Balenciaga blacklists Vogue Paris?

I feel the opposite of the power Carine has over the fashion industry. Yes she is very known in the fashion world, but it ends there. More people know of Anna, even rappers mention her.

But this is about fashion world.

I actually agree with KhaoticKarma about Carine's influence and that she's aware of it. I also think she new exactly what she was doing when she made that comment. She new people will talk about it and that this story will steal part of the spotlight from collection.

This was a bad move by Balenciaga, it would have been better if they waited to cut their ties with VP after the FW. That way people would be wondering where's Balenciaga in VP (and the collection was great, so people would notice that it's missing) instead of wondering where's Carine at Balenciaga.
 
Definitely a strong statement from both parties. Balenciaga has earned its place in the fashion industry and if they felt the need of blacklisting someone who does not seem appropiate for the show, they are entitled to do so and it's not the first time it happens, look at what they did to Kanye West back in the FW08 season.

It was about time someone put an end to Carine's favoritism and the way she handled it wasn't the most professional.
 
I have a feeling people don't understand Balenciaga as a house. Unlike brands like let's say.... Louis Vuitton and Dior that would gladly wh*re out their products in every single store and in every single department and having itself controlled by buyers, Balenciaga is very selective in how it functions. It almost never lets anyone see its collection before it is actually presented, not to even Anna. Samples are almost never given out. The reason why very little stylists actually touch a Balenciaga garment for editorial usage is because the man who founded the house left such legacy; so personal ties with MA is almost guaranteed and expected.

It's like Yves Saint Laurent in his hay-days, it would be a great honor for magazines to feature his designs. Balenciaga is just that now. VP can happily overstuff their mags with Dior/Chanel couture and ripped Balmain dresses, but will never get the same feeling as the "Balenciaga Mystique".

And like I said, if VP really didn't need Balenciaga in their circulation, then they wouldn't have put the collection on its website. They even have a very nice review of it.
 
Even if Carine gave out too much info, in the end, this reflects badly on Balenciaga. And taking such drastic measures is NOT wise. Presumably, a good amount of Balenciaga's clientele are exactly the type of women who read Vogue Paris, so if I were Nicolas, I would be staying chummy with the magazine as much as possible.

How so? It's not like Balenciaga is some random brand that is desperate for some publicity. It is a historical fashion house so if clients want them, they would go to the store or check the website or something. They wouldn't have the need to buy a magazine.

And it's not like MMA doesn't promote Balenciaga in her work as much as Emmanuelle promotes Marant and Balmain and Carine promotes Givenchy and MaxMara in their work. If the issue stems to consultancy, then this is just plain RIDICULOUS. Advertising and magazines have been joined at the hip since God knows when, so to all of the sudden get in a tizzy about it now is just plain ludicrous!

You are forgetting a couple of points.

1) Marie-Amelie is just a contributing editor at Vogue. She still has to pass through a higher position (Anna Wintour, Franca Sozzani etc.) to do this. Whereas Carine and Emmanuelle can do the hell they want with Givenchy, Balmain and Isabel Marant since they hold the top positions. Ofcourse no one will oppose them if they want these clothes featured in every editorial VP has every month. :innocent: Even if how much Marie-Amelie pumps up Balenciaga, if Anna Wintour says no, it's a no.

2) If you haven't noticed, it's not Marie-Amelie's face (or a Balenciaga outfit for that matter) plastered all over streetstyle blogs (and nowadays, these blogs are a form of publicity/free advertising). I mean, M.A. seems to be low-key when coming to shows which probably explains why she's not photographed left and right wearing Balenciaga/Chloe/Phi whereas VP's entire team not to mention Julia Restoin-Roitfeld...:innocent:
It was about time someone put an end to Carine's favoritism and the way she handled it wasn't the most professional.
I totally agree with this. If the rumors are true, then they are all acting like a cartel and if the Balenciaga marketing team and/or Nicolas G. does not want to get involve with this, it is just right and proper to ban them in my opinion.
 
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we cannot know the whole story here. i don't buy this bologna about balenciaga getting upset at vogue paris over some perceived lack of integrity. taking a step back from fashion, everyone in the world of advertising knows this type of back-scratching goes on ALL THE TIME. there has to be something else bubbling in the stew here. if there's not, then this is a petty display which makes no sense given balenciaga's place in the market. PPR, after all, still retains majority stake in balenciaga. and PPR clearly has no issue with this given the relationship between alt and gucci.
 
