no less. And the Libs are as far from that as you can possibly get.

 

[tastes_like_chic]

i'm sorry for reviving this thread but i just had to comment when i read this cause i can't believe how you can possibly be positive about sid vicious and sort of flame pete doherty, it's just so incredibly ignorant......

I was not necessarily positive, I was stating FACTS. Sid Vicious was almost a first... no one had seen performers like the Sex Pistols berfore... someone who couldn't exactly play an instrument but still captured the curiosity of many people.
The Sex Pistols started a movement - despite not being that great in the singing/songwriting (IMO) department....

I don't doubt Pete Doherty has some kind of talent (just by someone willing to call me ignorant because I am not inspired by him), but his problems over-ride that now.

Don't call me ignorant, just because I don't worship what Pete Doherty COULD HAVE been doesn't mean I am clueless.

Keep your insults to yourself.

 

[tastes_like_chic]

And yes there is A LOT of ignorance about Sid Vicious. Let us not forget that the Sex Pistols, as fun as they are, were a MANUFACTURED BAND. No more no less. And the Libs are as far from that as you can possibly get.

That's what I mean about the Sex Pistols... they were not that talented - but they started a movement - deny it or not.
They are infamous.... And for the record I am not a sex pistols fan.... they are however, a band you think of with the beginnning of punk... the style, lifestyle etc - manufactured or not.

Over and out

 

[Yanka]

Heidi Slimane is a wise man afterall considering hes a crappy designer... Maybe he should just stick to writing.

ok... you've got your own taste and you don't have to like his work but calling Slimane a "crappy" designer is a completely unjustified statement. His clothes are desired by millions of young men, he is admired and respected in the industry. Karl Lagerfeld himself is a fan. I think all these things indicate that objectively he must be pretty good.

 

[RobbertJan]

I was not necessarily positive, I was stating FACTS. Sid Vicious was almost a first... no one had seen performers like the Sex Pistols berfore... someone who couldn't exactly play an instrument but still captured the curiosity of many people.
The Sex Pistols started a movement - despite not being that great in the singing/songwriting (IMO) department....

I don't doubt Pete Doherty has some kind of talent (just by someone willing to call me ignorant because I am not inspired by him), but his problems over-ride that now.

Don't call me ignorant, just because I don't worship what Pete Doherty COULD HAVE been doesn't mean I am clueless.

Keep your insults to yourself.

the way you posted made it seem like you had no idea what you were talking about, because as sienna said pete doherty and the sex pistols, and in particular sid, cannot be compared but for one thing, starting a movement.

the punk movement was new back in the day, and the sex pistols are, arguably, the starters of this movement. but i think the libertines (together with the strokes) are also a great deal responsible for the recent guitar rock revival.

i am a fan of pete's music and how he was a true rock romantic yes, but i definetly don't worship him. as for the could have been, i should have said that differently. he, in my opinion, still is one of the greatest singer/songwriters ever, but i meant to say that it's a shame that he's not gonna put out much good music when he's in a the state he is in now. but i have no doubt that he's going to make a few great albums if he beats the drugs.

 

[RobbertJan]

But then again I have NEVER heard anybody, tabloids or whomever, doubt that he is a brilliant brilliant songwriter. And it says a lot about your talent when even your most ardent critics avoid condemning it.

In response to Robbert, I am reaching the stage where if you offered me Dirty Pretty Things, Babyshambles, The Libertines and Yeti, I would pick Babyshambles. Shocking I know but in terms of the released material, the Libertines sound was more commercial than Babyshambles. The Shambles take what the Libertines did best and made it purer. If you add the bands up, you basically get the Libertines. Carl and Gary have the rock element, Yeti has that distinctive bass and Babyshambles... they sound like a bunch of eighteenth century troubadours, going from town to town and earning their crust (modern day version: drug money) with their talent honed on the streets of London. I have seen them live a few times and they (I say they, I mean him) have that spark still. A spark that Carl, much as I love him, doesn't. He looks tired and I worry about him more than I worry about Peter because as the one with the alcohol problem and the smashing-face-againt-sink problem -he is one with the depression. I just don't know...

Lets not pretend that Shambles is Peter's drug band. Yes it is his denial band but he was seriously off his face whilst making Up The Bracket and that is the dream we bought into.

And yes there is A LOT of ignorance about Sid Vicious. Let us not forget that the Sex Pistols, as fun as they are, were a MANUFACTURED BAND. No more no less. And the Libs are as far from that as you can possibly get.

i know what you mean, it's like when pete plays, and recently often sucks, you still have the feeling that some time during the gig he will do something brilliant, usually f*ck forever, which is already one of the best songs ever written.

for me if i had to pick one, i think i would pick dirty pretty things. i think have a lot of respect for carl and the way he never said a bad thing about pete and kept his dignity. i think waterloo to anywhere is a great album, he shows he's a good songwriter. i especially liked deadwood and you f*cking love it. but it's just a great rock 'n roll record.

 

[tastes_like_chic]

the way you posted made it seem like you had no idea what you were talking about, because as sienna said pete doherty and the sex pistols, and in particular sid, cannot be compared but for one thing, starting a movement.

the punk movement was new back in the day, and the sex pistols are, arguably, the starters of this movement. but i think the libertines (together with the strokes) are also a great deal responsible for the recent guitar rock revival.

i am a fan of pete's music and how he was a true rock romantic yes, but i definetly don't worship him. as for the could have been, i should have said that differently. he, in my opinion, still is one of the greatest singer/songwriters ever, but i meant to say that it's a shame that he's not gonna put out much good music when he's in a the state he is in now. but i have no doubt that he's going to make a few great albums if he beats the drugs.

No harm meant B)
I am glad we are on the same wavelength now

 

[RobbertJan]

^ ok , me to

back on topic, has anyone read/seen the book ? i was thinking about buying it

 

[ultramarine]

^

Good ... this was slowly becoming into a heated (off-topic) discussion ...

Hum ... never heard Pete Doherty's music ... I think he's too new to be compared to such ..let's say ... legends as he has been ... anyhow ... so far I trust on Hedi's taste ..so finally I'll look up his stuff just to be able to say something.

 

[tastes_like_chic]

I quite like Hedi Slimane, he is very in touch with young people.
When Karl Lagerfield guest edited Australian Vogue a couple of years ago, Hedi came and did a photo shoot of some australian people - I really liked it.

 

[PrinceOfCats]

the punk movement was new back in the day, and the sex pistols are, arguably, the starters of this movement. but i think the libertines (together with the strokes) are also a great deal responsible for the recent guitar rock revival.

'Responsible' being the operative word...

Guitar rock

 

[RobbertJan]

haha that's a matter of taste ^