Bottega Veneta F/W 2024.25 Milan

[Lorenzogi]

And you will get even sicker of it, because it still is ahead of its time and there will be still much more of it, you can't even imagine.

No, it is just stuck in time. i will always prefer Tomas Maier's sophisticated Bottega.

 

[Kanzai]

And you will get even sicker of it, because it still is ahead of its time and there will be still much more of it, you can't even imagine.

Well it's all about our taste. Minimalism wise, i would rather see Helmut aesthetic in Bottega

 

[philophile]

No, it is just stuck in time. i will always prefer Tomas Maier's sophisticated Bottega.

Yeah, Tomas Maier is so revolutionary that his Bottega is the one everyone copies nowadays. I did moderately liked his brand some years ago, but mostly it was bland at best.

 

[Living Proof]

Idk, I find the endless “I miss how things were 10-15 years ago” on this forum more tiring tbh.

While he doesn’t put on the most captivating shows, the products are simply brilliant. He just understands desirability, from the clothes to the fanzines to the little VIP gifts. Everything I’ve bought from BV these past 2 years I wear to absolute shreds. But like someone mentioned here, the sizing of their menswear stays problematic. Who are these giants shopping at BV?

 

[philophile]

Well it's all about our taste. Minimalism wise, i would rather see Helmut aesthetic in Bottega

Helmut is an amazing aesthetic, but it's not Bottega. It's wayy too sexy and subversive for such a refined brand. New bottega has hit the nail on the head, it's the perfect mixture of elegance and feminine defined sexiness.

 

[MulletProof]

I always love his “moving” dresses

Moving anything in general is always so fun! this one? if it stays still it's horrendous but in motion? gi-ve-me!

I kind of like this.. just because it's soo easy to like, store easy (grab and go). It's like a compilation of everything one likes now (Phoebe included, duh), or already has (I spot my Lemaire khaki boots there, and not too happy!), but with some variation just to make the purchase even easier. There's hardly anything with the intention of impressing someone or moving fashion forward, which imo should be important for these events (fashion design week), but hey, who even cares about unveiling new ideas anymore? gotta get an A+ from the suits!

I actually think Imaan looks gorgeous in that look. Imagine seeing her in that on the street, I'd airdrop her my résumé. 🤣

 

[Lorenzogi]

Yeah, Tomas Maier is so revolutionary that his Bottega is the one everyone copies nowadays. I did moderately liked his brand some years ago, but mostly it was bland at best.

Executing dresses impossible to emulate is a sign of success, in my opinion. Who gets satisfaction out of being easily cloned by Zara ?

 

[susseinmcswanny]

Seriously? What else do you expect? They (he and Lee) both worked for old Céline

I feel like that isn't a good excuse. You can learn from someone and use the knowledge you've gained from them while making your work distinctly your own (i.e. Warhol/Basquiat, Klimt/Schiele). But I think the aesthetic of the brand has more to do with the direction from those above Blazy anyways. He's a fantastic designer who's proven himself to be able to design through the lenses of different styles. It's just been years upon years of this Phoebe stuff from brands all over. I don't expect radical things from Bottega but I just wish to see a little shakeup one day.

 

[susseinmcswanny]

Then again, if I had to choose between staying with Phoebe versus another shakeup along the lines of a Demna-like person happening again I will choose the generic Phoebe aesthetic any day. It just hit me as so repetitive today 😴

 

[MulletProof]

^ Phoebe stans coming for your hair in 4...3....2...

 

[philophile]

Executing dresses impossible to emulate is a sign of success, in my opinion. Who gets satisfaction out of being easily cloned by Zara ?

Maybe you're right, but in all honesty, Zara can't clone the most eye-catching minimalist pieces to save its life. It's sad that a lot of people have it wrong in this forum and give too much credit to Zara, because it has always copied the most eye-catching minimalist pieces, but super badly. Zara could never imitate structure, it could never accurately duplicate special cuts. But just because something is superficially easily to imitate, doesn't discredit the original design, especially when the quality isn't there. If I ever buy anything from Zara, it better be tailored trousers or something of the sort, but I would never, ever buy a dupe.

 

[susseinmcswanny]

^ Phoebe stans coming for your hair in 4...3....2...

It's not my fault it's not my fault

 

[philophile]

I feel like that isn't a good excuse. You can learn from someone and use the knowledge you've gained from them while making your work distinctly your own (i.e. Warhol/Basquiat, Klimt/Schiele). But I think the aesthetic of the brand has more to do with the direction from those above Blazy anyways. He's a fantastic designer who's proven himself to be able to design through the lenses of different styles. It's just been years upon years of this Phoebe stuff from brands all over. I don't expect radical things from Bottega but I just wish to see a little shakeup one day.

