The Business of Magazines

[octoberchild]

^NOPE. Anna and her stans have both anointed her the most important person in fashion and beyond reproach. If you want that mantle you have to take all that comes with it. The good and the bad. I don’t see why Anna should be treated any differently then the other people who are now being held accountable for their bad deeds.

Condé Nast, according to that NYT article, appears to still be holding on to the sinking ship - appears to. But the article was damning. Openly acknowledging how it’s still hard for black women to land a Vogue cover. In 2020. Pulling receipts on assistants - a Princeton educated daughter of an Oscar winner is almost a parody of the privileged white women who work at Vogue. And that last quote from ALT about Anna not giving up her white privilege - damning but absolutely true.

And there’s more articles like that to come. Like, what would happen if it leaked that Anna offered one of the many black women she’s ignored over the years a cover and they declined? The press would be awful. Hearst has Glenda they can throw under the bus for their lack of inclusivity. Condé doesn’t.

ETA: if she does go, Friday (not necessarily tomorrow) is likely. Condé Nast can break the news ala a Friday night news dump. Won’t work but they can try.

Anna’s about to lose her job!

 

[MON]

If we all want to do better, may we all also call out:

Masha Fedorova of Vogue Russia
Emmanuelle Alt of Vogue Paris
Eugenia de la Torriente of Vogue Espana
Emanuele Farneti of Vogue Italia
Thaleia Karafyllidou of Vogue Greece
Richard Dennen of Tatler

Demands for inclusivity must be across the board. Change has to come from the top down.

 

[vogue28]

If Anna Wintour was to leave Vogue after every piece of bad press, she would've resigned in the 90s. While I absolutely do not condone inappropriate behavior within the work place and completely stand for inclusivity, I very much doubt we'll be getting a resignation from Anna.

I do, however, think we'll be getting a far more diverse American Vogue as we move forward - far more diverse than what we've witnessed over recent years (like the likes of Lupita Nyong'o and Zendaya getting covers). Might be too little too late, but I got the sense from Anna's apology statement that she's willing to change for the better. Guess only time will tell.

 

[mikel]

The most vocal of the Vogue whistleblowers, the one who called working at Vogue the most miserable experience of her life, etc. used to post frequently about how blessed she was to work there, She talked about how much she was learning on the job after coming to it with limited experience, how happy she was with changing culture at Condé Nast. She interned there, then came back 5 years later as a salaried employee and said it was a dream come true. A few years later her story seems quite different. I’m sure the receipts are easy enough to find to back up what I’m saying.

So let me get this straight. All the people who speak up about their racist experiences now, their experiences are to be questioned (and are invalid) just because before all of this they didn’t complain, or perhaps didn’t feel safe to share or simply were trying to fit in the system?

 

[MON]

So let me get this straight. All the people who speak up about their racist experiences now, their experiences are to be questioned (and are invalid) just because before all of this they didn’t complain, or perhaps didn’t feel safe to share or simply were trying to fit in the system?

The problem is, they made prior inconsistent statements. I think what KINGofVERSAILLES is saying is that we should take these allegations with a grain of salt.

These however do not discount the fact that something may have happened from the time they made those statements up to the moment they left. However, it is just hard to take these statements as absolute truth.

Not complaining, didn't feel safe to share negative experience, fitting in is very much different from categorically lauding your job, then dragging it after you left.

 

[mikel]

The problem is, they made prior inconsistent statements. I think what KINGofVERSAILLES is saying is that we should take these allegations with a grain of salt.

These however do not discount the fact that something may have happened from the time they made those statements up to the moment they left. However, it is just hard to take these statements as absolute truth.

Not complaining, didn't feel safe to share negative experience, fitting in is very much different from categorically lauding your job, then dragging it after you left.

Valid points, I won’t deny that. But when it comes to these matters I’m willing to give her the benefit of the doubt. And what may seem as categorically lauding your job to outsiders, may very well be just a way for someone to fit in.

 

[KoV]

So let me get this straight. All the people who speak up about their racist experiences now, their experiences are to be questioned (and are invalid) just because before all of this they didn’t complain, or perhaps didn’t feel safe to share or simply were trying to fit in the system?

It’s not a matter of did they speak up earlier or did they complain earlier. People keep quiet about their own traumatic experiences for many reasons and “why did it take you so long to come forward” is not a valid question, in my opinion. However if it’s the case that they had made specific comments on a public platform, and then later made contradictory statements, I do think it's fair to consider both before you start sacking people. As far as the white ex-employees speaking up, I haven't seen them getting posted by Diet Prada, etc. and I don't feel like hunting all over twitter. The one thread I did read of a white person speaking up was someone who'd worked at UK Vogue, though I believe she just said "Vogue" in her tweets. Her complaints involved being bullied about her Chanel bag and her Miu Miu clothes. No, I don't take that seriously.

And the thing is, I don't think in the case of the whistle-blower I mentioned earlier, that it's an outright lie, I think it's mostly that the last several years have changed perspective. What was deemed a step forward in 2016 is deemed several steps behind in 2020. "Conde Nasty" was addressing the issue of workplace diversity and she specifically praised them for the positive changes she could see had taken place in the five year interim between stints working for the company. Perhaps at the time she was thrilled to be a part of that change, but now can see it wasn't being done with enough transparency and the changes were too slow. I don't know. Can't both be true? Why only accept the negative half of what she said?