...also let's not forget carine's relationship with tom ford's gucci.
 
Was this one posted ?

Balenciaga Banned Carine Roitfeld
3/5/10 at 11:50 AM 38Comments

Photo: Bryan Bedder/Getty Images
Fashion journalists walk a fine line between doing their jobs and not pissing off designers. It's why we, after attending the epic spring 2010 Snuggie fashion show, did not wear the Snuggie in the gift bag to our next show — Rodarte — even though we were dying to experience the hilarity. Labels can threaten to pull advertising or ban editors and writers from shows in exchange for the kind of coverage they want. In many instances they get it. Almost two years ago, Cathy Horyn wrote about being banned from Giorgio Armani's show following a review of a couture collection that didn't sit well with him. She later learned that several of her fellow fashion sisters had been banned as well. Horyn had previously been banned from Dolce & Gabbana, Helmut Lang, and Carolina Herrera, and her 2008 column on the matter remains one of the greatest, most honest articles about the subject.
The latest high-profile ban is rather shocking. Balenciaga has severed ties (undoubtedly temporarily) with French Vogue. Carine Roitfeld and her editors did not attend yesterday's fall 2010 show in Paris.

WWD reports:
“We’re blacklisted,” Roitfeld said with a shrug at Nina Ricci later in the day. “It’s too bad, it’s a beautiful house and it’s French. I hope that it’s not forever.”

Roitfeld added that the label no longer lends them clothes or advertises in the magazine, but did not say what she did to make them so upset. Armani banned Horyn for not writing positive reviews and supposedly making "unnecessarily sarcastic comments" about his friends and family. French Vogue's offense may have been something like breaking up a Balenciaga look. Stylist Venetia Scott spoke not too long ago about the present-day nature of styling for magazines, and how houses often try to forbid magazines from mixing their pieces with those from other labels, which entirely defeats the point of styling.
But in the meantime, who's at a greater loss? Carine or Balenciaga?

http://nymag.com/daily/fashion/2010/03/balenciaga_banned_carine_roitf.html

This last Venetia Scott remark made me think of the long-time running fight btw certain artists and curator (the most famous one being Daniel Buren vs Harald Szeemann, in 1972 - since then, the things haven't changed that much, tbh)
 
Doesn't Balenciaga have an agreement with magazines that states the stylists/editors cannot mix their clothes with other designers? Have you ever seen a Balenciaga look styled with another designer? :unsure:
 
I guess they do indeed prefer a head to toe runway look, but I've seen Balenciaga mixed with other designers frequently (I was just flipping through my latest issue of POP and there's a lot of mixing there)..
 
Someone said some interesting things at The Cut:

That sounds hilarious to me. They want to break away from "whole corrupt system of french vogue" but they have MA Sauvé as a consultant even is she's working on Vogue Italia and Vogue US.

I feel the opposite of the power Carine has over the fashion industry. Yes she is very known in the fashion world, but it ends there. More people know of Anna, even rappers mention her.

And a Balenciaga fashion show is not just any other show. It's probably as covet-able as a Chanel couture show.

yeah, 'cuz rappers have so much fashion credibility.
And I don't think Balenciaga gets as much coverage as Chanel. I mean, people over TFS and who know about fashion knows about Balenciaga. But, everyone knows Chanel, not only people interested in fashion. And let's get serious, many people who have money but no fashion sense will always prefer Chanel over Balenciaga, especially if they don't see the brand in VP.
Anna has power, but Vogue US isn't really about high-fashion anymore. The few issues I have purchased looked more like a classier Cosmo, or Glamour.

And like I said, if VP really didn't need Balenciaga in their circulation, then they wouldn't have put the collection on its website. They even have a very nice review of it.

That's what I call professionalism.
 
....and how houses often try to forbid magazines from mixing their pieces with those from other labels....

This is absurd!If they really have to do this,why don't they simply print HQ runway photos from style.com or catwalking on the magazine?:mellow:Sometimes some people really lost their mind....

:sick:
 
This is absurd!If they really have to do this,why don't they simply print HQ runway photos from style.com or catwalking on the magazine?:mellow:Sometimes some people really lost their mind....

:sick:


I was styling an editorial and was totally forbidden to use Dior by the people from Dior with other labels so go figure
 
The outrage over the Vogue Paris team styling advertisement campaigns is overblown and ridiculous, imo.