I think you cropped out a piece of my comment that was very relevant: These old Céline designers actually revived Bottega Veneta with its aesthetics. I do agree that you should use your knowlege gained from a teacher and make it work distinctively on your own. But Bottega has never been about that.

 

[Kanzai]

^^^About 10 years ago, BV was closer to Hermes than ever. But since Daniel Lee arrived, the brand has become something completely different. Blazy comes to harmonize it, reminding a bit of the brand's original luxury. Blazy is the guy who knows how to seize opportunities, the Quiet luxury trend has made this brand more popular than ever.

But so what, can this over intellectual aesthetic really last for the brand? idk. Bottega's original loyal customers don't need these things, old Celine customers will go to Phoebe brand. All I see from Blazy is the everlasting inconsistency and generality

 

[Lorenzogi]

Maybe you're right, but in all honesty, Zara can't clone the most eye-catching minimalist pieces to save its life. It's sad that a lot of people have it wrong in this forum and give too much credit to Zara, because it has always copied the most eye-catching minimalist pieces, but super badly. Zara could never imitate structure, it could never accurately duplicate special cuts. But just because something is superficially easily to imitate, doesn't discredit the original design, especially when the quality isn't there. If I ever buy anything from Zara, it better be tailored trousers or something of the sort, but I would never, ever buy a dupe.

Okay, as you also mentioned Daniel Lee, should Burberry also be adapting the Céline aesthetic now ?
Are we talking about brand revivals or brand renewals? Reviving Céline to renew Bottega and Burberry?

 

[philophile]

Okay, as you also mentioned Daniel Lee, should Burberry also be adapting the Céline aesthetic now ?
Are we talking about brand revivals or brand renewals? Reviving Céline to renew Bottega and Burberry?

In all honesty, Burberry is kind of an adaptation of the Céline aesthetic nowadays. That's the only reason I like it.
It's not exactly a brand revival, since I do believe both Lee and Blazy were key to Phoebe's Céline success. She just had a great team, and whilst she was always an amazing designer and a visionary, she didn't do it all by herself. I believe her team has a merit in their own right.

And super yes, Bottega has all been about an old Céline revival since they hired Lee. Ask anyone.

 

[Olaffo]

Imho the weakest offering so far, Blazy is running in cycles, no new silhouettes, menswear so predictable it is painful to watch, non existent apart from few looks that turned out to be literally copied from Lee's fall 2020 collection. All looks like we've already seen it in previous seasons, most interesting accessories were the glass cactuses in the background...

 

[Lorenzogi]

In all honesty, Burberry is kind of an adaptation of the Céline aesthetic nowadays. That's the only reason I like it.
It's not exactly a brand revival, since I do believe both Lee and Blazy were key to Phoebe's Céline success. She just had a great team, and whilst she was always an amazing designer and a visionary, she didn't do it all by herself. I believe her team has a merit in their own right.

And super yes, Bottega has all been about an old Céline revival since they hired Lee. As

In all honesty, Burberry is kind of an adaptation of the Céline aesthetic nowadays. That's the only reason I like it.
It's not exactly a brand revival, since I do believe both Lee and Blazy were key to Phoebe's Céline success. She just had a great team, and whilst she was always an amazing designer and a visionary, she didn't do it all by herself. I believe her team has a merit in their own right.

And super yes, Bottega has all been about an old Céline revival since they hired Lee. Ask anyone.

I'm sure your beloved Phoebe would rather you bought her own current merchandise. 😁

 

[philophile]

I'm sure your beloved Phoebe would rather you bought her own current merchandise. 😁

If you don't like her, I respect it. However, you should be a bit more tolerant of other people's tastes. I like her own brand, but she had a team behind Céline, which is why I like it best. Now, if you mind, I'll go on loving what I love and commenting on it, rather than commenting on what I hate (and that's the biggest part of fashion nowadays, we need more fun minimalism).

 

[Lorenzogi]

If you don't like her, I respect it. However, you should be a bit more tolerant of other people's tastes. I like her own brand, but she had a team behind Céline, which is why I like it best. Now, if you mind, I'll go on loving what I love and commenting on it, rather than commenting on what I hate (and that's the biggest part of fashion nowadays, we need more fun minimalism).

I was trying to look from Phoebe's angle. Would you like it if your fans appreciated your imitators?
This is not about Phoebe - this is about Bottega, not an ersatz Céline. Bye.