Can a well-intentioned person be encouraged to continue making strides forward, acknowledging they aren't where they need to be yet but accepting their promise to continue, to do better? Isn't that basically what's being asked of privileged people in this moment? Not to f*ck off and die, but to listen, learn, and do better and if they have the power and platform, lift others up. That's what Anna and I think lots of people within the company are attempting to do. I believe it's genuine. I think Trump's election was a wake up call to people like Anna and they've been trying to make up ground over the past 3 years. That's why 5 (or 6 if you count Kim K, I believe she's Armenian?) POC were on the cover of US Vogue in 2019 and 6 in 2018. I know that's not the same thing as office reform, but it is a clear, major change. I think, like Trump's election, George Floyd's murder is another wake up call. Anna's note was sent out internally over a week ago, 5 days before the BA scandal exploded. I think it was a genuine apology and promise of change based on a desire to be part of the solution, not merely a PR strategy. I think before people start getting sacked, there should be nuanced discussions, not just social media led mob calls for one scapegoat to be fired. I notice no one is calling for the man who wore the chicken outfit to be fired. It's all about Anna, who hasn't even been mentioned by most of the people coming forward (that I've seen).

 

[dodencebt]

Do we really think Conde Nast would get rid of Anna at this moment? I think they need her, and she needs them until this whole thing blows over, a replacement plan is set into motion and she retires (we all know it's going to happen eventually, the woman is 70). I know big name editors like Vreeland and Mirabella were fired in the worst possible way in the past, but Anna has carved a different position for herself at the company. Firing her would be insane if you ask me. I think her exit will be handled like Carter's when the time comes.

 

[MON]

I think her exit will be handled like Carter's when the time comes.

I have a feeling she's waiting for a Biden win, get the ambassador position Hillary allegedly promised her (Hillary is still very influential in the Democratic Party, more so the Biden campaign) and then leave.

 

[Benn98]

The woman installed numerous POC and female editors in the CN stable, pushed for diverse subjects inside and on the cover of Vogue way ahead of other US fashion magazines, just headlined a drive to offer financial support to American designers through the pandemic, managed to set up that iconic moment at LFW with HM, and people think she'll get sacked or fall out of favour because XYZ doesn't have a Vogue cover? LOL.

Yes, imo she should be going because I've not enjoyed a single cover or issue of Vogue this year....

 

[Phuel]

^^^ LOL Didn’t you know only Kerry and this Tracee person are capable of taking Anna down? And the rest of the editors that didn’t give these women a cover must be quaking in the SL boots now...

 

[tipi1355]

Like I said, it seems doubtful to me. I will be absolutely shocked if a resignation from her is announced today or in the next few days or anytime specifically as a result of the current climate. But it was the talk of nearly every fashion media reporter last night on twitter and a few this morning are still alluding to it happening later today.

 

[MissMagAddict]

Anna is already at her house in the Hamptons for the weekend.
I guarantee it.

 

[tipi1355]

Also, sorry to double post but I just don’t see how it’s fair to discount these individuals because ‘well, they said it was a great job before.’ Have you never said publicly that your job was one way while also knowing you suffered in others ways you weren’t comfortable sharing with others? I know as POC I certainly have at multiple jobs in my life. Even now if someone were to ask me about my current job, I might have mostly positive things to say. But it also depends on who’s asking, it depends on if I’m looking for another job and realize speaking ill of my current one could negatively effect me, it depends on if I believe the person really wants or needs to know the gritty details of my experiences. Don’t be quick to discount someone in this instance because of past comments they made. It’s not that simple.

 

[Benn98]

But it was the talk of nearly every fashion media reporter last night on twitter and a few this morning are still alluding to it happening later today.

Who? The style editor from Star magazine?

 

[MissMagAddict]

Who? The style editor from Star magazine?

Hello!

 

[Benn98]

Hello!

LOL!

Tipi, no malice intended, honestly. But over the years I've brought a lot of articles into this thread which swore high and low that she's leaving and each time it proved false. Trust me, she will leave when she's good and ready to.

 

[Miss Dalloway]

If Wintour had any decency, she would resign, and go. But somehow I don't see CN suits allowing for that to happen, she would have to leave on her own accord, and I hope she does!

 

[MissMagAddict]

LOL!

Tipi, no malice intended, honestly. But over the years I've brought a lot of articles into this thread which swore high and low that she's leaving and each time it proved false. Trust me, she will leave when she's good and ready to.

Agreed. I’d really be interested in seeing some of those twitter posts.
I did a search last night and couldn’t find anything even remotely credible.

 

[tipi1355]

As I’ve said a bunch, I don’t believe it to be true. Doesn’t make any sense to me. I’ve also read tons of stories over the years about her being on the outs that have always been false. I, too, believe she’ll leave when she wants. To me this seems like another incident like last year when the rumors swirled and everyone was “so sure” and it turned out to be nothing as always. I think more than anything, people want her out so badly that they hold on to any inkling they hear of that there could be trouble in paradise.