Do they threaten not to feature in their pages brands that don't hire their services?
Is this a racketeering system where they don't actually do the job, just pocket the money?
Do they let advertisers dictate their contents or is it the opposite?
What is actually the morally rotten thing about this?

Yes, I understand there is a internal rule within CN forbidding such business but it seems this rule exist to make sure there will be no favoritism within the pages of the magazine, which in practice is not preventable.
Vogue isn't a catalogue, it's a fashion magazine that will reflect the tastes of their fashion editors and stylist. Whether or not Emmanuel works with Balmain, there will be a lot of Balmain in Vogue Paris, simply because it totally reflects her style and the zeitgeist of the time, so she will select the clothes anyway.
And the Vogue Paris aesthetics are so pervasive anyway that you're bound to see their influence in advertising. They might as well do some of the jobs themselves. Who cares?

As long as they don't wilfully compromise the quality of their magazine for personal gain and continue to feature brands with whom they have no commercial affiliations, I can't see what's so corrupt about it.
Corruption, to me would be more akin to Anna Wintour maneuvering to ban Alaia from a retrospective about Models as Muses because she and her magazine have a personal beef against him. Now that's rotten.

I certainly hope the rift isn't about such a petty reason especially considering how long and how enthusiastically Vogue Paris has supported Ghesquiere.
 
Vogue isn't a catalogue, it's a fashion magazine that will reflect the tastes of their fashion editors and stylist. Whether or not Emmanuel works with Balmain, there will be a lot of Balmain in Vogue Paris, simply because it totally reflects her style and the zeitgeist of the time, so she will select the clothes anyway.
And the Vogue Paris aesthetics are so pervasive anyway that you're bound to see their influence in advertising. They might as well do some of the jobs themselves. Who cares?

As long as they don't wilfully compromise the quality of their magazine for personal gain and continue to feature brands with whom they have no commercial affiliations, I can't see what's so corrupt about it.

Sorry, but I find that a bit naive...you can't really imagine a scenario like that because actually Emmanuelle Alt herself is pretty much responsible for the entire success of Balmain. On top of that, should a stylist only create editorials with outfits that he or she'd wear herself or that suit her own style? I don't think so. I think the best stylist can step aside and create a story, a mood, which is not depending on their own personal style (look at Grace Coddington, Jane How, Olivier Rizzo, Panos Yiapanis)

With Emmanuelle for instance, there's not a great difference between her commercial work (so styling for Balmain, Marant), her editorial work and her own personal style...it all sort of looks the same.
When brands hire her to style their campaign or runway show, they can be pretty sure she will use their stuff in the magazine all the time so it means even extra visibility for them. And in the meanwhile, she'll make sure to send them an invoice...

And I also think they have already compromised on the quality of the magazine....a while ago already. Because the pages are full with Balmain, Givenchy and some huge advertisers, it leaves very little room for independent and/or younger designers who are sometimes very talented (Dries van Noten, Ann Demeulmeester, Haider Ackermann, some London designers etc.)
 
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Sorry, but I find that a bit naive...you can't really imagine a scenario like that because actually Emmanuelle Alt herself is pretty much responsible for the entire success of Balmain. On top of that, should a stylist only create editorials with outfits that he or she'd wear herself or that suit her own style? I don't think so. I think the best stylist can step aside and create a story, a mood, which is not depending on their own personal style (look at Grace Coddington, Jane How, Olivier Rizzo, Panos Yiapanis)

With Emmanuelle for instance, there's not a great difference between her commercial work (so styling for Balmain, Marant), her editorial work and her own personal style...it all sort of looks the same.
When brands hire her to style their campaign or runway show, they can be pretty sure she will use their stuff in the magazine all the time so it means even extra visibility for them. And in the meanwhile, she'll make sure to send them an invoice...

And I also think they have already compromised on the quality of the magazine....a while ago already. Because the pages are full with Balmain, Givenchy and some huge advertisers, it leaves very little room for independent and/or younger designers who are sometimes very talented (Dries van Noten, Ann Demeulmeester, Haider Ackermann, some London designers etc.)

I think that is par for the course, and as far as I'm concerned, the same could be said for Marie Amelie and Balenciaga, or for Brana Wolf and Versace, or for Panos and Givenchy. It's there, and it always have been, perhaps now people notice it a bit more due to the explosion of stylists/editors as the new celebrities. It should also be said that the brands they consult for are actually advertisers, and will ultimately end up in the magazine.

As far as the huge advertisers flooding the pages of the magazines, just look through every other magazine. I'm not saying that it is right that advertisers dictate what goes in the magazines, but it doesn't seem to be changing anytime soon. It's tough to call Vogue Paris out on an issue like that, when pretty much every major magazine operates in the same way (in terms of advertisers).
 
I think that is par for the course, and as far as I'm concerned, the same could be said for Marie Amelie and Balenciaga, or for Brana Wolf and Versace, or for Panos and Givenchy. It's there, and it always have been, perhaps now people notice it a bit more due to the explosion of stylists/editors as the new celebrities. It should also be said that the brands they consult for are actually advertisers, and will ultimately end up in the magazine.

As far as the huge advertisers flooding the pages of the magazines, just look through every other magazine. I'm not saying that it is right that advertisers dictate what goes in the magazines, but it doesn't seem to be changing anytime soon. It's tough to call Vogue Paris out on an issue like that, when pretty much every major magazine operates in the same way (in terms of advertisers).

You are right about this but as someone mentioned before, Marie Amelie isn't exclusively attached to one single publication, nor is Panos (not sure about Brana Wolf)

And Balmain by the way, is a very small (and relatively new) advertiser in VP (compared to the likes of Chanel, Vuitton etc), I think they have one or two ads per year in the magazine.

In the end, you are right about the business and how things go. It's just that VP is doing it in a very obvious way...
And the thing that bothers me specifically is that someone high up at Conde Nast France stated there's no such thing as Emmannuelle en Carine doing commercial styling jobs.
 
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omg drama!
interesting stuff written here, all is coming out!
 
Sorry, but I find that a bit naive...you can't really imagine a scenario like that because actually Emmanuelle Alt herself is pretty much responsible for the entire success of Balmain.
Of course, I wasn't being literal. The point was that Balmain is in Vogue because it reflects Emmanuel taste, not because she really hates the clothes but they slipped her a big fat check to bribe her into featuring them anyway.
On top of that, should a stylist only create editorials with outfits that he or she'd wear herself or that suit her own style? I don't think so.
I was talking about taste, not personal style, though with Emmanuelle the distinction is pointless.
The point is stylists are hired for their taste, so of course their work will reflect it.
When brands hire her to style their campaign or runway show, they can be pretty sure she will use their stuff in the magazine all the time so it means even extra visibility for them. And in the meanwhile, she'll make sure to send them an invoice...
And? What is the difference between what they are doing and what Anna is doing?
She uses her influence to get jobs to designers she likes. Designers notoriously take into account her opinions and sometimes edit their collections accordingly (In September issue, there is a whole passage with Thakoon and Gap illustrating that).
All fashion houses know that pleasing Anna means space in Vogue US.
The only difference I see here is money. Personally I have no issue with the Vogue girls getting paid for a job they actually do.
And as I already said, they also feature brands they don't work with, if that means a good fashion story. They are probably the magazine that feature the most Alaia and the guy doesn't advertise. That have supported Balenciaga from the beginning of Nicolas' tenure even when the brand didn't advertise much (or at all), etc.
And I also think they have already compromised on the quality of the magazine....a while ago already. Because the pages are full with Balmain, Givenchy and some huge advertisers, it leaves very little room for independent and/or younger designers who are sometimes very talented (Dries van Noten, Ann Demeulmeester, Haider Ackermann, some London designers etc.)
As opposed to what mainstream fashion magazine?
Pleasing big advertisers is a reality all mainstream magazines have to face in order to survive. The trick is to do that while still remaining creative and keeping an identity (I don't know about creativity recently but Vogue Paris certainly has a strong identity). Whatever you might say about what Carine and co are doing at the moment, their love of fashion is undeniable.

Personally I am not too found of the recent direction Vogue Paris has recently taken. But to me this is just an unpleasent fashion moment and not symtomatic of a corrupt system.

PS: Carine's remark doesn't come off as someone egotriping (since when is Carine known as an egomaniac?), but rather as the reflection of a fashion editor who is frustrated and upset that her magazine has lost access to one of the most exiting fashion brand around. I would be upset too. The girl loves fashion.
 
Anna at the very least gives the younger generation of designers a chance to succeed, even if they have no money to shell out as bribes.

Remember that documentary about Carine and the French editors not caring at all about smaller fashion houses? I wonder if that could be part of the corruption and Balenciaga finally calling it out. :innocent:

no money = no chance to be in VP
 

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